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HD-280s for monitoring use not really floating my boat, some advice needed? :)

post #1 of 14
1/5/12 at 2:00am
Thread Starter 

Hello guys, I'm new here so please be gentle wink.gif

 

A little background on me before I get into my issues.  I'm into music production and have a home studio setup here.  I'm running a RME Fireface UC audio interface (which includes a good headphone pre) and was looking to get myself a good new pair of phones for recording vocals and especially for monitoring & mixing.  My primary monitors are a pair of ADAM A7s which I absolutely love.  The ADAMs have ribbon tweeters and have an incredibly tight sound from the bass right up to the highs.

 

In my recent quest to find a good pair of phones, I (unfortunately) recently purchased a pair of HD-280s after checking out a good amount of headphones at a local consumer retailer.  Unfortunately, they didn't really stock any high end headphones so the HD-280s came out on top and I thought they sounded good in the store.  Admittedly, I also did not do any research on phones before making my purchase (which is highly unusual for me) and so didn't know what else was out there.

 

After getting my pair, I've now burned them in for around 40 hours and still I find that there's a hole in the frequency spectrum at roughly the 100 Hz mark.  The subbass is overpowering and there's a lack of sparkle in the high end, though I don't mind the treble.  The isolation is excellent but I do also find them relatively uncomfortable, even after stretching the headband over a smaller box I have here.

 

So after reading sooooooooooooo many pages on the web about which headphones are best, I have gotten a shortlist together and a few concepts.

 

  1. I could keep these phones just for recording vocalists and voiceovers (due to their excellent isolation) and purchase a pair of open headphones for monitoring
  2. Get rid of the HD-280s and get a good pair of closed headphones

 

Price Range is around $400 AU max and here are some of the models that seem to have made my "short" (??) list...

 

  • AKG Q701 [Open]
  • Audio-Technica ATH-M50 [Closed]
  • Audio Technica ATH-AD700 [Open]
  • Beyerdynamic DT250 [Closed]
  • Beyerdynamic DT880 [Semi-Open]
  • KRK KNS 8400 [Closed]
  • Shure SRH 840 [Closed]
  • Shure SRH 940 [Closed]
  • Sennheiser HD-595 [Open]
  • Sennheiser HD-598 [Open]
  • Sennheiser HD-600 [Open]
 
I plan to audition as many of these as possible but there's only a few available at a number of stores here which I can't get to for another week or so due to personal commitments, so I was hoping to get your feedback.
 
I can't find much about the DT250 and HD-595 on the web.  It seems that the M50 and SRH 840 are the most popular.  The HD-600 seems to be known for its accuracy and looking at the plots on headphone.com, I can see why biggrin.gif
 
Here are some plots against the HD-600s
 
graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=573&graphID[]=2931&graphID[]=2941&graphID[]=2661
 
graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=573&graphID[]=223&graphID[]=963&graphID[]=2961
 
graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=573&graphID[]=913&graphID[]=3101&graphID[]=2851
 
No frequency plot found for the HD-595 frown.gif
 
Some notes about the plots (assuming their accuracy)...
 
  • The AD-700s & DT-250s have a bad bass response (?)
  • The M50s although relatively good for a closed phone are a little muddy in the bass region
  • The KRK phones have a mountain of a bass response (I've read people questioning this particular graph's accuracy)
  • The DT-250s have a dull treble response and don't extend out enough
  • The SRH840's have a slight bass boost compared to other models
 
Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated!
 
Thanks a lot for reading!
zambz

 

 


Edited by zambz - 1/5/12 at 2:15am
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post #2 of 14
1/5/12 at 4:30am

I own the HD580/HD600, K701 and DT880 and, in my opinion, the DT880 is the most suitable for monitoring work. Very detailed, relatively neutral (spike at around 9khz) and comfortable. It's completely open though. A good closed can you could check out is the FA-003 or HM5 (if the HM5 proves to be a rebranded FA-003). This is a closed headphone with a pretty neutral sig. I got a HM5 on the way so can't comment on this yet though. The new Shure 940 is supposed to be pretty good as well, but again, I haven't heard this one yet so can't recommend it. Could be worth auditioning though. In studios you see a lot of AKG K272's too...

 

No headphone will give you that A7 sound though, I think. I am quite familiar with the A8x and nothing has come close so far. Then again, I've only seen headphones in a studio environment being used to really zoom in on an instrument or frequency. All overall monitoring, mixing and mastering is speaker-only. 

 

EDIT: Beyerdynamic DT48e could be of interest as well. 


Edited by Negakinu - 1/5/12 at 4:36am
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post #3 of 14
1/5/12 at 4:44am
Thread Starter 

 

Thank you so much for the feedback! Out of interest, have you heard the HD-280 Pro's and if so, how do the 3 open headphones you own compare in sound?
 
