The diary entries of a little girl nearing 30! - Page 403  

Quote:

Originally Posted by barleyguy 

I'm also skeptical when it comes to audiophile DAPs.  Part of the reason is because the 5.5 Gen iPods have one of the top Wolfson DACs in them, and those are available on eBay for not a lot of money.  You can load RockBox, and they will handle all of the Codecs of an expensive DAP.  And it's easy to upgrade the storage, battery, etc.  It's also easy to use an LOD to get better gain staging.  So, really, I think this is one of those cases where something is considered better partly because it's more expensive.

 

That said, I do also have an iRiver H140, and the optical input and output is really handy.  I use the optical in to record from a computer (Pandora etc.) without having to mess with rip software.  So my iRiver is primarily used as a recording device.  The iRiver optical out can be used to an optical DAC, and I do that occasionally, but my 5.5G iPod Video has a better UI and sounds really good, and holds a lot more music.

Sorry to say I completely disagree with you here. I've directly compared the ipod 5G to my former Sflo2 and the Sflo2 crushed the ipod. It's not funny how much better the Sflo2 was than it. The Studio V and DX100 I have are a big improvement even over the Sflo2 so there is absolutely no comparison. You'd have to hear it for yourself to know what I mean. But until you do its all speculation. Keep in mind the Studio V doesn't have the greatest DAC section out there yet it is much better sounding than your run-of-the-mill DAP. So it's not always what's under the hood, but how it is implemented. You can have a great DAC and have crappy internals, which will equate to mediocre sound.

I'm all for saving money and getting the best value (sound), but in this case it's not possible. Also your headphones will be a source of weakness when moving up the chain. If you have crappy headphones/IEMs don't expect the DAP to show you it's true potential either (as well as synergy). With sources such as my iphone4 and Sansa Fuze I use high bit rate mp3s as the difference in sound quality isn't enough to warrant the waste of space. On the DX100 and Studio V I strictly use FLAC as these devices are more revealing and warrant that extra space. To be honest the Sansa and iphone really get no love these days lol as I feel it's a waste of time to downgrade. Unless I'm in a real pinch I'll use them. Since the Studio V has about 55 hours of playback time, I don't see that happening :).

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee730 

 

 

Sorry to say I completely disagree with you here. I've directly compared the ipod 5G to my former Sflo2 and the Sflo2 crushed the ipod. It's not funny how much better the Sflo2 was than it. The Studio V and DX100 I have are a big improvement even over the Sflo2 so there is absolutely no comparison. You'd have to hear it for yourself to know what I mean. But until you do its all speculation. Keep in mind the Studio V doesn't have the greatest DAC section out there yet it is much better sounding than your run-of-the-mill DAP. So it's not always what's under the hood, but how it is implemented. You can have a great DAC and have crappy internals, which will equate to mediocre sound.

 

I'm all for saving money and getting the best value (sound), but in this case it's not possible. Also your headphones will be a source of weakness when moving up the chain. If you have crappy headphones/IEMs don't expect the DAP to show you it's true potential either (as well as synergy). With sources such as my iphone4 and Sansa Fuze I use high bit rate mp3s as the difference in sound quality isn't enough to warrant the waste of space. On the DX100 and Studio V I strictly use FLAC as these devices are more revealing and warrant that extra space. To be honest the Sansa and iphone really get no love these days lol as I feel it's a waste of time to downgrade. Unless I'm in a real pinch I'll use them. Since the Studio V has about 55 hours of playback time, I don't see that happening :).

I was mainly talking about going from the LOD out on an iPod to an amp.  I do realize the amp section in an iPod is somewhat mediocre, but I still contend that the DAC is very decent, and makes it out the Line Out just fine.  I haven't heard the Studio V or the DX100, but I've heard a couple of the HM series HifiMan DAPs as well as owning an iRiver.  I'll try to hear the DX100 sometime and give it an honest comparison.  Maybe there will be one at a Colorado meet or RMAF this year.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maxvla   Usually not. Creates more issues than it solves.

It's the degree to which the varnish seeps into the wood that affects the sound, right? I guess it doesn't get affected as much if it's a thick block of wood, like what these cups seem to be, but I imagine that if they actually designed the wood cups to be sufficiently thin, then the contribution of the varnish to the resonant properties of the wood would start to become an issue...

