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New MESHUGGAH 3/27/12!

post #1 of 15
1/3/12 at 7:10pm
Thread Starter 

I feel like a little kid counting down the days 'til his birthday...

 

http://www.meshuggah.net/

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post #2 of 15
1/3/12 at 10:36pm

I'm in

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post #3 of 15
1/5/12 at 10:21am

banger.gif

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post #4 of 15
1/5/12 at 12:44pm

Yeah, I'm intrigued. I'm not meaning to rain on your parade. Really. I have just grown so irritated with Meshuggah. Jens Kidman doesn't know how to shut up and their writing is so linear. I get the whole anti-melodic force of metal concept but I just find Meshuggah to be quite often boring. Hey, they often have some really awesome ideas but there somewhat minimalist sound just seems like a bit of a cop out. 

 

I'd like to see them add some dynamic to their writing this time around. They are awesome musicians - I just don't think they are good writers. Thomas Haake is one of my favourite drummers (next to Danny Carrey). His footwork is unreal. But I would like to see his hands do a little more. 

 

Furthermore, it'd be nice to see Meshuggah's bassist do something other than following the rhythm and lead (which really are both just rhythms). Sure, it is hard to pull all of this off without the use of melody but they have been doing a lot of the same thing for a solid decade. Again, I'm not trying to put them down. They certainly have their merits. 

 

Another thing that'd be nice to see are decent clean tone sections with some hooks or dynamics. Their clean tone sections are really, really minimalist. 

 

I see a lot of potential in Meshuggah but sometimes I feel like it's ruined by a screaming Jens Kidman, linearity in writing, a bit of metal elitism and a really contrived minimalist technique.

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post #5 of 15
1/5/12 at 1:55pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Atrocity View Post

Yeah, I'm intrigued. I'm not meaning to rain on your parade. Really. I have just grown so irritated with Meshuggah. Jens Kidman doesn't know how to shut up and their writing is so linear. I get the whole anti-melodic force of metal concept but I just find Meshuggah to be quite often boring. Hey, they often have some really awesome ideas but there somewhat minimalist sound just seems like a bit of a cop out. 

 

I'd like to see them add some dynamic to their writing this time around. They are awesome musicians - I just don't think they are good writers. Thomas Haake is one of my favourite drummers (next to Danny Carrey). His footwork is unreal. But I would like to see his hands do a little more. 

 

Furthermore, it'd be nice to see Meshuggah's bassist do something other than following the rhythm and lead (which really are both just rhythms). Sure, it is hard to pull all of this off without the use of melody but they have been doing a lot of the same thing for a solid decade. Again, I'm not trying to put them down. They certainly have their merits. 

 

Another thing that'd be nice to see are decent clean tone sections with some hooks or dynamics. Their clean tone sections are really, really minimalist. 

 

I see a lot of potential in Meshuggah but sometimes I feel like it's ruined by a screaming Jens Kidman, linearity in writing, a bit of metal elitism and a really contrived minimalist technique.




Although I respect your opinion, im not sure where youve identified this "elitism" you are referring to. You couldnt find a more humble and gracious group of musicians, who have virtually changed the shape of metal as we know it.

Further, it seems you are looking for style shift in a band that simply doesnt play that style of music.

The essence of Meshuggah is their use of minimalism. Doing the same thing for a solid decade?? The variety and overall progression of their music from Nothing to Catch 33 and ultimately Obzen is astounding. Further, the writing of their music IMO could not possibly be less linear and more complex and dynamic. They are the masters of odd-ball time signatures and tempo shifts.

With the wish list you have above, it appears that you just dont like the band-and want to change the very formula that has provided them with the success they currently have. Thats fine, but the screaming Jens Kidman, the minimalism, the whole formula...these are the integral components of Meshuggah and they will likely (hopefully) never change.

 

 


Edited by kwitel - 1/5/12 at 4:34pm
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post #6 of 15
1/5/12 at 3:56pm

Purchased Chaosphere when it came out and could not get into them at the time. Later in 2005 I "got" Catch Thirtythree and enjoyed ObZen when it came out. They have had a slow progression which I hear as their change. Six releases in 20 years and each one very special. ObZen was their most successful album in sales and now for whatever reason they are accessible to a group who do understand what they are doing. They do change with every release but as different as they are from the Metal Genre as a whole, people can get into the realm of Meshuggah if they try.

 

Their sub-genre in which they have become the leaders of, is not my first choice but when I'm in the mood, their is really nothing like Meshuggah out there. I will be looking forward to this new release, we can expect it will be their best yet. 


Edited by Redcarmoose - 1/5/12 at 4:24pm
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post #7 of 15
1/5/12 at 4:14pm

Long time ago, almost 6-8 years ago, I got a mixed MP3 CD from my friend. It had a lot of NU-Metal and Pop and then there was a song 'Closed Eye Visuals' and I was dumbstruck. 

