I have no idea how bold mode could be activated without your intervention.
- 37 Posts. Joined 2/2013
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I have no idea how bold mode could be activated without your intervention.
The vast majority of my head-fi posts are made using an iPad and an admittedly obscure browser app. So somehow I'd inadvertently permanently enabled bold text, but thanks to your advice I've now disabled it and can post without the negative connotations of being too bold!
Again, if someone writes something patently ridiculous that I can answer simply and clearly, I will do so. I do not care if the reply was given 10 or 20 pages before.
You question our judgement and refer to other sites as reference to how bad the product is. Other sites have praised the Tera Player, but almost every review has said this is not a device for everyone, but to a more select segment of the audio community.
Sorry: you have misuderstood what I have very deeply.
Fact is, If you don't trust our ears the first thing you should've done is ask if their were measurements done on the Tera Player
1. You are assuming that I have not seen measurements; you remember the ass-u-me thing from that movie..?
2. You seem not to have heard of Internet search engines; seriously - why would anyone ask the above when they could google?
3. You are making a much deeper error even than either of the two points above imply: heavy, heavy hint: READ THE LINK I GAVE.
and if their was anyone around you that might be willing to meet up and let you take a listen.
I would love to hear one - I'd do a blind test to make sure I eliminated any biases I might have. But I'm in the NW of the UK rather than NY or California, and I really doubt Tera's are easy to find.
It seems like from the first post you made on this thread you've done nothing but try to stir the pot. I would've welcomed your quest for measurements if you went about this differently. Now I don't care if what you truly want is measurements because you have attacked us owners.
Well, yes, I understand that you feel that way - but you are being silly. I have good reason - VERY good reason (which you still don't understand because you haven't looked at the link!) to believe that the player is at best ordinary sounding. I was then put in a situation, not of my own choice, where I had to either be a hypocrite and a shill, or to say that, yes, I think people who have the player and think it sounds great are wrong. (LOOK AT THE LINK!)
Look, I'll really simplify this to the bare essentials:
1. Blind testing has proven, beyond a doubt, that people can't tell the difference between good $50 CD players and $6000 ones. Or between $200 receiver amps and $10,000 paired monoblocks. The owners of these components were sure they could tell the difference, but couldn't when tested blind. So, yes, of course I place a heavy discount on your subjective opinion.
2. A Sansa Clip+ already has jitter and noise that beneath the threshold where they can make an audible difference. There is literally no room to improve any aspect of DAP performance so that its audible beyond what the Clip+ can do. So when you say that you can hear a difference, then, especially given (1) I am sceptical. Extremely. Cheap digital electronics have been excellent ever since the advent of op amps with fast slew rates; ever since then the link in the chain that has been preventing perfect audio reproduction is the transducer.
3. People have made identical claims for other "audiophile" players, and these players have in several case turned out to measurably flawed. So again, the opinion of owners means little to me. There is a certain group of people who will buy expensive audio hardware they do not understand and then respond strongly, very strongly, to the placebo effect. You might not want to think that you are in this group, but looking at it objectively, you may be able to understand why I am doubtful of this.
4.This player is aimed at people who want to listen to WAVs - but in blind tests, no one can tell the difference between WAVs and 320 aac, let alone FLAC. I think anyone would therefore see this player as a deliberate play on the gullible.
5. The marketing for the Tera makes a big play about 24/192. Does anyone else hear understand sampling theory? I doubt it! The only point to sampling at 192 would be to provide recordings for bats: for the ranges of sounds that humans can hear it is pointless. In fact, it's worse - unless you filter out the extra information you have gathered you increase distortion products that will affect the audible range!
So, from your pov this is about ego. Well, from mine its about knowledge.You guys may be nice people, you may own lots of hifi equipment, but you don't understand very basic facts about digital signals and electronics. It's not that I am arrogant - I know that I know rather little in fact - but I do know enough to see that things are not right here, and that no intelligent person would be swayed by your subjective opinions because, hey, see (1). Really - you seem like a nice person and I don't want to upset you, but, hey, objective truth is important too!
I guess some people really would buy anything, huh?
