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Amping for AKG Q701 - Page 26

post #376 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwappo99 View Post

 I would avoid the Crack for the Q701/K701. The output impedance of the amplifier isn't such a hot match for the low impedance Q701 drivers.

I have been a long time fan of the K701/Q701. Most of my amp purchases/sells have been based on the synergy with the Q701. Right now the best amplifier I've heard with these headphones are:

1. Little dot MKVI+
2. Schiit Vali
3. Matrix M-Stage

All are quite excellent. Vali is a surprisingly good.




So the Vali powers the k701s to the point of having some bass? I'm going to have to try it.biggrin.gif

I think using the Crack would be a little like using the Woo 3 amp with the k701s. The Woo 3 works perfect with the HD600s but fails fully with the k701s. The Woo3 and k701 combo sounds like music playing over at your neighbors house at full volume.wink.gif
post #377 of 497

if i get the BH Crack it would be mainly for my DT and for the Q it shouldn't be that bad with Crack(my guess)LD MK III is a good pairing with Q( LD MK III is never meant to drive LOW impedance)so i'am not into those technical mumble jumble like  impedance matching i don't consider my self Audiophile i'am just a music lover so what ever sound good to my ear  it's all good i don't need to worry about the rest of audiophile stuff.

post #378 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by i luvmusic 2 View Post

if i get the BH Crack it would be mainly for my DT and for the Q it shouldn't be that bad with Crack(my guess)LD MK III is a good pairing with Q( LD MK III is never meant to drive LOW impedance)so i'am not into those technical mumble jumble like  impedance matching i don't consider my self Audiophile i'am just a music lover so what ever sound good to my ear  it's all good i don't need to worry about the rest of audiophile stuff.

You do yourself a dis-service sir.

smily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gifsmily_headphones1.gif
post #379 of 497

Saying "meh," implies that it is nothing special. Its sort of like saying that you almost feel indifferent about something. Its an onomatopoeia

post #380 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by cehowardNote3 View Post
 

I was getting ready to pull the trigger on the AKG Q701 to work with the Fiio E18.. However, a poster told me not a good idea, and then I read this thread. I think I am going to hold off on the Q701 till I find out further. The only amp/dac I will have will be the E18..


They are not difficult to drive at all! My E12 and E11 makes my Q701 sound beautiful. Fiio can surprisingly power quite a lot of headphones. I took my E11 to a Hifi store and listened to the LCD2 and the E11 powered it just fine! It went to max volume but I didn't notice anything missing.

 

So many people make out you need the most expensive amp that resembles a nuclear power plant but it's not true. Fiio may be cheap but they pack a lot of power especially the E12!


Edited by DJDREEM - 4/26/14 at 9:08am
post #381 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post


So the Vali powers the k701s to the point of having some bass? I'm going to have to try it.biggrin.gif

I think using the Crack would be a little like using the Woo 3 amp with the k701s. The Woo 3 works perfect with the HD600s but fails fully with the k701s. The Woo3 and k701 combo sounds like music playing over at your neighbors house at full volume.wink.gif

 

You should do it. Vali is very very good with the Q701. In fact it sounded almost identical to my main amp (and upgraded power supply) which cost about $350 when it was new. With the Vali and the Q701 there is just a touch of warmth (from the amp), but I didn't find it to be a warm sounding amp. Just not cold/thin like the stock O2 or Magni. Vali sounds transparent with the Q701.

 

Vali (with Q701 and AKGs only) sounded pretty similar to how the Q701 sounds on the iFi iCAN and Headroom Micro Amp.

 

For me though the Vali wasn't a good all-rounder. I didn't get mine to work well with anything else. Not sure why. Maybe Vali is just better with the AKG headphones.

 

 

BTW I never have found the Q701 to care much about the output impedance of any amp. It's no problem with the E9 (only 10ohm output) or even a 330 ohm receiver. I never got my Q701 to change much. No extra bass or whatever.

 

Someone should measure this and see if the Q701 really does change it's frequency response with a very high output impedance. I doubt it.

 

My 38ohm Koss Pro DJ100 is also like this...sounds just the same on an amp with a 1ohm output impedance and 330ohm. Strange..

 

Also, I could have sworn once that the Valhalla was good for the Q701/K701, which makes no sense really. Totally opposite of what you'd expect. I should try that! I know it won't have as much power, but might still sound good with the Q701.