 

Ever since I have enjoyed the other releases: 'Nothing' 'Catch 33' and especially 'Obzen'

 

Oh! I even had the solo from 'Closed Eye Visuals' as my ringtone. 

Last year I saw them live and I was standing front row and during the entire show kept shouting 'Closed Eye Visuals' please but they didn't play it frown.gif (It was an awesome show though)..

 

Waiting for the next release.

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post #8 of 15
1/5/12 at 4:40pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcarmoose View Post

Purchased Chaosphere when it came out and could not get into them at the time. Later in 2005 I "got" Catch Thirtythree and enjoyed ObZen when it came out. They have had a slow progression which I hear as their change. Six releases in 20 years and each one very special. ObZen was their most successful album in sales and now for whatever reason they are accessible to a group who do understand what they are doing. They do change with every release but as different as they are from the Metal Genre as a whole, people can get into the realm of Meshuggah if they try.

 

Their sub-genre in which they have become the leaders of, is not my first choice but when I'm in the mood, their is really nothing like Meshuggah out there. I will be looking forward to this new release, we can expect it will be their best yet. 


Agreed. When you need that downtuned, 8 stringed sound, simply nothing else suffices.

 

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post #9 of 15
1/5/12 at 11:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwitel View Post




Although I respect your opinion, im not sure where youve identified this "elitism" you are referring to. You couldnt find a more humble and gracious group of musicians, who have virtually changed the shape of metal as we know it.

Further, it seems you are looking for style shift in a band that simply doesnt play that style of music.

The essence of Meshuggah is their use of minimalism. Doing the same thing for a solid decade?? The variety and overall progression of their music from Nothing to Catch 33 and ultimately Obzen is astounding. Further, the writing of their music IMO could not possibly be less linear and more complex and dynamic. They are the masters of odd-ball time signatures and tempo shifts.

With the wish list you have above, it appears that you just dont like the band-and want to change the very formula that has provided them with the success they currently have. Thats fine, but the screaming Jens Kidman, the minimalism, the whole formula...these are the integral components of Meshuggah and they will likely (hopefully) never change.

 

 


Yeah, I hear what you're saying man. I shouldn't say they don't have dynamics but instead that their dynamic variations are often pretty minimalist. I understand the poly-rhythmic material they are playing and I also have a good grasp of their lyrical content. So, I didn't mean to remove them of all merit by any means. I just often find that they are so technical, hence the poly-rhythms, yet so minimalist - Thomas Haake often plays a pretty simple 4/4 beat with his hands but his footwork is so technical. I don't find the contrast fitting but of course I recognize that is a very subjective assessment. 

 

They don't seem like bad guys. I just find their typical metal qualities to be a bit elitist. Or, well maybe elitist isn't the right word. It just seems like a bit of a self-entitled cop out at times. The bass and both guitars are usually playing the exact same thing and they seem to expand their sound scape into an atmospheric entity by using a lot of reverb and rhythmically picking clean tone sections over the top. Those clean tone sections are usually pretty unimaginative. 

 

I contrast a band like Meshuggah with a band that is in the genre they've pioneered (djent). Periphery! I think they take what Meshuggah was doing and really carried the torch a lot further. They make djent interesting and have a lot more character and expression in their writing. I am speaking of the instrumental release of their self-title though. Their vocalist is horrendous. I don't like Jens Kidman but Periphery's vocalist is horrendous.

 

Anyhow, I totally respect your opinion man. I was a Meshuggah fan for a really long time but I just started to find their progression to be a bit stale. Especially with Jens Kidman doing very similar vocal lines. He doesn't let the instrumentation speak for itself enough. 

 

I'm glad to have a discussion about Meshuggah on here though... haven't had a good chat about them in a long time. :)

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post #10 of 15
1/6/12 at 8:22am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Atrocity View Post


Yeah, I hear what you're saying man. I shouldn't say they don't have dynamics but instead that their dynamic variations are often pretty minimalist. I understand the poly-rhythmic material they are playing and I also have a good grasp of their lyrical content. So, I didn't mean to remove them of all merit by any means. I just often find that they are so technical, hence the poly-rhythms, yet so minimalist - Thomas Haake often plays a pretty simple 4/4 beat with his hands but his footwork is so technical. I don't find the contrast fitting but of course I recognize that is a very subjective assessment. 

 

They don't seem like bad guys. I just find their typical metal qualities to be a bit elitist. Or, well maybe elitist isn't the right word. It just seems like a bit of a self-entitled cop out at times. The bass and both guitars are usually playing the exact same thing and they seem to expand their sound scape into an atmospheric entity by using a lot of reverb and rhythmically picking clean tone sections over the top. Those clean tone sections are usually pretty unimaginative. 

