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The Nameless Guide To PC Gaming Audio (with binaural headphone surround sound) - Page 172

post #2566 of 3714

Belial.. tbh  most of us here on Head-Fi will find it difficult to help out with motherboard audio. We all look down on it for good reason (and we are not snobs no way): namely it's motherboard audio. To kick off, a motherboard that claims it can amp a 600 ohm headphone is quite frankly laughable - no offence. it's not going to happen.

 

Also the DAC's used are difficult to pin down quality wise.. so many variations....... maybe one day they will be really good, but not now. I've tested out a great set of headphones on one the best of mobos  (SupremeFX)... and no... sorry.. not good.


Edited by SaLX - 2/1/14 at 5:11pm
post #2567 of 3714

I don't understand what you are getting at. You are saying with your 600ohm supremefx onboard audio, your headphones impedence was too great and caused it to be too quiet? 

 

The guide is just hard to follow, it says a lot about 'this uses that' but i dunno what it's recommending or getting at. I dont understand half the stuff in it, 

 

Quote:
 

-Rapture3D. A software OpenAL driver from Blue Ripple Sound, and as such it only works on OpenAL games. It's listed here because it offers binaural mixing regardless of your hardware, with no less than six different HRTFs to choose from! Unfortunately, for Vista/Win7, enabling this option over headphones requires setting Windows' speaker setting to stereo so that Rapture3D's speaker layout control panel can switch to "Headphone Stereo (Compat.)"; otherwise, it just outright refuses to switch. HRTF options can be found under the Decoder tab.

 

so... should I get this?

I mean i dont get it, do i have 3d sound already or no? Should I be downloading something? 

post #2568 of 3714

1. No soundcard (let alone a motherboard) will ever amp a 600 ohm headphone adequately ... thing is a 600 ohm headphone isn't the 'best' by any means. Modern headphones with fantastically high impedance don't equate to being good anymore. In fact, completely do not think about this.....

 

2. What headphone are you using? .. you may very well be getting great sound off your Mobo.. and yes you are getting 3D sound off it if configured correctly.

 

3. OpenAL?? You playing old games and stuff because pretty much that's what Open AL is for (apart from Bordelands 2)?  Other contributors here may well chime in to help you.

 

All told: don't worry :)

post #2569 of 3714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial88 View Post

I don't understand what you are getting at. You are saying with your 600ohm supremefx onboard audio, your headphones impedence was too great and caused it to be too quiet? 

The guide is just hard to follow, it says a lot about 'this uses that' but i dunno what it's recommending or getting at. I dont understand half the stuff in the guide.

Saying an amp is "600-Ohm headphone capable" is like saying a car is capable of 80 MPH. Sure a Toyota corolla might reach 80 MPH, but will it be driving well at that speed?And creating a pleasant experience for you? For amps It's more useful to find out the signal-to-noise ratio for sound clarity (an SB z-series card STARTS at 116dB) and the even more elusive spec about how many mW the amp puts out into a certain Ohm load.

When we talk amps for headphones, we don't care so much about loudness (not usually difficult), experienced users look for clarity, instrument separation, tight control, low distortion, and the objective ability for the sound to be created in a way that feels effortless.

I understand that the guide doesn't offer a lot of direction, just knowledge... but parts of it are really useful, and Nameless updates parts of it every once in a while. In between flight-sim games wink.gif

I would so much rather drive a Porsche at 80 mph than a neon, hell even my Golf drives much better.
Edited by Evshrug - 2/1/14 at 10:14pm
post #2570 of 3714
Quote:
1. No soundcard (let alone a motherboard) will ever amp a 600 ohm headphone adequately ... thing is a 600 ohm headphone isn't the 'best' by any means. Modern headphones with fantastically high impedance don't equate to being good anymore. In fact, completely do not think about this..... 


What about one with a 600ohm headphone amp like the DRV632 or TPA6120A2? 

 

Quote:

2. What headphone are you using? .. you may very well be getting great sound off your Mobo.. and yes you are getting 3D sound off it if configured correctly.

 

I'm currently using the 681 EVO, but I'm in the market for a sub-$200 headphone. It'd be my first, I just go the EVO this week for my gf. 

 

Quote:
 3. OpenAL?? You playing old games and stuff because pretty much that's what Open AL is for (apart from Bordelands 2)?  Other contributors here may well chime in to help you.

 

I was just quoting a random passage, I only play starcraft 2, which is directx9. I've been playing a bit of splinter cell blacklist recently though.

