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The Nameless Guide To PC Gaming Audio (with binaural headphone surround sound) - Page 90

post #1336 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by pric0 View Post

what could possibly be wrong? or should it be that way?

You've got your headphones plugged into a potato instead of the headphone jack.

 

Seriously though - if that's happening there was a link somewhere that outlines how t setup the computer, soundcard and games for the proper audio, hopefully someone can post a link.

post #1337 of 3067
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by David164v8 View Post
Hey, I'm about to buy a Titanium HD. From reading through this thread, this card is still the best for gaming? I was thinking of an Esscense ST/STX, but the I think the Titanium HD is nearly as good. Any advice before I buy this? Does the surround sound work well with Valve games? And does it affect Skype? (Dolby Headphone on my DG ruined the sound of Skype completely) Also, will I have any driver problems? I'm on Windows 8 64-Bit.

 

I'd still say it's the best for gaming overall, maybe save for the Onkyo SE-300PCIE or the Auzentech X-Fi HomeTheater HD (the latter only if you need HDMI output).

 

For Valve games, you generally want to point ALchemy to the game's root directory, and enter "snd_legacy_surround 1" in the console.

 

It'll affect Skype or anything else that produces sound, but neither CMSS-3D Headphone nor Dolby Headphone utterly ruins Skype or other VoIP apps for me while I'm gaming.

 

I don't recall having any driver issues with the Win8 Release Preview, but the final version may be different for all I know.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by pric0 View Post

the thing is, im pretty sure my hearing is fine, but what im not sure, is about how ive setup the sound system.

since when i check the sound through the creative console: http://i.imgur.com/dCfVKcB.png

i can hear a sound only when the bar is on the top left and the top right speaker sign.

it's the same for any sound setting (2/4/5/7).

 

what could possibly be wrong? or should it be that way?

 

No, something is DEFINITELY wrong if you can only hear the front left/right channels.

 

For that matter, you should be seeing an image resembling headphones on a head outline in the X-Fi Console Launcher, as that's what you get when you've set the X-Fi to Headphones. You do your speaker tests in the Windows sound control panel, NOT the X-Fi Console Launcher or Control Panel. There, it's quite easy to tell that the surround channels do play through the headphones, regardless of the CMSS-3D setting.

 

Read this guide to understand what I'm getting at here. Make sure you scroll all the way down for the relevant picture if it's a real X-Fi card with Game Mode, as that's what you want to be using if possible.


Edited by NamelessPFG - 2/16/13 at 1:18am
post #1338 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPFG View Post

 

I'd still say it's the best for gaming overall, maybe save for the Onkyo SE-300PCIE or the Auzentech X-Fi HomeTheater HD (the latter only if you need HDMI output).

 

For Valve games, you generally want to point ALchemy to the game's root directory, and enter "snd_legacy_surround 1" in the console.

 

It'll affect Skype or anything else that produces sound, but neither CMSS-3D Headphone nor Dolby Headphone utterly ruins Skype or other VoIP apps for me while I'm gaming.

 

I don't recall having any driver issues with the Win8 Release Preview, but the final version may be different for all I know.

 

 

No, something is DEFINITELY wrong if you can only hear the front left/right channels.

 

For that matter, you should be seeing an image resembling headphones on a head outline in the X-Fi Console Launcher, as that's what you get when you've set the X-Fi to Headphones. You do your speaker tests in the Windows sound control panel, NOT the X-Fi Console Launcher or Control Panel. There, it's quite easy to tell that the surround channels do play through the headphones, regardless of the CMSS-3D setting.

 

Read this guide to understand what I'm getting at here. Make sure you scroll all the way down for the relevant picture if it's a real X-Fi card with Game Mode, as that's what you want to be using if possible.

is there possibility the card is corrupted or fake? cause i dont get the 7 channels nor quad or 5, only 2. and yes, i tested it exactly as this guide that you've shown, same effects as with the console launcher.. i think im going to cramp this card way up this store's butthole.

 

one mention.. when i tested the 7 channels on the windows configuration, it showed the bar going up on each channel but didnt have any noise (except for the stereo channels).

 

btw, i deactivated the built-in motherboard audio so it wont collide with the sound card, can it harm this feature (i know this sounds silly but... i dont know what im actually doing).