 

I contrast a band like Meshuggah with a band that is in the genre they've pioneered (djent). Periphery! I think they take what Meshuggah was doing and really carried the torch a lot further. They make djent interesting and have a lot more character and expression in their writing. I am speaking of the instrumental release of their self-title though. Their vocalist is horrendous. I don't like Jens Kidman but Periphery's vocalist is horrendous.

 

Anyhow, I totally respect your opinion man. I was a Meshuggah fan for a really long time but I just started to find their progression to be a bit stale. Especially with Jens Kidman doing very similar vocal lines. He doesn't let the instrumentation speak for itself enough. 

 

I'm glad to have a discussion about Meshuggah on here though... haven't had a good chat about them in a long time. :)


I understand your sentiments...it will be interesting to see if they push the minimalism thing forward on the new album.

I like Periphery alot although I too, cannot stand the vocalist.

That said, Periphery is a very different type of band. Although they utilize the 8 stringed/djenty sound,they focus more on melody and less on emotion-less minimalism. I think this latter part is whats key to Meshuggah which indeed at times, can get stale for some people (including me).

As a result, for me Periphery is something you can listen to any time while Meshuggah is only for certain times.

 

Have you listened to TesseracT?

Based on your comments (and the fact that they are probably the most interesting metal band around today), i think youd really enjoy their sound.

 


Edited by kwitel - 1/6/12 at 8:24am
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post #11 of 15
1/6/12 at 11:47am

Yeah, I checked out Tesseract but I hate their vocalist. He's super whiny and he just has these really bad metal core vocals. I hate that stuff. Instrumentally they seem really interesting though. 

 

 

 

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post #12 of 15
1/6/12 at 1:37pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Atrocity View Post

Yeah, I checked out Tesseract but I hate their vocalist. He's super whiny and he just has these really bad metal core vocals. I hate that stuff. Instrumentally they seem really interesting though. 

 

 

 



Really? Im surprised...hes one of the few vocalists that I really enjoy these days.

As far as vocals are concerned, who do you like?

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post #13 of 15
1/7/12 at 6:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwitel View Post



Really? Im surprised...hes one of the few vocalists that I really enjoy these days.

As far as vocals are concerned, who do you like?


I'm a huge Devin Townsend fan. I think his vocals are amazing. Sure, he's a little over the top at times but I think that is kind of who he is... he does have an odd personality. Ihsahn and Samoth (mind the cheesy black metal names) of Emperor are also awesome vocalists. Ihsahn's performance on Emperor's Prometheus: The Discipline of Fire and Demise is unreal both in his clean and distorted sections. 

 

I like Kurt Cobain. I think his voice had a lot of character and he really knew how to express himself. I like Trent Reznor, too. However, he at times is a little whiney for my tastes. But generally I find him to be so appealingly expressive. 

 

I don't dislike Jens Kidman. I just think he over stays his welcome and does so quite frequently. I like the direction Meshuggah went on Obzen but he seemed to need to fill every section with his voice (which often seems a little void of cadence). 

 

Mark Lanegan has an awesome voice too. So does Dave Grohl. The lead vocalist of the Dillinger Escape Plan is excellent, too. His performance on Miss Machine is unbelievable. 

 

Beyond that I can't think of much off the top of my head. I generally find vocalists to be doofuses. :P

 

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post #14 of 15
1/8/12 at 12:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic Atrocity View Post


I'm a huge Devin Townsend fan. I think his vocals are amazing. Sure, he's a little over the top at times but I think that is kind of who he is... he does have an odd personality. Ihsahn and Samoth (mind the cheesy black metal names) of Emperor are also awesome vocalists. Ihsahn's performance on Emperor's Prometheus: The Discipline of Fire and Demise is unreal both in his clean and distorted sections. 

 

I like Kurt Cobain. I think his voice had a lot of character and he really knew how to express himself. I like Trent Reznor, too. However, he at times is a little whiney for my tastes. But generally I find him to be so appealingly expressive. 

 

I don't dislike Jens Kidman. I just think he over stays his welcome and does so quite frequently. I like the direction Meshuggah went on Obzen but he seemed to need to fill every section with his voice (which often seems a little void of cadence). 

 

Mark Lanegan has an awesome voice too. So does Dave Grohl. The lead vocalist of the Dillinger Escape Plan is excellent, too. His performance on Miss Machine is unbelievable. 

 

Beyond that I can't think of much off the top of my head. I generally find vocalists to be doofuses. :P

 



Sorry for barging in with an unrelated question. What do you guys think of Maynard Keenan(as a vocalist)?

 

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post #15 of 15
1/8/12 at 12:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrathzombie View Post



Sorry for barging in with an unrelated question. What do you guys think of Maynard Keenan(as a vocalist)?

 



No need to say sorry, man! :) Man... I can't believe I forgot Maynard. Seriously. I cannot believe I forgot him. Tool is my favourite band! Maynard's vocals are excellent and fit perfectly in Tool. 

 

I love Danney Carrey's drumming too. He is unbelievable. Very tasteful and knows how to be subtle.

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