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Looking for full sized headphone for mostly on the go use. details below - Page 2

post #16 of 43
2/1/12 at 10:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

Are you speaking from experience with bigger headphones, or just assuming?  But yeah i have to agree that they are a bit big and i guess would get annoying because they don't fold, which is my biggest problem with them.

 

I did take a look at these, they just don't really seem to jump out at me all that much though to be honest. Also from what i hear about senns in general i don't think the sound of them is for me.  Don't get me wrong they are still great headphones, they just are not for me.

 

As for the amp, the e11 does look really good and has a very attractive price. and great functionality. Although i have heard that for ipods the e7 works better, am i wrong here? Also is the 20 some dollars worth it for the e7, finally how does each rate for powering bigger headphones ohm wise.  Like how much can each of these power?

 

thanks
 

 


Yes, I am definitely speaking from experience with bigger headphones;

please feel free to check out my Profile page. :-)

 

As for the Senn HD 25 i II, their sound signature differs significantly from the typical Senn sound signature -

a lot has been a written about it here on BF and elsewhere as well. 

 

But if they just don't appeal to you there are of course other options.

 

Some of the Ultrasones, as mentioned for example.

Also - have you heard the KRK KNS 8400? 

Very good sounding, durable phones that happen to fold also.

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by stv014 View Post

Quote:


The E11 is only an amplifier. It is battery powered, and cannot be used while the batteries are being recharged (an annoying limitation if you intend to use it mainly at home).

 

The E7 is a DAC+amplifier combination. It can be powered by USB or batteries, but the DAC is only usable from USB (for an iPod or other portable player, it is also just an amplifier). It can be conveniently used together with the E9 for more power, due to the docking feature. For high impedance headphones, the E11 is capable of outputting more than twice as much power (52 vs. 23 mW into 150 Ohm). So, the E7 is a more versatile device, but its amplifier is weaker if you intend to use high impedance headphones.

 

The E17 is an improved E7 with a better DAC, an amplifier comparable to that of the E11, and some new features, but it is the most expensive.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post




Sorry im kind of new to the whole higher end headphone expierence so i didnt really follow this. Were you saying that the e11 would be the better choice? or the e7s? at least for an ipod set up? The highest impedance i would probably be using is 80 ohms. At the very most 250 if i go with a higher end model.

And i see that by your display picture that you have a beyer dt model, do you happen to own a set of these? If so could you weigh in on my debacle? Ha

Thanks in advance!

 

 

The E11 is better for an iPod, while the E7's best use is with a computer (because of the built-in DAC).

 

The E17 - I've not yet listened to it; it's a very recent release.  (Meaning about a week ago!) 

Retail is $169.00 IIRC.  Looks amazing and reports are excellent.

Check out Micca Store for availability.

 

Also, I own (the 250 ohm version of) the Beyer's in the avatar pic - DT880's - and they are outstanding headphones.

Definitely one of the top in their price range.

But they're an open backed design, so not great for use outside, around people, etc.

 

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post #17 of 43
2/1/12 at 11:47am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zazex View Post


Yes, I am definitely speaking from experience with bigger headphones;

please feel free to check out my Profile page. :-)

 

As for the Senn HD 25 i II, their sound signature differs significantly from the typical Senn sound signature -

a lot has been a written about it here on BF and elsewhere as well. 

 

But if they just don't appeal to you there are of course other options.

 

Some of the Ultrasones, as mentioned for example.

Also - have you heard the KRK KNS 8400? 

Very good sounding, durable phones that happen to fold also.

 

 

 

 

The E11 is better for an iPod, while the E7's best use is with a computer (because of the built-in DAC).

 

The E17 - I've not yet listened to it; it's a very recent release.  (Meaning about a week ago!) 

Retail is $169.00 IIRC.  Looks amazing and reports are excellent.

Check out Micca Store for availability.