 

Edit: i think i somehow managed to activate full 7.1

ive put the "Headphone" option in the console launcher,

and activated the 7.1 in the windows sound configuration


Edited by pric0 - 2/16/13 at 1:58am
post #1339 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperCzar View Post

I rewrote the steps into an actual guide. Crosspost from the MLE thread:

 

Here's how to do the handoff of CMSS processed output completely in software:


Before following this checklist, make sure your current audio device is fully configured for CMSS (Windows configure speakers wizard is done and set to a surround setup, Creative Console speakers set to headphones, CMSS-3D is enabled, Crystalizer is disabled, "Disable Sound Blaster enhancements" under the Sound Blaster tab of your default audio device's properties is unchecked). I like unchecking the sub in the Windows wizard here to create a virtual 5.0 rather than a virtual 5.1 because I think it may help tame the overbearing bass some of you were talking about on the 770 80 ohms. The Beyers are already mashing together the bass output from the other 5 virtual channels into a pair of very bass-capable headphones, do you really need a virtual sub as well? Also, as we all know, subwoofer bass position is something your brain can't pinpoint, so I don't see why you'd want lots of it in your pinpoint accurate virtual surround. I think I remember hearing a noticeable difference with this changed in my limited A-B testing with a ripped BD of Evangellion 1.11 (the last battle scene has explosions and technobabbling jumping ALL over every channel when I listen with my physical 5.1 Acoustic Research HC6, so far it's by far the best test of virtual surround I've tried yet), but I wish I had another pair of Beyers to do a real A-B and not rely on my terrible memory/imagination.

 

1. Right click on your volume tray in Windows 7 and select "Recording devices"

2. Select "What U Hear" and click "Properties" (cringe inducing grammar there Creative)

[Note - you do NOT have to set this as the default recording device]

3. Select the "Listen" tab and check the box marked "Listen to this device"

4. Under the drop down marked "Playback through this device:" select your desired DAC

5. Make sure "Continue running when on battery power" is selected as a software passthrough should have no effect whatsoever on your battery life

6. Select the "Levels" tab and set it to something comfortable, as the volume control for the Creative card's standard output will have no effect on the volume of the software recording device.

7. Enjoy listening to CMSS freed from the noisy and inferior hardware confines of your internal soundcard!

 

In other news, I've been trying to figure out whether I can use the Windows 5.1 balance setting to adjust the virtual surround. It doesn't work in the Creative headphone test, but I think that might just be a recording. If I can use that balance menu to adjust the volume of the virtual surround mix and turn up the rear speakers, that would be really nice. Don't know if that would work in combination with the Creative handoff to another DAC though, even if it did indeed work on the CMSS virtual surround in the first place.

 

What does this do exactly? What does using a sound as a DSP to output to any audio device mean in noob terms? Sorry I'm really new to some things.

post #1340 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwelveTrains View Post

What does this do exactly? What does using a sound as a DSP to output to any audio device mean in noob terms? Sorry I'm really new to some things.

It means you can use stuff like CMSS-3D with an external DAC.

 

 

So I was wondering... How do I enable EAX with my Titanium HD? I recently started playing KOTOR, and it says EAX is disabled in the audio options menu. I believe it's the same deal with Thief:DS. I have it on game mode with CMSS-3D enabled.

post #1341 of 3067

You have to use Alchemy for older game titles that are Direct sound based, when your under vista/7/8. When you do, you beable to re-enable EAX in those games.

post #1342 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by genclaymore View Post

You have to use Alchemy for older game titles that are Direct sound based, when your under vista/7/8. When you do, you beable to re-enable EAX in those games.

Ah I see, I thought that was just for OpenAL. Thanks, I'll give that a shot.

post #1343 of 3067
Thread Starter 

OpenAL doesn't need ALchemy in the first place; in fact, it's why ALchemy works, wrapping DS3D calls into OpenAL like dgVoodoo or nGlide wraps 3dfx Glide calls into Direct3D or OpenGL.

 

Knights of the Old Republic and Thief: Deadly Shadows are both DirectSound3D-based, so they need it.

post #1344 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPFG View Post

OpenAL doesn't need ALchemy in the first place; in fact, it's why ALchemy works, wrapping DS3D calls into OpenAL like dgVoodoo or nGlide wraps 3dfx Glide calls into Direct3D or OpenGL.

 

Knights of the Old Republic and Thief: Deadly Shadows are both DirectSound3D-based, so they need it.

Thanks for the info.