If the clip is as good as you audibly can get, go use it. Their is more to a device than it's sound and price. So lets just have some fun and assume they are identical in sound.
You know what, I think I'll just have to sell my Tera Player and use my Clip Zip instead, you've totally convinced me that it must be superior or on par with this Tera Player I have. And the Tera Player doesnt even have an On/Off switch?!?! How could I ever be so foolish.
2 minutes later...
oh man, look, an EQ on the Clip+......(quality goes out the window)
5 minutes later
Man, I want a new song, lets hit this button......(you somehow managed to get a rockbox menu instead of the next song or pausing the song. This is actually a feature, not a poor design choice)
5 hours later.....
okay, time to stop listening. I feel tired and groggy....
That simple enough to explain how the Tera Player is better, at least to me, from a design standpoint than the Clip+. Go spend your small amount on a cheaply made player and be happy, why bother those that enjoy the items they buy, even if they are more than 10 times the cost of yours. I welcome anyone that's in my area to set up a meeting with me and take a listen. Many others have made similar offers. And I am almost 100% certain their are Tera Players around you scuttle. Seriously, it's made in Germany and their are owners all over the world. It's not like it's never crossed the ocean before and made in the USA.
EDIT: I wanna add, If this is indeed true, which, I don't really care since I already own a Tera Player and enjoy it greatly, so not spending anything more on a DAP these days, then why are you not posting on threads for all the other high-end DAP's about them being pointless and a waste of money?
This is not an intelligent argument. A high priced player certainly should measure well in those qualities related to sound quality; that you don't understand how to relate measurements to sq is your own failing and nothing else.
If a player's measurements show severe problems and a group of people who have bought it at a silly price say "No, it sounds great!" then certainly other people will suspect that the buyers are far from the golden eared elite they like to imagine themselves as, and in fact have been duped.As for how likely this is compared to magic players that test badly and sound great, well, history is on the sound of "You got burned":
As for "falling back on ripoff" - this makes no sense; it's just a semi-illiterate cop out. The ripoff is when a player tests and sounds bad.
There are millions of idiots on the Internet; that you can find one person to say a DAC sounds "VG" means nothing. You can find literally thousands of people who say that Elvis is still alive and the millions that say that Ron L. Hubbard was a messiah - do you believe these things?
You must be semi-illiterate to use semi-illiterate in that context.
Go buy a well measuring $100 USB DAC and enjoy. You can always read the spec sheet if you get bored. Did you pick the source file as clearly better than all the others in Scamp's test? I did. If you didn't, it's not your ears. It's your assumptions about sound holding back your kit.
Oh, I'm not nor plan to be a Tera user.
Nope. G was source, clip was second and Ipod 3rd. I'm adverse to USB DACs and PCs as source so it didn't surprise me. That was with 10 min total listen time so I wasn't being exceptionally critical but wanted to participate..
You can see the results in the 3rd post on this page and compare. G was the source file.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/648501/blind-test-6-dacs-compared/150 I think perhaps Skamp's having a laugh after what stv did. I guess we'll never know for sure but STV's data is pretty convincing.
To be honest it was more a dig at scuttle than anything else. The way the test was organized didn't really prove much either way. It was more for kicks and I was surprised in the extremely low participation.
English is not my native language but I'll try to explain the way I look at the hard science, technology and objective measurements (audio technology) vs the emotion of music and the way sounds sounds differently to everyone.
Beside enjoying listening to music I'm also an experienced photographer. I you read photography or camera forums you will find similar discussion as the once in this thread. As an example. Leica makes a very, very expensive lens, the Noctilux. Technically it has many shortcomings: light falloff, refraction, etc. but somehow you can create very beautiful photos with them. With special looks. If you look at them technically you will find many "objective" mistakes. So what is more important?
BTW, I'm not saying the Tera Player can be compared to the Noctilux for having technical mistakes. I just don't know and don't care. I don't have as well trained ears as I have eyes. I would be interested in looking at the measurements. Not to base an opinion on. Just out of curiosity and to learn from.
Have a look at this website to see how scientific cameras are measured these days: http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Cameras/Camera-Sensor-Ratings But a beautiful photo can be created with any camera.