 

Quote:
 Sure a Toyota corolla might reach 80 MPH, but will it be driving well at that speed?A

 

Well... yea...80mph is easy for a go-cart that isn't limited. Maybe your example would be more example with 140mph+?

 

Quote:
 
I would so much rather drive a Porsche at 80 mph than a neon, hell even my Golf drives much better.

 

You mean you'd rather drive a porsche at 5mph than a neon?

post #2571 of 3714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial88 View Post
 

I'm a bit confused on what this guide is trying to say. Is it telling me to download something?

 

I have a Z87X-UD3H ALC898 with a DRV632 600 ohm headphone amp. As I understand, ALC898 is really good, and I have an amp onboard already, so I don't need a sound card because my sound is already super good. I don't really see any mention in the guide about this stuff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial88 View Post
 

I don't understand what you are getting at. You are saying with your 600ohm supremefx onboard audio, your headphones impedence was too great and caused it to be too quiet? 

 

The guide is just hard to follow, it says a lot about 'this uses that' but i dunno what it's recommending or getting at. I dont understand half the stuff in it, 

 

 

so... should I get this?

I mean i dont get it, do i have 3d sound already or no? Should I be downloading something? 

 

 

Belial88, you're making less and less sense with every post. You've asked some questions and you've gotten some feedback from people who are quite educated on the subject. It's sounding like you're trying to force an answer from them that you want to hear. What you have right now is an on-board codec in the form of ALC898 which generally sucks and you have some on-board amp that also generally sucks. Now will it work for you? Let's find out.

 

First, what are you trying to accomplish? Next, what headphone are you wanting to use? Are you using the Superlux HD-681 EVO or are you looking into something else? If so, what? After, we can figure out if what you have will work or not and what to do next.

post #2572 of 3714
Quote:
  What you have right now is an on-board codec in the form of ALC898 which generally sucks and you have some on-board amp that also generally sucks. Now will it work for you? Let's find out

 

No one really said it that straightforward, thanks. Is a sound card enough of an amp, er, will a sound card under $100 be better than the ALC898 + amp combo? Does my drv632 headphone amp improve quality much?

 

Quote:
 First, what are you trying to accomplish? Next, what headphone are you wanting to use? Are you using the Superlux HD-681 EVO or are you looking into something else? If so, what? After, we can figure out if what you have will work or not and what to do next.

 

Currently using the 681 evo but it's really a gift for my gf (just use it when she isnt around, when shes sleeping, that kind of thing, for now) but looking for a sub-$200, ideally under 150, headphones for myself. I listen to electronic (like justice, daft punk, kavinsky, not house or dubstep like bassnectar, skrillex, etc), general usage and media, sc2. Portability and isolation don't matter, these are literally just to replace some pc speakers I use. Comfort is very important as I use for 8+ hours at a time.

 

I'm currently looking at 558 vs MA900 vs DT990 pro. 

post #2573 of 3714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial88 View Post


What about one with a 600ohm headphone amp like the DRV632 or TPA6120A2? 


I'm currently using the 681 EVO, but I'm in the market for a sub-$200 headphone. It'd be my first, I just go the EVO this week for my gf. 


I was just quoting a random passage, I only play starcraft 2, which is directx9. I've been playing a bit of splinter cell blacklist recently though.


Well... yea...80mph is easy for a go-cart that isn't limited. Maybe your example would be more example with 140mph+?
–No, the point isn't how fast it goes (or how loud an amp can be), the point I was making was that a corolla accelerates to 80 mph slowly, is a loud buzzy mess, isn't steady at high speeds, it just feels like a strain while driving. If you read the part you didn't quote, you ought to understand that the motherboard audio leaves much to be desired and in what ways.

You mean you'd rather drive a porsche at 5mph than a neon?
Well, yes, but the point was that a Porsche simply handles speed in a much more refined way, even if you're never going to drive it's max speed.
post #2574 of 3714

I believe they're saying that just because your onboard audio has a headphone amp that says it will drive up to 600ohm's do not mean it will do a good job or supply enough power for the headphones that need it, Most of the times they never really list the full specs of the headphone amp ic that there using.The point of using a headphone amp for headphones that need it is to supply them with enough power so they sound the way they should and not sound off, it can get loud all it want but it means nothing if the headphones are not getting driven right,because then it just be a loud mess instead of the perfectly driven headphone. Lot of people think if it get loud then it good enough, that is not the case. The problem with most on-board audio is they cheap out here and there. Sure Some Z87 mobos doesn't do this like the gigabyte sniper broads But others do.

