Altmann Tera Player - Page 40  

Not sure if it's been done, but has anyone who really cares actually asked Charles if he's done any tests? It would be better than nothing if he had some. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by TiEx 

 

Than a reasonable question appears. Why Mr. Altman didn't published any measurements if he has spent so much time developing this product. Now don't get me wrong, I did read his DIY blog and all most of his articles including mother of tone and R2R dac explanation. But today audiophiles more often prefer to see measurements of products they are about to buy soon. Don't want to start the debate on how can bias and marketing can have a placebo effect. I do believe that Tera is a good sounding DAP according to many reviews here and there. But it would be nice to see such a technological product to be measured on a precise audio system (not some cheap sound card RMAA tests). Especially if you consider your product a truly hi-fi grade with a steep price tag.

 

Regarding of DX100 and es9018 in general I wasn't referring to whether DX100 is better then Terra. I've tried to explain that DX100 might be far from good regarding es9018 implementation. Also it will be damn hard to make a good and compact es9018 design with a big battery life.

First, I don't complain,...I question & want proof. If you can't provide proof I say you have no grounds to stand on and you're opinion/rock solid facts are flawed and useless.

Second, some here are saying that RMAA testing is flawed? When done correctly it is FAR from flawed. That's why most of us jumped for joy when GSMArena started doing "PROPER" loaded and unloaded testing of cellphones. We got all excited because it's a practical, reliable, and TRUTHFUL way of showing possible customers of a device if the SQ will be great, good, or GARBAGE! Only since the advent of the HiFiMan players have some questioned RMAA - and ONLY to justify their purchase. These were people who used to respect RMAA. Saying it's unreliable is talk out of the incorrect orifice.

iBasso dx100: http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/64592268-post64.html

It's originally from Head-Fi: http://www.head-fi.org/t/583448/ibasso-dx100-reference-dap-es9018-inside/2670#post_8193104

Sell me the player & I'll get in line. That's the job of the creator of the thing - he's only hooked the "blind faith followers". It's like a bloody religious experience,...you make Apple fanboi's look tame. 

Make me want this - show me proof!!!

Interesting you say that about the RMAA tests. But you've basically said you gotta question who's doing the RMAA test as it needs to be done properly. Sounds like RMAA tests not done properly are only good for comparing with other RMAA tests done the exact same way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nywytboy68 

First, I don't complain,...I question & want proof. If you can't provide proof I say you have no grounds to stand on and you're opinion/rock solid facts are flawed and useless.

 

Second, some here are saying that RMAA testing is flawed? When done correctly it is FAR from flawed. That's why most of us jumped for joy when GSMArena started doing "PROPER" loaded and unloaded testing of cellphones. We got all excited because it's a practical, reliable, and TRUTHFUL way of showing possible customers of a device if the SQ will be great, good, or GARBAGE! Only since the advent of the HiFiMan players have some questioned RMAA - and ONLY to justify their purchase. These were people who used to respect RMAA. Saying it's unreliable is talk out of the incorrect orifice.

 

iBasso dx100: http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/64592268-post64.html

 

It's originally from Head-Fi: http://www.head-fi.org/t/583448/ibasso-dx100-reference-dap-es9018-inside/2670#post_8193104

Quote:

Originally Posted by nywytboy68 


No, the dx100 is a quality player plagued by horridly unstable firmware & rediculous overpricing. But, surprise, surprise,,...it's actually pretty solid. This, sadly, is nothing but claims & listening tests with no science to back it up.
You claim you want the best player with the best sound quality. Then get a payer that has testing & user opinions to back it up. This, sadly, isn't for you then. Your chasing the dream,....it's fun but fruitless.

