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Car Audio Competitor Looking For Reference Cans

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 

Hi guys!  

 

Ive been a sound quality competitor in car audio for several years now and they just announced this year that theyre changing the SQ judging CD (Chesky Ultimate Demonstration Disc).  I never really needed a reference before because Ive listened to that same CD on a million different car systems and a few good home stereo systems over the last 7 years.  But with a brand new CD, Ill be totally in the dark as to how it is "supposed" to sound as well as proper imaging and staging cues.  I spend all my spare cash on these competitions so building a reference level home audio system is out of the question.  But from my reading over the passed few days, it appears like I can get some very high quality headphones capable of being a suitable reference for a fraction of the cost.  

 

Im looking in the under $200 range and partial to Sennheiser mainly because its a name Ive known and trusted for as long as Ive been alive as I grew up listening to my dad's 8 track player thru a set of Senns.  However, Im not opposed to other brands if they get the job done better. 

 

The ones I was eyeballing based on reviews Ive read here mainly, are the HD25-1 II and the PX360.  

 

The type of music we use for SQ judging is high resolution recordings, usually jazz like Livingston Taylor, Sarah Kay and Rebecca Pidgeon.  I do need them to reproduce some decent bass.  Not exaggerated, but realistic.  There are several stand up bass tracks as well as tracks with punchy kick drum tracks.  The problem is that if you beef up the kick drums, the stand up bass becomes way too overwhelming.  On the flip side, you get the stand up bass nice and smooth and you castrate your kick drums.  I need to know the natural amount of energy in these recordings so I can blend them to get the best of both tracks.  

 

So what do y'all think?  Would either of these sets get the job done or am I asking for way too much in the $100-200 price range?  

 

Thanks for any advice.   

post #2 of 14

I think you're asking a bit too much for $200.  Maybe ~$1k and you can have something worthy of reference class.  And this is somewhat factoring in DAC/amp.  Is bass the only thing you care about?  If all you want to determine is if your speaker setup is neutral, then you can get something for <$200.

 

 

Just curious, but how do you compete in car audio?  From my limited experience, car audio is just decent at best since there is always a lot of ambient noise.

post #3 of 14
i'm curious as well. it is near impossible to get proper imaging in cars cause the seating arrangement and speakers are all closed in. i know of bass competitions and so forth,but a competition for good sound quality in car audio, this is the first.
post #4 of 14

Simply put, you can't get reference level audio from $200. You might be better off buying the Fostex T50RP's and modding them. That'll get you closest imo, but still not "reference" level.

post #5 of 14

KRK 6400 are only $100 (I heard 8400 are better for bass). FA-003s/HM5s are good choices too. You would want neutral cans that are good for studio work.

 

You can buy active entry-level monitor speakers for $200 that can produce sounds down to 40-50Hz.


Edited by kingpage - 1/4/12 at 3:54am
post #6 of 14
the term ''reference level'' is bunch of monkey balls and mean nothing nowadays. it's only used for marketing reasons to make people feel warm and fuzzy inside. for headphones i would try buying used if you don't mind. get more for your money that way. what senns did you use back then? i'm guessing the hd414 or hd424 maybe? if you like to stick with sennheiser and don't mind going used, maybe you can find a pair of sennheiser Linear/Linear II for under 200 maybe.
post #7 of 14
I love car audio. car audio got me into music in general. Its a very expensive and time consuming
to get sq cars done properly. I've heard some of the top sq cars in vic, Australia. I've still never heard a decent home
audio set up yet. What gear do you run in your car macleod?
post #8 of 14

Very good studio monitor headphones are the Sennheiser HD600.  Fairly flat response.  Good for judging sound recordings true to the source.