 

Only reason to keep using onboard if you are using optical and plugging into a external dac amp,then you just be getting the functions of the onboard and sending it over to a external dac amp. If your using analog then since your realtek isn't that good as you think it is, Your headphones wont get the full benfit until you plug it into a better source. I have used headphones off onboard audio in the past, that AD700 did not sound too hot, til it was plug into a sound card, which improved it greatly. You might not understand this now because you never used any thing else other then onboard as it seems. But once you do, you will understand.


Edited by genclaymore - 2/2/14 at 9:49am
post #2575 of 3714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belial88 View Post
 

Currently using the 681 evo but it's really a gift for my gf (just use it when she isnt around, when shes sleeping, that kind of thing, for now) but looking for a sub-$200, ideally under 150, headphones for myself. I listen to electronic (like justice, daft punk, kavinsky, not house or dubstep like bassnectar, skrillex, etc), general usage and media, sc2. Portability and isolation don't matter, these are literally just to replace some pc speakers I use. Comfort is very important as I use for 8+ hours at a time.

 

I'm currently looking at 558 vs MA900 vs DT990 pro. 

Ok. So we can assume that, because you are here, you're also wanting to make sure they work for not just music, but gaming as well. Correct?

 

In that case, let's do a very brief rundown what you should probably do. YUou'll want to look at upping your current directional audio capabilities. You can do this through almost any Sound Blaster or Xonar card and gain access to the CMSS-3D or Dolby Headphone codec which will be far superior to anything you have on-board. You need to think about what headphones you're using and if they need additional amping. All of the cans you listed above would do well with some sort of external amp, but depending on the card you pick, you may not need it. In this case, I would say pick the card first based on your needs and then pick a can based on the card and your needs.

post #2576 of 3714

I have a gaming pc and i am playing bf4 most of the time .So i would like to pair my akg k701 with a good sound card with build in headphone amp OR a sound card + external amp OR external sound card +external amp . One of these three if something is better that the other.

 

 

I would like good music playback but first i would like to have the best positioning audio when playing bf4 .

 

I dont like mess 3d sound with unspecific positions of tanks and helicopter and also loss of any footsteps .

post #2577 of 3714

Depending on where you are in the world you can find a Sound blaster Z cheap on ebay, Then I have seen Aune T1 usb dac amp around $140 on ebay which is a good choice.

post #2578 of 3714

Just checking before I fork it up.

 

I have a SB X-Fi Titanium HD and K612's at the mo. I have a JDS Labs O2 amp arriving for a bit more beef, and want to run that in between the card and the headphones.

 

Do I just use the HP out on the card straight to the amp in or should I use the optical out to to the amp. Bearing in mind that I want to continue using CMSS as my 3D positioning software, plus what settings should I use?

 

Cheers

motorwayne

Bandit Hunter

post #2579 of 3714
Quote:
Originally Posted by motorwayne View Post
 

Just checking before I fork it up.

 

I have a SB X-Fi Titanium HD and K612's at the mo. I have a JDS Labs O2 amp arriving for a bit more beef, and want to run that in between the card and the headphones.

 

Do I just use the HP out on the card straight to the amp in or should I use the optical out to to the amp. Bearing in mind that I want to continue using CMSS as my 3D positioning software, plus what settings should I use?

 

Cheers

motorwayne

Bandit Hunter

Titanium HD's RCA jacks to the input on the O2 amp.

So an RCA (red/white) to 3.5mm cable is what you need.

The Ti-HD's RCA output is the better analog audio signal to feed into external headphone amplifier.

The Ti-HD can send CMSS-3D headphone surround sound thru the RCA output.

post #2580 of 3714

This may well be a very silly question, but in Windows is this a right or wrong assumption?  Setting the 'Device' at 100% volume is clearly the way to go (ie with your Xonar, Creative or USB DAC).

 

My question is this: what of the application volume? If Internet Explorer, VLC, Youtube or WMP etc are at 50% say, but the Device volume is at 100%: will that degrade the audio to any noticeable degree (for a nerd)? IE: do you absolutely have to have both Device and Application volume at 100% for a perfect bitstream and solely controlled by the volume dial on your external Amp?

 

Thanks for any replies. Sometimes difficult to find out stuff by doing a search here.


Edited by SaLX - 2/4/14 at 7:33pm
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