The DX100's firmware is much better than you are giving it credit for. It's long since been stable. Has working tag support, album art and amazing sound quality. Along with RMAA tests to back it up ;). There are a few minor issues left on the firmware yes but not enough to put me off from this great player. IMO it isn't overpriced. Just if you aren't in the market for this type of quality stick with your Sansa Clip and imagine it is the best it will get because in reality that is just a dream. The clip is a good device but in comparison its sound quality is mediocre at best. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nywytboy68 

First, I don't complain,...I question & want proof. If you can't provide proof I say you have no grounds to stand on and you're opinion/rock solid facts are flawed and useless.

 

Second, some here are saying that RMAA testing is flawed? When done correctly it is FAR from flawed. That's why most of us jumped for joy when GSMArena started doing "PROPER" loaded and unloaded testing of cellphones. We got all excited because it's a practical, reliable, and TRUTHFUL way of showing possible customers of a device if the SQ will be great, good, or GARBAGE! Only since the advent of the HiFiMan players have some questioned RMAA - and ONLY to justify their purchase. These were people who used to respect RMAA. Saying it's unreliable is talk out of the incorrect orifice.

 

iBasso dx100: http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/64592268-post64.html

 

It's originally from Head-Fi: http://www.head-fi.org/t/583448/ibasso-dx100-reference-dap-es9018-inside/2670#post_8193104

 

Sell me the player & I'll get in line. That's the job of the creator of the thing - he's only hooked the "blind faith followers". It's like a bloody religious experience,...you make Apple fanboi's look tame. 

 

Make me want this - show me proof!!!

I have to disagree with you to an extent. Measurements are a great thing yes. But that doesn't mean if the device doesn't measure ruler flat that it still won't sound good to our ears. You may be putting too much faith into the measurement although I agree they do have their place. Plus at this price point I would hope the device does measure flat (at this price point that is). The same thing goes for measurements on IEMs/headphones. Some will agree with the graphs and some will not hear them the way the graph says. The EX1000 is a great example of this as most don't hear it the way the graphs says. However I do. Does it make it garbage for everyone because the graph says it is? Nope not at all. It is considered one of the best dynamic universal IEMs out there period. Also keep in mind these people probably aren't audiophiles as you state because in the end the graphs aren't that important to them. The sound is. Audiophiles tend to linger on neutrality and ruler flat frequency responses. I am more concerned about the musical enjoyment I get from the device so in that I'm probably not an audiophile but a music lover. Audiophiles analyze music to find faults, they really aren't listening for musical enjoyment IMO. However I am a stickler for things such as high output impedance as that changes the intended signature of the sensitive IEMs/headphones which is a big no no!

Ugh,...oops!!!

What do you guys want? Some RMAA tests to tell you how neutral this player is , or a very good sounding DAP?

Quote:

Originally Posted by seeteeyou 

W00t, my order was shipped and I am finally joining the club as another idiot. LOL

I am happy for you man.Merry Christmas earlier for you lol.Please don't forget to share your impressions out of the box and some photos will be nice, so i can get the size right.

Levi

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicday 

What do you guys want? Some RMAA tests to tell you how neutral this player is , or a very good sounding DAP?

It's possible to have both musicday lol as the DX100 happens to be that player for me and is the best I've heard in a portable package. If I remember correctly you were an early adopter of the DX100. The player is miles ahead of what it use to be sound quality wise. Hisound manages to do wonders with the firmware changing the sound quality and obviously so does ibasso. If you were to do a side by side comparison of the players from the older firmwares to the latest 1.2.7 you wouldn't believe you are listening to the same player. It is that big of a difference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee730 

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicday 

What do you guys want? Some RMAA tests to tell you how neutral this player is , or a very good sounding DAP?

It's possible to have both musicday lol as the DX100 happens to be that player for me and is the best I've heard in a portable package. If I remember correctly you were an early adopter of the DX100. The player is miles ahead of what it use to be sound quality wise. Hisound manages to do wonders with the firmware changing the sound quality and obviously so does ibasso. If you were to do a side by side comparison of the players from the older firmwares to the latest 1.2.7 you wouldn't believe you are listening to the same player. It is that big of a difference.