I totally know what you mean about not being able to get the ADAM sound in headphones, I'm just looking for that tightness (that amazing focus that the ADAMs have) and also the low end extension that I don't get on the A7s to double check my bass region.
 
Unfortunately, the store I was looking at checking out these headphones at only has the DT770 and DT990 pro on display frown.gif  I'll have to look further to see if any other store has the DT880 for listening.
 
It's pretty hard to find one store with most of these phones I'm afraid.

Edited by zambz - 1/5/12 at 4:45am
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post #4 of 14
1/5/12 at 5:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zambz View Post

 

Thank you so much for the feedback! Out of interest, have you heard the HD-280 Pro's and if so, how do the 3 open headphones you own compare in sound?
 
I totally know what you mean about not being able to get the ADAM sound in headphones, I'm just looking for that tightness (that amazing focus that the ADAMs have) and also the low end extension that I don't get on the A7s to double check my bass region.
 
Unfortunately, the store I was looking at checking out these headphones at only has the DT770 and DT990 pro on display frown.gif  I'll have to look further to see if any other store has the DT880 for listening.
 
It's pretty hard to find one store with most of these phones I'm afraid.


I actually have a broken 6 year old HD280pro in the drawer. Never used it much and ended up taking it apart to see if I could mod it. Failure ensued. :) It was one of my first "real" headphones, together with the Grado SR60i. The only thing the HD280pro had going for it was it's isolation. It was very uncomfortable, looked ridiculous, sounded plasticky, boxy and congested and was just an overal waste of money. I found out I could get about the same SQ for $30 in the Superlux HD662. And the HD662 is more comfortable too. It's hard for me to compare it directly to my current headphones because, well, it's broken, I haven't heard it in years and it's like comparing apples and oranges. The HD280pro is a closed, budget headphone with a close, budget sound. :) My current cans are mid-fi and open. 

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post #5 of 14
1/5/12 at 5:44am

My vote goes to the akg k701/2  with good powerful amp like G100 it is very neutral and revealing, spacious, imaging is second to none, no spikes in freq and very similar to Adams in terms of sonic quality. Off course if you take into account headphone vs speaker presentation, but akg make's it very close. 

 

If you have bigger budget maybe you should consider hd800.....

 

 

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post #6 of 14
1/5/12 at 5:58am

This could be an interesting article for you. It's just one guy's opinion ofcourse, but still makes for a decent read. 

 

http://www.headfonia.com/old-school-trio-akg-k701-beyer-dt880-sennheiser-hd650/

 

 

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post #7 of 14
1/5/12 at 6:54am

I use the K-702 with Mogami cable for the last 3 years, as well I have the Adams 7 A and they work great as a studio set. I've check out the baby face hps output, and is very week to drive well the K-702. Maybe the Fireface UC hps output is better, but I'm not sure this is the case.You'll need a nice SS amp to drive the K702, or the HD-600/DT-880. 

 

Here more info: http://www.head-fi.org/t/393139/k702-in-the-studio

Mogami cable for the K-702: http://www.head-fi.org/t/378255/akg-k702-build-your-own-cable

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post #8 of 14
1/5/12 at 8:02am

Are you looking for a neutral refrence monitor, an open headphone, or a closed one with extra bass? First decide what type of headphone you want, then decide which to consider.

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post #9 of 14
1/5/12 at 11:52pm
Thread Starter 

 

Hey guys! :)
 
Negakinu: Thanks for your comments on the HD 280 and the article link (checking that out now).  You summarise my thoughts on it very well.  In fact, my in-ear CX 300 II's sound a lot better than the HD-280s.  Much more balanced low end and similar isolation levels.  I often use thom te double check tracks after my monitors ... maybe I should just buy another pair of those? hehehe wink.gif
 
loopfreak: Cheers for the thoughts on AKG, I think they look particularly awesome and assuming they do have the accuracy too, it should be a no brainer.  I still can't find one place here in Melbourne Australia that has them or the DT880s available for listening though (everyone has DT770 and DT990s instead ... ) frown.gif  Don't think I can justify extending to the HD-800 to be honest.
 
Acix: That's a shame regarding the Babyface headphone amp, I think it's the same as the UC.  Though did you attempt to set it to Hi Gain?  (Go to Fireface Settings / Gain / Phones / Hi Gain)
 
JK1: Regarding what I want, I think I have now decided to have one open pair and one closed pair for tracking.  What I'm after is a smooth, tight sound with a very good bass response but not overly overpronounced bass.  The ADAM A7s are generally considered bright speakers and I love them to bits.  The low end is super punchy and tight which is what I'm after, a good amount of mid bass with a nice extension down to 20 Hz ... not rumbling with barely any mid bass (like the HD-280s).
 
Thank you all once again for your feedback, I'll continue reading and attempt to check out as many of these as I can to start ruling some out.
 
