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Audeze LCD-3 Impressions Thread - Page 183

post #2731 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybluedk View Post

I just got the LCD3s 10 days ago. 

I must say I think its very thin in the bass. Could use some more slam. Does it get better when burned in, or is that just how they are? Probably got about 100 hours on them.

Chain is pc w/Jplay -> ayre qb9 -> Heed Canamp v3 -> LCD3.

I do feel that the bass lacks some slam. Especially bass drums. Could be burnin. Could be the dac (its not terribly bass heavy) or could be the amp not having the muscle. Or I guess it could be the cans.

Any advice on where to start?

I can't imagine how anyone could call LCD-3 bass "thin". It's not bloated like Denon's but very full and extended.
post #2732 of 4451

Different expectations I think.  For bass, the LCD-2 rev.1


Edited by sling5s - 6/5/14 at 5:08pm
post #2733 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by sling5s View Post
 

Different expectations I think.  For bass, the LCD-2 rev.1

Yeah, my LCD-2 rev.2 (or the last ones before fazor) had identical bass as my LCD-3 (version just before fazor). 

post #2734 of 4451
I did start to think my LCD3F had less bass slam than my LCD2r1. Two things happened. First, I got my preferred tube amp sorted (the driver tube). Second, I turned the volume back up to my usual levels! I now don't find any difference in this respect.

I don't know the QB9 or Canamp but I do wonder if there's something lacking there??? TBH my chain (BMC PureDAC has lots of bass and lower mid information and Taboo tube amp has speed and does great bass) might just happen to suit the LCD style of bass...
post #2735 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by donlin View Post


I can't imagine how anyone could call LCD-3 bass "thin". It's not bloated like Denon's but very full and extended.

 

Some folks who didn't use a good enough amplifier for the LCD-3 couldn't feel that bass, it was lacking in many areas.

You've got the BHA-1, which I've heard with my LCD-3, while I didn't like the extreme brightness, it also had really nice bass, definitely...

 

While LCD-3 are fairly efficient headphones, you need to match a proper amp with it, due to it being an orthodynamic, you would want to give it as much power as it can handle in a clean setup, with what some might consider proper impedance matching. So yes, LCD-3 are amazing headphones, when driven properly, I'm afraid to know just how good it will be with the Ragnarok, if Mjolnir is supposedly one of the better amps to match with the LCD-3, if not the best (Supposedly Auralic Taurus is also, and I guess BHA-1 is too for people who don't mind the extreme brightness which I personally consider unnatural)

 

At some point I even asked Dubstep Girl (Who had a few of them top headphones including the LCD-3) how come she thought that LCD-3 is bass light... She immediately told me that with her new amp (Headamp GS-X mk2) she was happy with the bass, but still preferred HE-6... oh well :)

post #2736 of 4451
I did a small cosmetic tweak on my LCD-3,never have been fond as to how light they were in color.I purchased some dark brown colored wax,removed the headband and applied it with super fine steel wool and they darkened nicely,would have like to have seen them get darker,but still a nice improvement......

post #2737 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybluedk View Post
 

I just got the LCD3s 10 days ago. 

 

I must say I think its very thin in the bass. Could use some more slam. Does it get better when burned in, or is that just how they are? Probably got about 100 hours on them.

 

Chain is pc w/Jplay -> ayre qb9 -> Heed Canamp v3 -> LCD3.

 

I do feel that the bass lacks some slam. Especially bass drums. Could be burnin. Could be the dac (its not terribly bass heavy) or could be the amp not having the muscle. Or I guess it could be the cans.

 

100 hours should be enough. I don't have your playback chain, but absolutely no complaints on controlled bass impact with LCD-3 and V200. Closest thing to the experience of feeling the bass from a speaker or live drums that I've ever had through headphones.

post #2738 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by dfarina View Post

I did a small cosmetic tweak on my LCD-3,never have been fond as to how light they were in color.I purchased some dark brown colored wax,removed the headband and applied it with super fine steel wool and they darkened nicely,would have like to have seen them get darker,but still a nice improvement......


Mine seem to be darker than most.

post #2739 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by XVampireX View Post

Some folks who didn't use a good enough amplifier for the LCD-3 couldn't feel that bass, it was lacking in many areas.
You've got the BHA-1, which I've heard with my LCD-3, while I didn't like the extreme brightness, it also had really nice bass, definitely...

While LCD-3 are fairly efficient headphones, you need to match a proper amp with it, due to it being an orthodynamic, you would want to give it as much power as it can handle in a clean setup, with what some might consider proper impedance matching. So yes, LCD-3 are amazing headphones, when driven properly, I'm afraid to know just how good it will be with the Ragnarok, if Mjolnir is supposedly one of the better amps to match with the LCD-3, if not the best (Supposedly Auralic Taurus is also, and I guess BHA-1 is too for people who don't mind the extreme brightness which I personally consider unnatural)

At some point I even asked Dubstep Girl (Who had a few of them top headphones including the LCD-3) how come she thought that LCD-3 is bass light... She immediately told me that with her new amp (Headamp GS-X mk2) she was happy with the bass, but still preferred HE-6... oh well smily_headphones1.gif

No extreme brightness noticed from my Bryston. I was using a Mjolnir prior to the Bryston and while the Mjolnir was excellent, the Bryston has a noticeably bigger soundstage and clearer separation of instruments. The Bryston treble is slightly more extended but with even less grain.
post #2740 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybluedk View Post
 

 

I did hate the HD800 :D

 

I did audition them for an hour once but no love there no. I do like if the bass is a bit physical.