I belive you Lee730, and agree that iBasso DX100 was and is now a much better improved SQ DAP, but if Tera Player can offer a better sound even only with WAV. files then that is the right for me.

Let's not forget the down side of DX100: pop noise, when you turn it on or off, big, heavy, warming up when you use it, very short battery life...etc..

Tera Player doesn't warm up really. Not in my experience. I have heard a small amount of pop from turning off the Tera Player when at full volume (when outputing the sound to my car system). Obviously Tera is smaller than the DX100 and gets great battery life.

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicday 

I belive you Lee730, and agree that iBasso DX100 was and is now a much better improved SQ DAP, but if Tera Player can offer a better sound even only with WAV. files then that is the right for me.

Let's not forget the down side of DX100: pop noise, when you turn it on or off, big, heavy, warming up when you use it, very short battery life...etc..

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicday 

I belive you Lee730, and agree that iBasso DX100 was and is now a much better improved SQ DAP, but if Tera Player can offer a better sound even only with WAV. files then that is the right for me.

Let's not forget the down side of DX100: pop noise, when you turn it on or off, big, heavy, warming up when you use it, very short battery life...etc..

I agree on the pop sound however on the latest update the pop sound has been noticeably decreased. Before I would always make sure to power on the unit first before plugging in my IEMs and unplugging before powering off. Now if I plug in and power it on the pop is still there but not nearly as loud. Enough so where I'm not worried about damaging my IEMs or my hearing (it's no longer painful ;). Also on powering off there is really no pop at all now. Just on powering on. Battery life isn't it's strong suite but it only take about 2 hours to fully charge from a complete drain so that is quite good IMO. My Sflo2 and Hifiman 601 use to take 6 to 7 hours to fully charge with similar battery life. Generally speaking I won't listen to it for 7 or 8 hours straight anyways. Sometimes I'll do intermittent sessions up to 6 hours depending. The Studio V 3rd ANV has me covered on the battery/sound quality/portability/durability front ;). I forgot the last time I actually charged it lol. :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by musicday 

I belive you Lee730, and agree that iBasso DX100 was and is now a much better improved SQ DAP, but if Tera Player can offer a better sound even only with WAV. files then that is the right for me.

Let's not forget the down side of DX100: pop noise, when you turn it on or off, big, heavy, warming up when you use it, very short battery life...etc..

If it's not warming up as you use it for 10 or 20 min, it's likely that something in the playback chain is not especially revealing.

I look at measurements as something that may deter me if poor. Once pretty good, what we hear is more important. I don't see something that doesn't play any HiDef at it's native resolution as best in world. It may be a great sounding player but that and no screen would kill it for me at the asking price but we all have different needs.

RMAA are calculated from conditions and depending on the measurement can be off. We've seen it on output impedance effect on earphones where the RMAA was more severe than the actual measurement. Nothing wrong with it as long as it's used like the tool it is and not taken as gospel. It is still quite useful and better than nothing. The problem with the internet is that something is absolutely white or absolutely black where in the real world, things are generally a bit grey.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nywytboy68 

As stated above, a player can sound musical & measure excellently. There's no reason to settle, is there??? Blind faith doesn't make thi work,...
Sell this player to me,...so far it isn't happening.

lol well nywytboy I think otherwise because my Studio V 3rd ANV isn't the best measuring player out there either (at least from some of the RMAA test done). I am also wondering if those RMAA tests reflect the newest model and if they were done correctly as well. Regardless the player is amazing and in this case the RMAA tests don't tell the whole story. Because the Sansa Clip could only dream of being comparable in sound quality (not even amped). I am a former owner of many Sansa products and know how good they sound. They are quite good for the price but that is where it ends. When I see people using Custom IEMs or higher end gear with these devices I always wonder lol. Kinda like putting 87 Octane into a luxury car that requires 92 Octane ;).