 

Also, I own (the 250 ohm version of) the Beyer's in the avatar pic - DT880's - and they are outstanding headphones.

Definitely one of the top in their price range.

But they're an open backed design, so not great for use outside, around people, etc.

 




I did look at these (krks) and tbh this is where my vain side comes in, i just dont like the looks. Ill have to do some more research on these though if the sound is what im looking for, who cares what it looks like i guess.

 

As for the ultrasones they seem to be kind of what i'm looking for although I'm concerned about the comfort level on these. they just dont seem to be all that great. I saw on your profile that you have or had the 780s what do you think about the comfort? If they arn't all the comfortable any suggestions for something that sounds similar but with a lot more comfort?

 

As for the amps, i think i get it now, so thanks for clearing it up. If i am also going to be using it on my computer, is it worth the extra 20ish dollars just to get the e7, or stick with the e11.

 

finally, i really do like the beyers, they have looks and comfort and good sound for there price, and better control when amped. they just call my name, although i guess from what i hear, they arn't all that good for guitar music and acoustic music. The 880s are around the same size i am assuming, are they just over the top big? Or would it be do able to travel with? i heard the 770s come with a case, although i don't really know if thats true.

 

As for the 880s themselves, Tons of sound leakage im assuming? Like it would disturb a person sitting next to me on a bus? It would be nice to be able to get them, but the sound leakage just kind of turns me away.

 

Sorry for all the questions, I really just want to make the right descion here. But thanks so far for your help biggrin.gif

 

edit: also on the portability of the 770s, you said they were heavy? Maybe i got the wrong idea but them dont seem all that heavy. From what i hear, lighter than those beats that everyone wear around. But i could have gotten the wrong impression.


Edited by alza - 2/1/12 at 11:50am
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post #18 of 43
2/1/12 at 12:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

Sorry im kind of new to the whole higher end headphone expierence so i didnt really follow this. Were you saying that the e11 would be the better choice? or the e7s? at least for an ipod set up? The highest impedance i would probably be using is 80 ohms. At the very most 250 if i go with a higher end model.

 

The E11 has a better (mainly more powerful, but also somewhat lower noise and distortion) amplifier. If you mainly intend to use it with an iPod, then it is a better choice overall than the E7, since the E7's advantage is that it can be used from a computer through USB, and then it functions as a DAC as well.

The E11 will drive even 250 Ohm headphones reasonably well (~30 mW power, 108-110 dB max. SPL).

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

And i see that by your display picture that you have a beyer dt model, do you happen to own a set of these?


The picture shows a DT880 Pro (250 Ohm), and I do have them.

 

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post #19 of 43
2/1/12 at 12:36pm
Quote:

Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

As for the amps, i think i get it now, so thanks for clearing it up. If i am also going to be using it on my computer, is it worth the extra 20ish dollars just to get the e7, or stick with the e11.

 

The E7 is useful mainly if you need a DAC, or want to avoid the inconvenience of having to use batteries even at home.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

finally, i really do like the beyers, they have looks and comfort and good sound for there price, and better control when amped. they just call my name, although i guess from what i hear, they arn't all that good for guitar music and acoustic music. The 880s are around the same size i am assuming, are they just over the top big? Or would it be do able to travel with? i heard the 770s come with a case, although i don't really know if thats true.

 

The DT770 Pro usually does not come with a case (although some stores offer it as an option). The DT880 (any version) does, as well as the - now discontinued - DT770 Premium or Edition 2005 version.

The 880 (mostly neutral with better and clearer midrange compared to the 770) may be better for guitar and acoustic music, while the 770 (emphasized treble and sub-bass) is better suited for electronic music, rap, or other genres that benefit from more bass.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

Like it would disturb a person sitting next to me on a bus?

 

It depends on your listening volume. It might not leak as much as some fully open headphones, but it does leak quite noticeably, so if you listen loud, someone sitting next to you may find it annoying.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

edit: also on the portability of the 770s, you said they were heavy? Maybe i got the wrong idea but them dont seem all that heavy.