Quote:

Originally Posted by barleyguy 

 

I was mainly talking about going from the LOD out on an iPod to an amp.  I do realize the amp section in an iPod is somewhat mediocre, but I still contend that the DAC is very decent, and makes it out the Line Out just fine.  I haven't heard the Studio V or the DX100, but I've heard a couple of the HM series HifiMan DAPs as well as owning an iRiver.  I'll try to hear the DX100 sometime and give it an honest comparison.  Maybe there will be one at a Colorado meet or RMAF this year.

That sounds good. I have to admit the ipod with an amp is pretty darn good. The problem is the bulk one has to carry. But even through an amp I still didn't find it comparable to the Sflo2, but it was a nice improvement regardless. It would be nice if you also had an opportunity to hear some of the Hisound DAPs at a meet. Honestly if the Rocoo BA sounds anything like the Studio V then the market better beware lol. For price to performance their products have a lot of potential. If my Studio V didn't have hiss I would easily part with the DX100, although the DX100 is still the better device. But from a portable stand point and the fact that the Studio V still has really good sound quality it's enough for me to make that compromise. Then again the DX100 has the ability to power super power hungry headphones, even the HE6. So it really all comes down to what suites ones needs...

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee730 

 

That sounds good. I have to admit the ipod with an amp is pretty darn good. The problem is the bulk one has to carry. But even through an amp I still didn't find it comparable to the Sflo2, but it was a nice improvement regardless. It would be nice if you also had an opportunity to hear some of the Hisound DAPs at a meet. Honestly if the Rocoo BA sounds anything like the Studio V then the market better beware lol. For price to performance their products have a lot of potential. If my Studio V didn't have hiss I would easily part with the DX100, although the DX100 is still the better device. But from a portable stand point and the fact that the Studio V still has really good sound quality it's enough for me to make that compromise. Then again the DX100 has the ability to power super power hungry headphones, even the HE6. So it really all comes down to what suites ones needs...

See here's where me and you don't see eye to eye when it involves the world of DAP's. You're basing your decision on whats good and not solely on the sound quality while I'm basing my decision on a good DAP on which DAP with a good UI sounds the best. To me a DAP should be charge it up load it up and go with minimal thinking or setup involved on getting your playlists or music on the DAP. Apple products may not be the best sounding DAP's out there compared to boutique audiophile DAP's but their UI and their ease of use on the go has caused them to completely dominate the market. I really don't get it, a simple UI with playlists listing artists records and genres with proper tagging support should not be that hard to do but it seems every time a boutique DAP comes on the market the UI will always stink thereby frustrating the user experience. For instance, I was rather shocked there were so many bug reports with the DX100. Let's be completely honest buggy tag support, album track listings in reverse order, popping sounds when going from track to track, and music suddenly sounding like the chipmunks Xmas album are bugs that should never had seen the light of day. Come on iBasso it's Android you're using as your OS most of the dirty work was already done for you. They could have had a very killer sounding product with a great UI experience if they had only taken the time and looked into hiring one of the many talented developers from the Android community who could have done a far better job with the iBasso stock player.

True but apple also had its share of issues when it first released its products. The first iteration of iOS was barely even operable and plagued with  bugs so what you are saying goes for even apple.

Also the fact that apple is very controlling is one reason I am very turned off from their products. I should be able to connect my ipod to any Media program and easily upload playlists and such to it without being bothered with Clunky itunes. I had this feature in Media Monkey until the iOS update which rendered it useless. So I agree with you to an extend. Also when I went to sync one song recently (with itunes) I ended up erasing every song on my phone besides the song I just synced. That''s not very user friendly to me and just caused me a whole lot of inconvenience. I won't even bother syncing music to my phone at this point until Media Monkey can have full access to the phone once again. I am  done with the itunes nightmare for good. Not to mention I really never used the phone for music listening after getting the Studio V and DX100.

If you wanna talk ease of use and convenience the Sansa Fuze has that in spades even over the ipod, including sound quality at a fraction of the cost.