post #9 of 14
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the help guys. I was afraid I was asking too much for my price point. I've got $60 in Best Buy gift cards from Christmas and reading these forums has piqued my interest so I might bite on those PX360's which are going for $130 right now. May nit be reference but should still sound good for some lounging around the house listening. You guys are right that the car is the worst environment for good sound but that's the challenge and what he competitions are all about. We're using high end drivers like Scanspeak, Morel, Focal and so on plus we're using extreme processors. The one I'm using (Alpine H700) has 8, 31 band EQ's (1 pre speaker), 8 channels of time alignment with .05 Ms increments and 8 1/6 octave crossovers so that combined with pretty extreme custom installations and speaker locations along with acoustic treatments inside the car and there are several cars in the lanes that rival quality home audio systems. It's a lot of fun and it really feeds your love for great sound quality because that's what its all about. Not how loud, not how fancy it looks, just how good it sounds. I'm currently running 3" Morel dome mids mounted in the A pillars, 1" Scanspeak Illuminator tweeters in the sail panels, 5" Polk Audio Signature Reference midbass in the doors, Alpine cd player and processor, Polk Audio Signature Reference 12" sub and powered by Polk Audio PA series amps running 100 watts x 6 channels and 800 watts to the sub.

post #10 of 14

It is difficult to get good imaging in a car environment, but with modern digital processors and technologies like Alpine's IMPRINT it is very doable. If you can stretch a bit, could you spring for the AKG Q701? (Note there are other colors, but the lime green one gives the detailed info for specs.) You didn't mention source/amplification and these benefit from a good amp (from what I've read), but it's the first thing that came to mind as I read your post and thought about how my IMPRINT system sounded in my Civic before I sold it.


Edited by ZoNtO - 1/4/12 at 8:40am
post #11 of 14

Okay, the HD280s are extremely neutral reference cans for under $200.  I love them.

post #12 of 14

I will heartily disagree with this haha. As much as I like Senn, the only relatively neutral one that comes to mind is the 800.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tribestros View Post

Okay, the HD280s are extremely neutral reference cans for under $200.  I love them.

 


 

I actually prefer IEMs at OP's price point for amplification reasons. Are you averse to IEMs? Maybe some Etys?

 

As an aside, I gotta wonder. You have a badass car system and a nonexistent headphone system. What about your home system?

post #13 of 14
Thread Starter 

Im only partial to Sennheiser because Im familiar with them but Im not opposed to trying a different brand if it fits the bill.  

 

My source and amplification isnt super high end. Its a Sony CDP and Pioneer receiver.  Its nothing fancy but its powerful enough for a decent 2 channel setup and would certainly get the job done with a pair of headphones. 

 

I dont have a good home audio system because I never really sit around and listen to music.  I work 2 jobs and am not home a whole lot and when I am Im either playing with my kid or on m computer as Im a big time PC builder, tweaker and gamer.  I would like nothing better than to get a high quality set of bookshelf speakers but youre talking $400 minimum to get anything approaching "reference".  There were some Polk Audio RTi4's on their Ebay site for $150 shipped that I thought about biting on but they were refurbished and that always scares the crap out of me.  

 

Since Ive got this $60 Best Buy gift card to burn anyway, I might as well get a set of the PX360 cause like I said, they may not be true reference level but they should be good enough to give me some listening enjoyment.  

 

**EDIT**

 

Was asking about the HD598's because I found them on Best Buy's website for $174!!  Of course theyre sold out now.  Dammit.  Cant find anything less than rave reviews on these things.  Theyve got them over at Crutchfield for $250 and I might stretch a little and get them based on the reviews Im finding on them.  From what I can find, theyre the best cans at this price point.  


Edited by MacLeod1592 - 1/4/12 at 6:16pm
post #14 of 14

It seems like you've already convinced yourself what to buy.

 

How about about some Beringer B1031A monitors. -3 dB 35 Hz to 20 kHz, 8" woofer. $150 for a single speaker, but perhaps you can find a pair for closer to your budget somewhere or secondhand. The lower models by Beringer or other brands with smaller woofers can be had for under $200 a pair.

 

HD600 as suggest above would be great accurate open-backed cans, in addition to the closed-backs that I said in my first post.. Used ones should cost you very close to your budget.


Edited by kingpage - 1/4/12 at 9:59pm
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