 

The DT770 Pro is 270g without the cord, while the DT880 Pro is 295g.

 


Edited by stv014 - 2/1/12 at 12:38pm
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post #20 of 43
2/1/12 at 12:36pm
Thread Starter 

 

Alright that clears it up a lot. Thank you. At average listenable levels, how is the leakage?

 

And oh yeah that's right, the dt 990 was the one which was in middle bass wise. Well those are completely open so a definite no go for me on those ones.


Edited by alza - 2/1/12 at 12:48pm
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post #21 of 43
2/1/12 at 4:50pm
Thread Starter 

Well i think I've pretty much narrowed it down to either the Beyerdynamic dt770 80s despite the mobility hinderance, and the Audio-Technica ath-m50(s). The ultrasones just don't seem like they have the comfort im looking for. Unless someone can comment otherwise? Maybe something you can deal with? and the m50s are pretty good across all genres, and the look decent.  The beyers seem to be pretty good across most as well, of course they are weaker in some but not absolutely terrible. 

 

Can anyone explain to me what the bass is like on either or both of these models, i get that its uneven or muddy feeling some of the times. But i am referring more towards how the bass actually feels, like can you feel the rumble at least a little? Or is it more that you can just hear the real notes?

 

If someone can try, to compare it more to consumer brands like beats or souls and their bass as a reference point. Probably not as tight but just how they compare, you know what i mean? Like the thump factor you can get from them.

 

Honestly ive been glancing at the souls sl150 and heard they are not completely terrible at least not as bad as beats for sound. I know obviously not audiophile grade, but they are kinda just like a very last resort type of headphone if im not completely sold on anything else

 

Thanks

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post #22 of 43
2/1/12 at 5:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post




I did look at these (krks) and tbh this is where my vain side comes in, i just dont like the looks. Ill have to do some more research on these though if the sound is what im looking for, who cares what it looks like i guess.

 

As for the ultrasones they seem to be kind of what i'm looking for although I'm concerned about the comfort level on these. they just dont seem to be all that great. I saw on your profile that you have or had the 780s what do you think about the comfort? If they arn't all the comfortable any suggestions for something that sounds similar but with a lot more comfort?

 

As for the amps, i think i get it now, so thanks for clearing it up. If i am also going to be using it on my computer, is it worth the extra 20ish dollars just to get the e7, or stick with the e11.

 

finally, i really do like the beyers, they have looks and comfort and good sound for there price, and better control when amped. they just call my name, although i guess from what i hear, they arn't all that good for guitar music and acoustic music. The 880s are around the same size i am assuming, are they just over the top big? Or would it be do able to travel with? i heard the 770s come with a case, although i don't really know if thats true.

 

As for the 880s themselves, Tons of sound leakage im assuming? Like it would disturb a person sitting next to me on a bus? It would be nice to be able to get them, but the sound leakage just kind of turns me away.

 

Sorry for all the questions, I really just want to make the right descion here. But thanks so far for your help biggrin.gif

 

edit: also on the portability of the 770s, you said they were heavy? Maybe i got the wrong idea but them dont seem all that heavy. From what i hear, lighter than those beats that everyone wear around. But i could have gotten the wrong impression.


As to the KRK 8400's - looks are of course subjective and if you like the looks you do, and if you don't you don't...

 

Only thing I can add about that is that sometimes given certain parameters (price, portability, size, quality, availability),

you might want to compromise slightly in one area or another to get something that's the best for you overall.

 

Oh - BTW - when you're referring to looks, are you talking about the looks of the phones when being worn?

Or just the aesthetic of the phones themselves?

Reason I ask is that some phones (like the Beyer's) are very obviously bulbous when worn and viewed front--on;

while the KRK's (for example) are much more flat and I'd say "discreet" in that regard.

