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Android phones and USB DACs - Page 136

post #2026 of 5306

By the way, the USB descriptors of a USB DAC can be read using the free Microsoft USB View:

http://www.ftdichip.com/Support/Utilities.htm

http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/window-on-windows/map-and-troubleshoot-your-usb-ports-with-microsoft-usb-view/5982

 

About USB enumeration:

http://www.lrr.in.tum.de/Par/arch/usb/usbdoc/node9.html

http://www.lvr.com/usbcenum.htm

http://www.sysnucleus.com/usbenum.html


Edited by DanBa - 4/2/13 at 3:24pm
post #2027 of 5306

The lvr read is interesting it refers to a powered hub (500 ma) although with a android device (100 ma) is the limit. Also 'Some controllers can manage enumeration entirely in hardware except possibly for vendor-provided values in EEPROM' which is where I think fiio messed up with the E17.

post #2028 of 5306

My ODAC requires 500 mA. It can directly work with my Galaxy S3.

 

 

Configuration Descriptor:

wTotalLength:       0x0151

bNumInterfaces:       0x04

bConfigurationValue:  0x01

iConfiguration:       0x00

bmAttributes:         0x80 (Bus Powered )

MaxPower:             0xFA (500 mA)

 

[0xFA * 2 mA = 250 * 2 mA = 500 mA]

post #2029 of 5306

The Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor of the ODAC is correctly interpreted by the native USB audio of the Galaxy S3 as well as by the USB audio of USB Audio Recorder PRO.

 

 

Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor:
bLength:              0x1A
bDescriptorType:      0x24
bDescriptorSubtype:   0x02
bFormatType:          0x01
bNrChannels:          0x02
bSubframeSize:        0x02
bBitResolution:       0x10
bSamFreqType:         0x06
tSamFreq[1]:      0x001F40 (8000 Hz)
tSamFreq[2]:      0x003E80 (16000 Hz)
tSamFreq[3]:      0x007D00 (32000 Hz)
tSamFreq[4]:      0x00AC44 (44100 Hz)
tSamFreq[5]:      0x00BB80 (48000 Hz)
tSamFreq[6]:      0x017700 (96000 Hz)
 
 
According to Michael Goodman, Managing Director & Chief Product Architect of CEntrance:
"Recently, we’ve been looking closely at a number of phones from the Android family and have been noticing something rather disconcerting.
It would appear that a lot of phones don’t know how to handle a USB audio device (DAC) that announces itself as 192 kHz-capable. That is what HiFi-M8 does, because it supports everything all the way up to 192 on the USB bus.
What seems to happen is Android gets confused, because it doesn’t know how to handle a 192 kHz DAC, so it stops trying to connect." 
 
I'm curious to read the Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor of a DACmini or a DACport which can only interact with USB Audio Recorder PRO.
post #2030 of 5306

How long does it take to drain your phones battery? I think the descriptors lying. Edit I should say this when the phone is enumerating the ma draw its done with a pull up/pull down resistor circuit not what the descriptor reports.


Edited by fuzzy1969 - 4/2/13 at 4:21pm
post #2031 of 5306
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanBa View Post

The Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor of the ODAC is correctly interpreted by the native USB audio of the Galaxy S3 as well as by the USB audio of USB Audio Recorder PRO.

 

 

Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor:
bLength:              0x1A
bDescriptorType:      0x24
bDescriptorSubtype:   0x02
bFormatType:          0x01
bNrChannels:          0x02
bSubframeSize:        0x02
bBitResolution:       0x10
bSamFreqType:         0x06
tSamFreq[1]:      0x001F40 (8000 Hz)
tSamFreq[2]:      0x003E80 (16000 Hz)
tSamFreq[3]:      0x007D00 (32000 Hz)
tSamFreq[4]:      0x00AC44 (44100 Hz)
tSamFreq[5]:      0x00BB80 (48000 Hz)
tSamFreq[6]:      0x017700 (96000 Hz)
 
 
According to Michael Goodman, Managing Director & Chief Product Architect of CEntrance:
"Recently, we’ve been looking closely at a number of phones from the Android family and have been noticing something rather disconcerting.
It would appear that a lot of phones don’t know how to handle a USB audio device (DAC) that announces itself as 192 kHz-capable. That is what HiFi-M8 does, because it supports everything all the way up to 192 on the USB bus.
What seems to happen is Android gets confused, because it doesn’t know how to handle a 192 kHz DAC, so it stops trying to connect." 
 