Thanks again, any further feedback is more than welcome
 
Cheers
zambz

Edited by zambz - 1/5/12 at 11:54pm
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post #10 of 14
1/6/12 at 2:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zambz View Post

Acix: That's a shame regarding the Babyface headphone amp, I think it's the same as the UC.  Though did you attempt to set it to Hi Gain?  (Go to Fireface Settings / Gain / Phones / Hi Gain)
 
JK1: Regarding what I want, I think I have now decided to have one open pair and one closed pair for tracking.  What I'm after is a smooth, tight sound with a very good bass response but not overly overpronounced bass.  The ADAM A7s are generally considered bright speakers and I love them to bits.  The low end is super punchy and tight which is what I'm after, a good amount of mid bass with a nice extension down to 20 Hz ... not rumbling with barely any mid bass (like the HD-280s).
 
Thank you all once again for your feedback, I'll continue reading and attempt to check out as many of these as I can to start ruling some out.
 
Thanks again, any further feedback is more than welcome
 
Cheers
zambz


The Q/K-701/2 are 62 Ohms...A good hps amp should have enough current to drive the 62 ohms in the lower setting (hi gain is for 300-600 Ohms), but maybe in your case the hi gain can help a bit.

 

About close hps I can recommend you the GMP 8.35 @ 35Ohm, here is more info...http://www.head-fi.org/t/406658/the-german-maestro-gmp-8-35-d-monitor-in-the-studio-serious-about-audio-indeed

 

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post #11 of 14
1/19/12 at 3:08am
Thread Starter 

 

Hello friends,
 
Well I just thought I would share the conclusion to my story in case anyone was interested.
 
I decided to first buy another good pair of closed phones as I want to be able to work late and not bother anyone at home.  As such, I had basically narrowed by choice down to the KRK 8400, SRH-840 and ATH-M50s.
 
This afternoon I went to a store that had all 3 and took my HD-280 pros along for the ride.
 
Here's my impression overall...
 
KRK 8400: I'm sorry to say I didn't like these at all, the frequency balance simply seemed incorrect and messy to me.
 
ATH-M50: I had the highest hopes for these but was honestly quite dissappointed.  What is generally referred to as excellent bass and crisp treble felt forced and over the top to me.
 
At this point my HD-280 pros were not sounding so bad anymore.
 
SRH-840 : Well these immediately impressed me with comfort, and then sound too.  I felt the punch I was missing on the HD-280 pros and that gorgeous extended high end.  The build quality looked superb so I bought a pair.
 
Please do note that all this testing was done out of an iPhone with no amp.  I know it wasn't ideal but it was the best I could do at the store.
 
When plugging the SRH-840s into my Fireface UC interface, I was simply blown away.  They actually resemble my ADAM A7 monitors very closely.  I can see how the headband would be a little annoying, because I find it a tad uncomfortable too, but I'm getting used to it.  Apart from that, these headphones are super comfy.
 
I feel that the imaging on these headphones are also superior to the HD-280 pros, with a wider soundstage and a wonderful sense of space.
 
To say the least, I'm absolutely ecstatic about these beautiful phones and highly recommend them for a neutral studio monitoring headphone.  I think I'll hold onto the HD-280 pros for tracking as they do have superior isolation (due to the headsquashing action).
 
For my taste, in terms of sound...
 
SRH-840 > HD-280 > ATH-M50 > 8400
 
Peace
zambz

($J$11*B4)/1.03


Edited by zambz - 1/19/12 at 3:22am
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post #12 of 14
1/19/12 at 3:42am

Maybe in the near future you can check out open hps for studio work. k701smile.gif

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post #13 of 14
1/19/12 at 3:46am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acix View Post

Maybe in the near future you can check out open hps for studio work. k701smile.gif



Yeah will do indeed.  You know, it's actually really hard to find a place that actually stocks the better open stuff here in Melbourne.   If I could just find one that had the DT880s, AKG Q/K 701/702 or and the HD600s, I would be all over em.

 

It certainly would be a nice balance having...

 

HD-280: Best isolation = tracking

SRH-840: Better closed comfort  = late night mixing

?: Open headphone for even more comfort when it's not very noisy and I wanna work on mixing remotely.

 

:)

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post #14 of 14
1/19/12 at 4:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by zambz View Post



Yeah will do indeed.  You know, it's actually really hard to find a place that actually stocks the better open stuff here in Melbourne.   If I could just find one that had the DT880s, AKG Q/K 701/702 or and the HD600s, I would be all over em.

 

It certainly would be a nice balance having...

 

HD-280: Best isolation = tracking

SRH-840: Better closed comfort  = late night mixing

?: Open headphone for even more comfort when it's not very noisy and I wanna work on mixing remotely.

 

:)




I hope you'll fine a nice place in Melbourne that stocks open hps...and yes, open hps are way more comfy for long sessions in the studio.

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