 

 

I find that the Ultrasone 780's are not very comfortable. 

Also, I often see posts where others mention this too.

But I'm not aware of any other headphone that sounds quite like them while providing greater wearing comfort.

With that said, though, they're the phones I listen to least; and I've actually pretty much made up my mind to sell them.

I just don't need all that bass...

 

On the other hand I love the DT 880's and recommend them very highly - but only if open phones are OK with you.

Though Beyer terms them "semi-open", they're effectively open and do let in outside sound very easily.

So, yes - plenty of sound leakage.

(As I was reminded again just about an hour ago when wearing mine.)

 

The DT770 has an entirely different sound signature than the DT880.

It's a closed phone that puts out a lot of bass.

The build quality is excellent, but you've got to like bass to enjoy them.

Isolation is very good, but not great due to the velour pads.

 

(And when I said some of these phones were 'heavy', that goes back to your OP and

has less relevance now, at this point in the thread..  Heaviness is relative of course and

I was comparing them to lighter headphones generally labeled 'portable'.)

 

 

The E7 is definitely worth the few extra $ over the E11 if you're going to be using it with

your computer.  Again, because the E7 is an amplifier plus a DAC, whereas the E11 is

solely an amplifier (without a DAC).

 

 

 

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post #23 of 43
2/1/12 at 5:36pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zazex View Post

Only thing I can add about that is that sometimes given certain parameters (price, portability, size, quality, availability),

you might want to compromise slightly in one area or another to get something that's the best for you overall.

 

Oh - BTW - when you're referring to looks, are you talking about the looks of the phones when being worn?

Or just the aesthetic of the phones themselves?

Reason I ask is that some phones (like the Beyer's) are very obviously bulbous when worn and viewed front--on;

while the KRK's (for example) are much more flat and I'd say "discreet" in that regard.

 

 

I find that the Ultrasone 780's are not very comfortable. 

Also, I often see posts where others mention this too.

But I'm not aware of any other headphone that sounds quite like them while providing greater wearing comfort.

With that said, though, they're the phones I listen to least; and I've actually pretty much made up my mind to sell them.

I just don't need all that bass...

 

On the other hand I love the DT 880's and recommend them very highly - but only if open phones are OK with you.

Though Beyer terms them "semi-open", they're effectively open and do let in outside sound very easily.

So, yes - plenty of sound leakage.

(As I was reminded again just about an hour ago when wearing mine.)

 

The DT770 has an entirely different sound signature than the DT880.

It's a closed phone that puts out a lot of bass.

The build quality is excellent, but you've got to like bass to enjoy them.

Isolation is very good, but not great due to the velour pads.

 

 

The E7 is definitely worth the few extra $ over the E11 if you're going to be using it with

your computer.  Again, because the E7 is an amplifier plus a DAC, whereas the E11 is

solely an amplifier (without a DAC).

 

 

 

 


Yes i've kind of realized that i am being quite picky in this regard. Haha, but then again, i feel like many people on here are the same way.  Maybe if i can find a place that includes a case with dt770s ill just go with them, otherwise they would be too difficult to cart around. Have you tried the 770s personally, if so how would you describe bass, is it a thump kind of bass or more of a clarity kind of thing, if you know what i mean.... And how does it compare to the ath m50s, I've seen that you've owned these as well. How did you like them??

 

I really wish i could a get an open, this decision would be soo much easier and id just go with the 880s, but alas the sound leakage would be just too much for a person sitting next to me.

 

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post #24 of 43
2/1/12 at 5:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post

Well i think I've pretty much narrowed it down to either the Beyerdynamic dt770 80s despite the mobility hinderance, and the Audio-Technica ath-m50(s). The ultrasones just don't seem like they have the comfort im looking for. Unless someone can comment otherwise? Maybe something you can deal with? and the m50s are pretty good across all genres, and the look decent.  The beyers seem to be pretty good across most as well, of course they are weaker in some but not absolutely terrible. 