 

I'd like to get a hybrid tube amp that's amazing for both the Q701 and my HD650. The $60 Bravo V2 doesn't seem to do this well...

post #382 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post
 

So the Vali powers the k701s to the point of having some bass? I'm going to have to try it.biggrin.gif

I think using the Crack would be a little like using the Woo 3 amp with the k701s. The Woo 3 works perfect with the HD600s but fails fully with the k701s. The Woo3 and k701 combo sounds like music playing over at your neighbors house at full volume.wink.gif

 

Certainly gives it a "touch" of bass, but don't expect a big thumping bass end. Certainly less than K712 would give, but there are lots of tradeoffs there as well.

post #383 of 497
The reason the Q701 should work with high impedence amps is because the impedence of the drivers is very close to flat across the whole spectrum. This is, presumably, an intentional design goal by AKG so their headphones can be used in a studio setting, where historically I'm told a lot of the boards had headphone outputs with 120 ohms of impedance... Which helps when hooking up many headphones in parallel. There's an article I can link later I'd you're curious.
post #384 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodgey4 View Post

The reason the Q701 should work with high impedence amps is because the impedence of the drivers is very close to flat across the whole spectrum. This is, presumably, an intentional design goal by AKG so their headphones can be used in a studio setting, where historically I'm told a lot of the boards had headphone outputs with 120 ohms of impedance... Which helps when hooking up many headphones in parallel. There's an article I can link later I'd you're curious.

 

Huh! I had no idea! I never really looked into their curve. It actually looks pretty flat, although I think I'd try to stick to a low output impedance

 

http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/AKGQuincyJonesQ701.pdf

post #385 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post

 

BTW I never have found the Q701 to care much about the output impedance of any amp. It's no problem with the E9 (only 10ohm output) or even a 330 ohm receiver. I never got my Q701 to change much. No extra bass or whatever.

 

Someone should measure this and see if the Q701 really does change it's frequency response with a very high output impedance. I doubt it.

 

My 38ohm Koss Pro DJ100 is also like this...sounds just the same on an amp with a 1ohm output impedance and 330ohm. Strange..

 

Also, I could have sworn once that the Valhalla was good for the Q701/K701, which makes no sense really. Totally opposite of what you'd expect. I should try that! I know it won't have as much power, but might still sound good with the Q701.

 

I'd like to get a hybrid tube amp that's amazing for both the Q701 and my HD650. The $60 Bravo V2 doesn't seem to do this well...

My experience is that the NAD 3130 (with its 220 Ohm headphone output impedance) works very well with the Q701, while the HD598 does not pair up well with that amplifier---the bass is bloated.  This is what one would expect from the difference in the impedance curve for the two headphones.  Since you have the HD598 as well, can you confirm that you had similar problems with the HD598 and high headphone output amplifiers? 

 

There are some comments on amazon concerning the Bravo V2 and the K701.  The poster likes that combination a lot.  It seems that you do not, however.  Is the Vali + Q701 really that much better than the Bravo V2 + Q701?  Which DAC do you use?

post #386 of 497

Actually i`ve the Superlux HD 681 EVO and i`m probably buying the Fiio E07k next month... i`m loving the EVOs but i really want to buy the Q701 after some months.

So i`d like to know if Fiio E07k will be a good pair with the Q701, i really don`t want to lose my investment ... and maybe after a while i can buy the E09k to use with the E07k if E07k amp if not enough.

What do you guys thing?

post #387 of 497

Zorrofox, I got a tip/advice on the ODAC+O2 will work well with the Q701.

 

Would like and value your take on the ODAC+O2,

 

 

post #388 of 497
I have relatively little experience with amps comparable to the O2 but that being said I think it sounds incredible. How much of the sound I hear is down to the O2 and how much is down to the ODAC I can't say, but together they sound fabulous. I think it's exactly where the law of diminishing returns kicks in because I'd have to spend considerably more money to gain any significant improvement. I had to EQ my Q's though, to get rid of the treble spike at 2k but the O2 definitely reveals this spike, very clearly. In the end though I've moved on. I bought a pair of HD 650's and haven't looked back. It was the comfort that made me move on.
post #389 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoGV View Post
 

My experience is that the NAD 3130 (with its 220 Ohm headphone output impedance) works very well with the Q701, while the HD598 does not pair up well with that amplifier---the bass is bloated.  This is what one would expect from the difference in the impedance curve for the two headphones.  Since you have the HD598 as well, can you confirm that you had similar problems with the HD598 and high headphone output amplifiers? 

 

There are some comments on amazon concerning the Bravo V2 and the K701.  The poster likes that combination a lot.  It seems that you do not, however.  Is the Vali + Q701 really that much better than the Bravo V2 + Q701?  Which DAC do you use?

 

Dang, I totally missed this post.