 

So is it only for old games really? Or is DS3D still used in some games?

post #1345 of 3067

Funny enough Test Drive Unlimited 2 has the option for Direct Sound hal, but it wouldn't let me use it and kept reverting back to Xaudio2. I think it was just teasing me, as it know I don't Xaudio2.I was gonna use alchemy with it, if it allowed me to set it to DS from Xaudio2.


Edited by genclaymore - 2/18/13 at 1:07pm
post #1346 of 3067

Well ALchemy is surprisingly easy to work with. I was worried about having to press more than one button.

post #1347 of 3067

So I could use SniperCzar's "What U Hear" workaround to send my X-Fi Titanium's CCSM-3D to say a Schiit Bifrost via toslink for gaming? And then when I listen to music would I have to uncheck the "Listen to this device" in "What U Hear" and switch to Entertainment mode on the Creative Panel?

 

I was going to just use my X-Fi Titanium as a DAC and then send it to a Schiit Asgard via 3.5mm to RCA, but if this workaround allows me to use a higher quality DAC such as the Bifrost without losing any quality then I'm all for it.

 

By the way, I've heard a lot of talk about ASIO and WASAPI, and I'm not sure if that is something I have or should be using...? I have Windows 7.

 

I apologize for noobishness. Everyone has been a great help on these forums so far and I think I am almost there.

post #1348 of 3067

You'll loose performance and I'm not sure that it will provide that much of a benefit. I'm not certain of the audiophile buzz about DACs, but the technical specs don't seem much different.

post #1349 of 3067
Thread Starter 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by chewy4 View Post

So is it only for old games really? Or is DS3D still used in some games?

 

Given that DS3D was axed with Windows Vista, it's generally unused. Even before its release, some games like Battlefield 2 and Doom 3 started making the transition to OpenAL.

 

However, pretty much every Source engine game has the "snd_legacy_surround" command, which switches the Miles Sound System to DS3D output. Valve may have implemented OpenAL natively in the meantime, but I don't think it's used for the Windows builds for whatever reason.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TwelveTrains View Post

So I could use SniperCzar's "What U Hear" workaround to send my X-Fi Titanium's CCSM-3D to say a Schiit Bifrost via toslink for gaming? And then when I listen to music would I have to uncheck the "Listen to this device" in "What U Hear" and switch to Entertainment mode on the Creative Panel?

 

I was going to just use my X-Fi Titanium as a DAC and then send it to a Schiit Asgard via 3.5mm to RCA, but if this workaround allows me to use a higher quality DAC such as the Bifrost without losing any quality then I'm all for it.

 

By the way, I've heard a lot of talk about ASIO and WASAPI, and I'm not sure if that is something I have or should be using...? I have Windows 7.

 

I apologize for noobishness. Everyone has been a great help on these forums so far and I think I am almost there.

 

Toslink/optical S/PDIF? You don't even need the SniperCzar trick for that. All it takes is to check "Play Stereo Mix using Digital Output" in the X-Fi control panel.

 

The SniperCzar "What U Hear"/Stereo Mix trick is needed only if you're using a USB-only DAC. Even then, I'm not sure if the difference would be worth it.

 

Also, I don't use Entertainment Mode at all. If pure music playback is what you want, I'd actually suggest using Audio Creation Mode to enable ASIO support, then enabling bit-matched playback and using a media player with an ASIO output plugin, like Winamp or foobar2000. (Personally, I don't hear enough of a difference to warrant switching out of Game Mode all the time, so I just use Winamp with an OpenAL output plugin.)

 

WASAPI exclusive mode doesn't allow bit-matched playback on X-Fi cards for some reason (the sample rate setting doesn't change in Audio Creation Mode), and of course, it prevents other applications from playing audio at all while the media player has exclusive mode active.

post #1350 of 3067
Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPFG View Post

 

Given that DS3D was axed with Windows Vista, it's generally unused. Even before its release, some games like Battlefield 2 and Doom 3 started making the transition to OpenAL.

 

However, pretty much every Source engine game has the "snd_legacy_surround" command, which switches the Miles Sound System to DS3D output. Valve may have implemented OpenAL natively in the meantime, but I don't think it's used for the Windows builds for whatever reason.

Is that the only way to get 3D sound in source games including CS:GO? That seems a little tricky with a Creative card since the source games don't showup on the list for ALchemy.

 

I'd say that I hope they have OpenAL native by the time HL3(or Ep3, whatever they end up calling it) comes out, but I'm sure that there will not only be a new form of 3D sound by then but we will have also transcended beyond physical forms and will only exist as energy that is not restricted by the bounds of three dimensions.

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