 

Can anyone explain to me what the bass is like on either or both of these models, i get that its uneven or muddy feeling some of the times. But i am referring more towards how the bass actually feels, like can you feel the rumble at least a little? Or is it more that you can just hear the real notes?

 

If someone can try, to compare it more to consumer brands like beats or souls and their bass as a reference point. Probably not as tight but just how they compare, you know what i mean? Like the thump factor you can get from them.

 

Honestly ive been glancing at the souls sl150 and heard they are not completely terrible at least not as bad as beats for sound. I know obviously not audiophile grade, but they are kinda just like a very last resort type of headphone if im not completely sold on anything else

 

Thanks



Neither of them will have the sheer, overwhelming bass thump of the Beats. However, both will have actual good bass. To most of us here on Head-Fi, we'd rather have slightly accentuated, accurate bass than wild, inaccurate bass.

 

While it's true the Soul is a better value than the Beats, they're still pretty bad for the price range. The M50 and DT770 are in another realm altogether.

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post #25 of 43
2/1/12 at 5:59pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssrock64 View Post



Neither of them will have the sheer, overwhelming bass thump of the Beats. However, both will have actual good bass. To most of us here on Head-Fi, we'd rather have slightly accentuated, accurate bass than wild, inaccurate bass.

 

While it's true the Soul is a better value than the Beats, they're still pretty bad for the price range. The M50 and DT770 are in another realm altogether.


Alright so if i got this right, they don't have the overwhelming bass of beats or souls, but they have much better quality? I'm assuming that by the amount of bass that is inferred from many people on these two head phones, that they do at least have a thump a good thump to them? specifically on songs where it was meant to be? maybe not so much where it wasnt? Which is really what I'm looking more for. .

 

edit: i also see that you own the m50s, do you like them? At least are they a very good entry level can with close to what i want: excels in pop ect, but can still perform well in most other genres? How about the portability and comfort how would you rate it?


Edited by alza - 2/1/12 at 6:06pm
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post #26 of 43
2/1/12 at 6:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post



I just took a look at these actually because the ultrasone seem like a pretty solid choice for what i want in my headphone. Do you have the Dj-1 pros? If you do how are the comfort on them? I've seen a lot about ultrasones not being very comfortable for long listening sessions. Just wanted to know your opinion on that aspect. Also how is the bass on them? Are they tight and and clear? Or kind of muddy, does it have at least a small oomph that you can feel? How does the amp increase this? They do look pretty good though, well best looking ultrasone model imo at least.



 

Yep, I have the DJ-1 Pros.

 

Comfort isn't their strong point. They don't clamp too hard, so I don't get sore ears, but I find that the padding on the top is too stiff, so the headphones start to weigh down on myhead after a while. They are fine for a couple hours but after that they get uncomfortable and I have to take a break.

 

The bass is excellent. It has enough presence to rumble and make you feel like your head is vibrating on tracks with deep bass. I love this, because good bass can be a pretty physical sensation. They certainly aren't boomy or muddy at all, in fact I can pick out vocals and individual percussion tracks even on very bass heavy tracks.

 

As I said, the Pro's are pretty easily driven so they don't need an amp, but I like to use the E11 just because it makes the lows that much better. The E11 has 3 bass boost settings, off, low and high. I usually keep it on low. High is amazing for electronic music, but it's too much bass for anything else, and I feel as though some detail is lost in the high end.

 

A big part of why I like these headphones is because I like the look of them. I think the DJ-1 Pro delivers what the Beats were advertised as. Stylish, high quality headphones with a strong low end.

 

Edit: wow I missed a lot of posts. While I haven't tried them, the M50'S were the other headphone I had originally considered getting. With your budget you might even be able to afford their bigger brother, the ATH-PRO700MK2.