Bravo V2 just annoys my ears with the Q701. It makes the Q701 sounds a bit too thin and harsh. Too trebly. I would say it's similar to how it sounds with the Magni and stock O2, but not as good.

Even adding a warmer sounding source doesn't help much. I even swapped out the tubes without much change.

I have a feeling the Bravo V2 just doesn't have enough juice for the Q701 or is just bad synergy. The V2 however sounds great with the HD-650.

 

Vali+Q701 sounds almost as good as the Ifi iCAN and Micro Amp for the Q701. It's not too thin/harsh/analytical, but yet not warm. For the Q701 (ONLY!) it sounds like a more refined Fiio e9, but less warm.

Vali is not a warm sounding amp at all to me. At least not with the Q701. Maybe a very very subtle touch of warmth.

 

When I compared the Micro Amp + Astrodyne power supply to the Vali with the Q701 they sounded nearly identical. This means mostly transparent without being thin/cold. I'm not a fan of the Vali at all, but it sounds great with the Q701.

 

Vali is not a good all-rounder amp. I know people shouldn't expect this, but I have to point this out.

 

Also, sorry I don't remember trying the HD-598 with a high output impedance amp.

 

BTW if anyone is curious I don't really like the O2 with Q701. It would not make me love the Q701. I swapped out the op-amps and there is an improvement with the Q701 (just preferences). Cost is less than $10! OPA2277 is good. I keep forgetting all the op-amp names!

 

The only amps I suggest for the Q701 are the E9, Micro Amp, Ifi iCAN and MAYBE the Vali. O2 is just OK with the Q701.

 

Interesting fact...3 of those use the OPA2134 chips.

post #390 of 497
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoGV View Post
 

My experience is that the NAD 3130 (with its 220 Ohm headphone output impedance) works very well with the Q701, while the HD598 does not pair up well with that amplifier---the bass is bloated.  This is what one would expect from the difference in the impedance curve for the two headphones.  Since you have the HD598 as well, can you confirm that you had similar problems with the HD598 and high headphone output amplifiers? 

 

There are some comments on amazon concerning the Bravo V2 and the K701.  The poster likes that combination a lot.  It seems that you do not, however.  Is the Vali + Q701 really that much better than the Bravo V2 + Q701?  Which DAC do you use?

 

Dang, I totally missed this post.

Bravo V2 just annoys my ears with the Q701. It makes the Q701 sounds a bit too thin and harsh. Too trebly. I would say it's similar to how it sounds with the Magni and stock O2, but not as good.

Even adding a warmer sounding source doesn't help much. I even swapped out the tubes without much change.

I have a feeling the Bravo V2 just doesn't have enough juice for the Q701 or is just bad synergy. The V2 however sounds great with the HD-650.

 

Vali+Q701 sounds almost as good as the Ifi iCAN and Micro Amp for the Q701. It's not too thin/harsh/analytical, but yet not warm. For the Q701 (ONLY!) it sounds like a more refined Fiio e9, but less warm.

Vali is not a warm sounding amp at all to me. At least not with the Q701. Maybe a very very subtle touch of warmth.

 

When I compared the Micro Amp + Astrodyne power supply to the Vali with the Q701 they sounded nearly identical. This means mostly transparent without being thin/cold. I'm not a fan of the Vali at all, but it sounds great with the Q701.

 

Vali is not a good all-rounder amp. I know people shouldn't expect this, but I have to point this out.

 

Also, sorry I don't remember trying the HD-598 with a high output impedance amp.

 

BTW if anyone is curious I don't really like the O2 with Q701. It would not make me love the Q701. I swapped out the op-amps and there is an improvement with the Q701 (just preferences). Cost is less than $10! OPA2277 is good. I keep forgetting all the op-amp names!

 

The only amps I suggest for the Q701 are the E9, Micro Amp, Ifi iCAN and MAYBE the Vali. O2 is just OK with the Q701.

 

Interesting fact...3 of those use the OPA2134 chips.


Thank you for the detailed comments!  I bought a Bravo V2 since my post.  I have used it for two days with my office setup.  So: laptop, Dragonfly v1.0, Bravo V2, Beyerdynamic DT235.  (For some reason, I decided to try it first the Beyerdynamic DT235, which is my backup headphone, rather than the CAL!)  The DT235 is somewhat cold, thin in the mids, and a little metallic sounding, but with the Bravo it becomes warm and seems even more detailed.  I have been listening only to Swiss Jazz radio over the internet.  I am amazed by how good this sounds! Maybe I will soon realize that it is all my imagination.:) 


Edited by MarcoGV - 5/22/14 at 8:34am
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