I used to agree with this statement a long time ago.  I've come to realize their 'closed garden' is what makes iOS work so well.  I really don't care for Android and it's (imho) sloppiness.  I'm also not a hacker or programmer of any sort, so I understand the appeal andriod has for those guys. Those are the same guys that prefer Linux over Windows as well.

All that being said, it's good to have choices and competition and I hope all these options stay around and get better for years to come.

But you see that closed garden mentality is making me have to hack my own device to get it to do what I want lol. I don't find this a good thing.


BTW I'm a windows user ;). It reminds me of the days when I had to hack nvidia drivers so I could use the phyx ability on the nVidia card (which I paid for) with my ATI card. I've long since done away with nVidia and their very shady business ethics. 7 failed mobos and several burned out cards, what a joke...

Quote:

Originally Posted by shotgunshane 

 

I used to agree with this statement a long time ago.  I've come to realize their 'closed garden' is what makes iOS work so well.  I really don't care for Android and it's (imho) sloppiness.  I'm also not a hacker or programmer of any sort, so I understand the appeal andriod has for those guys. Those are the same guys that prefer Linux over Windows as well.

 

All that being said, it's good to have choices and competition and I hope all these options stay around and get better for years to come.

Big +1 on that one. Here's hoping Windows 7 improves and starts to gain traction in the market. I also hope Hewlett Packard gets their crap together and puts out a WebOs handset/tablet that will make WebOs a player again. If either Apple or Android become the one and only mobile OS we're all in for a crappy ride.As it is RIM looks like it's going to get thrown out by the way side, which is a bad thing, and Nokia has effectively killed Symbian for Windows 7, more bad news for the market. Two very big players are in their twilight years.

Would be like when nVidia was controlling the market and charging a super premium for mediocre products :P.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee730 

But you see that closed garden mentality is making me have to hack my own device to get it to do what I want lol. I don't find this a good thing.


BTW I'm a windows user ;). It reminds me of the days when I had to hack nvidia drivers so I could use the phyx ability on the nVidia card (which I paid for) with my ATI card. I've long since done away with nVidia and their very shady business ethics. 7 failed mobos and several burned out cards, what a joke...

Since NVidia doesn't manufacture anything, it's hard to blame that on them.  Well, unless the design was to blame.  The chips are made by TSMC, and the boards are made by board vendors.  All NVidia does is design stuff and write the drivers.

I'm not saying I will buy their stuff either, but that's because I have a bias towards ATI / AMD, even at those times when it makes a minimal amount of sense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by barleyguy 

Since NVidia doesn't manufacture anything, it's hard to blame that on them.  Well, unless the design was to blame.  The chips are made by TSMC, and the boards are made by board vendors.  All NVidia does is design stuff and write the drivers.

 

I'm not saying I will buy their stuff either, but that's because I have a bias towards ATI / AMD, even at those times when it makes a minimal amount of sense.

For me ATI has meant less problems and more performance for less money. Also since my computer had so many issues I made dell replace my PC (Dell XPS730) with an Alienware Area 51. Everything was upgraded, including the cards. I told them no nVidia rubbish in my machine. Got upgraded from dual 9800GT to dual 6870s, i7, water cooling, the works ;).

Quote:

Originally Posted by barleyguy   Since NVidia doesn't manufacture anything, it's hard to blame that on them.  Well, unless the design was to blame.  The chips are made by TSMC, and the boards are made by board vendors.  All NVidia does is design stuff and write the drivers.

That's not the whole story, though; although TSMC and board manufacturers make the stuff, if it's nVidia branded, then nVidia dictates how well or not well built a certain chip or board is made. With respect to chips, it's rarely ever the foundry's fault. They just take a design and put it through the right lithography techniques to get them on the right wafers. This type of manufacturing is so precise that you will never see any problems unless its the yield of the ratio of good/bad chips, which is only reflected in pricing. If the chip itself has heating or tunneling issues, then it's a design flaw and that's the fault of nVidia. With regard to motherboards or graphics cards, if a Sapphire, Asus, or whatever brand board fails, then yes, it's that manufacturer's fault, but if it's an nVidia-branded graphics card, even if it's produced by another company, the responsibility rests on nVidia to find the most reliable OEM.