I'm curious to read the Audio Streaming Format Type Descriptor of a DACmini or a DACport which can only interact with USB Audio Recorder PRO.

This is something Im going to test out with the apex glacier using usb recorder playing 24/96 bit files which I believe it will, android players will play hi-rez but downsampling is done in the background.

post #2032 of 5306
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzzy1969 View Post

How long does it take to drain your phones battery? 

 

7 hours.

 

 

The USB Audio Recorder PRO player can play 24/96 (up to 24/192) music file, and forward a 24/96 (up to 24/192) PCM stream to a 24/96 capable ODAC or FiiO E17.

 

 

1000

post #2033 of 5306

I think usb recorder pro will do 24/96 to the apex glacier (without android getting in the way), 7 hours is more than the s3  battery is capable of at 500 mha bearing in mind that a usb interface can operate at the lower limit of 3.7v.

post #2034 of 5306

ODAC Configuration Descriptor:

"...

bmAttributes:         0x80 (Bus Powered )

MaxPower:             0xFA (500 mA)"
 
 
Graham Slee Bitzie USB DAC Features:
 
"USB DAC for Samsung Galaxy S3 Android Jellybean...
 . 7.5hrs continuous playing!
..."
post #2035 of 5306
The s3 battery is rated at 2200 milli amp hours so a device drawing 500 ma running for 7 hours would need a 3500 mha battery and that's without the phone hardware/operating system using any power.
post #2036 of 5306

You forget the term "MaxPower".

post #2037 of 5306
I was looking at that but to be honest a DAC with a fixed line out should have a average power, max power is a reference to a PC or powered hub.
post #2038 of 5306
Getting my head around testing USB recorder pro play 24bit flac from a s3, the only DAC I have which I think will tell me the bit stream depth is the E17 if it tells me 24 bit then I think USB recorder pro will overcome the android limitation.
post #2039 of 5306

Thanks! That enumeration tools and article helped.

 

So, for Fiio E10 thats clearly not an enumeration issue, as device introduces 4 consequitively numbered interfaces.

Here some output from USBView (cleaned away lots of stuff):

Device Descriptor:

idVendor:           0x1852

idProduct:          0x7022


Configuration Descriptor:

wTotalLength:       0x0182

bNumInterfaces:       0x04


Interface Descriptor:

bInterfaceNumber:     0x00

bInterfaceClass:      0x03 (HID)


Interface Descriptor:

bInterfaceNumber:     0x01

bInterfaceClass:      0x01 (Audio)

bInterfaceSubClass:   0x01 (Audio Control)

0x0409: "FiiO USB DAC-E10"


Interface Descriptor:

bInterfaceNumber:     0x02

bInterfaceClass:      0x01 (Audio)

bInterfaceSubClass:   0x02 (Audio Streaming)


Interface Descriptor:

bInterfaceNumber:     0x03

bInterfaceClass:      0x01 (Audio)

bInterfaceSubClass:   0x02 (Audio Streaming)

 

That would be interesting to compare with someone's older FiiO E10...


Edited by Hiver - 4/3/13 at 2:56am
post #2040 of 5306
Quote:
Originally Posted by glassmaple View Post

Can anyone get usb audio with 4.2.2 (galaxy s3)? I installed the new rom and can only get sound out of usb audio recorder pro.

 

I did manage to get audio out with 4.1.x. Amp is the UHA-6S MKII


Which GS3 do you have? The international version or one of the US ones?

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