Edited by Vheissu - 2/1/12 at 6:13pm
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post #27 of 43
2/1/12 at 6:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alza View Post


Alright so if i got this right, they don't have the overwhelming bass of beats or souls, but they have much better quality? I'm assuming that by the amount of bass that is inferred from many people on these two head phones, that they do at least have a thump specifically on songs where it was meant to be? maybe not so much where it wasnt?

 

On the Beats Solo, for example, every song I play, no matter what it sounds like in the original recording, has random bass weight. When listening to pure acoustic guitar, the lower tones thumped instead of vibrated. That's no sign of a good headphone. When listening to some ambient stuff by Sigur Ros, it gave random bass weight to background static. That's no sign of a good headphone.

 

The M50 and DT770 are a different beast altogether. Instead of ruining good music with added-in, muddy bass where there shouldn't be any, they attempt to accurately portray the bass. It's tight and controlled (compared to Beats), not muddy and overbearing. That in no way means that they have no impact, but it mean they only have impact where there should be impact.

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post #28 of 43
2/1/12 at 6:27pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssrock64 View Post

On the Beats Solo, for example, every song I play, no matter what it sounds like in the original recording, has random bass weight. When listening to pure acoustic guitar, the lower tones thumped instead of vibrated. That's no sign of a good headphone. When listening to some ambient stuff by Sigur Ros, it gave random bass weight to background static. That's no sign of a good headphone.

 

The M50 and DT770 are a different beast altogether. Instead of ruining good music with added-in, muddy bass where there shouldn't be any, they attempt to accurately portray the bass. It's tight and controlled (compared to Beats), not muddy and overbearing. That in no way means that they have no impact, but it mean they only have impact where there should be impact.

 

Alright good exactly the type of sound i was going for! Do you have a preference or suggestion on one of these two, I'm so torn. The beyers are more comfortable and seems better soundstage and maybe a little better tighter in the low end and highs? The m50s are easily more portable and seem to have the better mids and maybe more easily go with all types of music. Maybe a little more engaging fun can? If i go with beyer im definitely getting an amp probably an e7 its only 20 bucks more and it seems to have some better options, not too sure on that though. also need to find a place that includes a case as well. If i get the m50 ill probably get an amp any way probs the e11 though. But maybe you could give me your suggestion or which you would chose of these two headphones?
 

 


Edited by alza - 2/1/12 at 6:28pm
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post #29 of 43
2/1/12 at 8:10pm
Thread Starter 

Well after reading a few threads on here on other sites general consensus is dt770s 80s> ath m50s in almost every aspect, mainly except portability, as long as you amp them. Now i just need to decide what amp to go with.

 

Any suggestions?? something that can be used with and ipod and pc, >100$. something that can control the sometimes wild bass of these things. thinking either the

e7s or e11s. not dead set on it though

 

Also, big difference in bass quantity with the 250 ohm version, read a thread on it, but i was still a little bit confused?

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post #30 of 43
2/2/12 at 1:34am
Quote:

Originally Posted by alza View Post

 

Any suggestions?? something that can be used with and ipod and pc, >100$. something that can control the sometimes wild bass of these things. thinking either the

e7s or e11s. not dead set on it though

 

Also, big difference in bass quantity with the 250 ohm version, read a thread on it, but i was still a little bit confused?


The E7 is OK in terms of power if you get the 80 Ohm version, it can output a maximum of about 40 mW into that. It has a low (< 1 Ohm) output impedance, so in theory the bass bloat is minimized (but the DT770-80 is nevertheless bass heavy from anything). For 250 Ohm, the more powerful E11 (or E17 if you have the budget, and need a DAC as well) is a safer choice.

 

I have not heard the 80 Ohm version, so I cannot comment on exactly how much more bass it has.

One difference between these that may be relevant from a practical point of view is that the 80 Ohm has a long straight cord, while the 250 Ohm one is coiled.

 


Edited by stv014 - 2/2/12 at 1:37am
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