 

I have a couple of Denon AH D5000, and B&W Diamond 800 speakers. The speakers bass reminds me a bit of the lcd3s as they are now. Only even they got more slam to them. :)


 Skylab I believe, also has B&W 800 something fullrange speakers and his headphone preferences are also considered bass orientated cans.  I have modified a pair of professional full range towers to go down 20hz flat without the help of any subwoofer drivers and found that what comes closer to a live performance in speakers in terms of physical impact and lining up the electric bass guitar tune (I have played bass guitar with a band on many occassions in the past) with the rest of the instrumentation, I am finding even my LCD2s to be a little lite on bass in comparisons.

 

Which is worrying, because the headphones that are comparable in bass are considered fun, inaccurate or subwooferish.  It's easy to understand why when most are referencing the only other high quality source they have, namely small 2 way speakers that became the defacto standard for budget hi-fi because somewhere after the mid 90s nothing else is actually available for purchase in normal stores visited by ordinary people wanting better sound.  These people are misled into believing that bass is the enemy of hi fidelity, when in fact it is the foundation to hi fidelity.  Not an issue for niche genres and classic rock, but for music released in the past 30 years that everyone grew up with - this push is the opposite to the meaning of hi fidelity.

 

So having expressed my frustration, perhaps you should have a look into the new Fostex dynamics.  Although I feel that Audeze cans are a tad bass lite, it is completely forgivable to me due to the incredible precision and marks the emergence of a hi fi company that finally, makes philosophical sense where bass accuracy is equally as important as accuracy elsewhere in the frequency domain.

 

And no, contrary to the hi fi press, accurate, clear and concise bass flat to 20hz does not cost an arm and a leg, one needs to educate oneself and look outside of the hi fi square to do this.  But aren't 'they' supposed to do that for 'us'?  The amount of research and experimentation to get where I am now has been fun for me, but most are unable to spend this amount of time and research on something that was supposed to have been sorted out ages ago.

 

But I get the feeling that so long as people place imaginary 'imaging' and 'soundstage' as the primary factor for hi fidelity little will be done.  But congratulation are due for the hi fi industry, because they have progressed so far into this area that it has exceeded reality.  This is coming from someone that spent a good amount of money on cables, jitter and power to improve the only soundtsage that matters, the one in the recording.

post #2741 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by donlin View Post


I can't imagine how anyone could call LCD-3 bass "thin". It's not bloated like Denon's but very full and extended.

Maybe it's the absence of the slam of the 2.2.

post #2742 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by SP Wild View Post
 


 Skylab I believe, also has B&W 800 something fullrange speakers and his headphone preferences are also considered bass orientated cans.  I have modified a pair of professional full range towers to go down 20hz flat without the help of any subwoofer drivers and found that what comes closer to a live performance in speakers in terms of physical impact and lining up the electric bass guitar tune (I have played bass guitar with a band on many occassions in the past) with the rest of the instrumentation, I am finding even my LCD2s to be a little lite on bass in comparisons.

 

Which is worrying, because the headphones that are comparable in bass are considered fun, inaccurate or subwooferish.  It's easy to understand why when most are referencing the only other high quality source they have, namely small 2 way speakers that became the defacto standard for budget hi-fi because somewhere after the mid 90s nothing else is actually available for purchase in normal stores visited by ordinary people wanting better sound.  These people are misled into believing that bass is the enemy of hi fidelity, when in fact it is the foundation to hi fidelity.  Not an issue for niche genres and classic rock, but for music released in the past 30 years that everyone grew up with - this push is the opposite to the meaning of hi fidelity.

 

So having expressed my frustration, perhaps you should have a look into the new Fostex dynamics.  Although I feel that Audeze cans are a tad bass lite, it is completely forgivable to me due to the incredible precision and marks the emergence of a hi fi company that finally, makes philosophical sense where bass accuracy is equally as important as accuracy elsewhere in the frequency domain.

 

And no, contrary to the hi fi press, accurate, clear and concise bass flat to 20hz does not cost an arm and a leg, one needs to educate oneself and look outside of the hi fi square to do this.  But aren't 'they' supposed to do that for 'us'?  The amount of research and experimentation to get where I am now has been fun for me, but most are unable to spend this amount of time and research on something that was supposed to have been sorted out ages ago.

 

But I get the feeling that so long as people place imaginary 'imaging' and 'soundstage' as the primary factor for hi fidelity little will be done.  But congratulation are due for the hi fi industry, because they have progressed so far into this area that it has exceeded reality.  This is coming from someone that spent a good amount of money on cables, jitter and power to improve the only soundtsage that matters, the one in the recording.

This might be it. In any case, they dont have anywhere close to the bass that I hear at concerts or similar. 

 

Im listening to Money for Nothing, Dire Straits, and the resolution is amazing, But the low bass line, is hardly audible. It should be, as you said, the foundation of the song. Bass is important! :)

 

Anyway thanks for all the replies. Its probably the amp I should look to improve. 

post #2743 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybluedk View Post
 

This might be it. In any case, they dont have anywhere close to the bass that I hear at concerts or similar. 

 

Im listening to Money for Nothing, Dire Straits, and the resolution is amazing, But the low bass line, is hardly audible. It should be, as you said, the foundation of the song. Bass is important! :)

 

Just listened to that track from a rip of the original 80s CD through my LCD-3Fs. The bass definitely does not sound like it does at concerts (imo usually way too loud and poorly controlled), but it is clear and alive. I just listened back-to-back with my Alpha Dogs and (aside from the startlingly different sound of the ADs) the bass presence is similar. 

post #2744 of 4451
Quote:
Originally Posted by KmanChu View Post
 

 

Just listened to that track from a rip of the original 80s CD through my LCD-3Fs. The bass definitely does not sound like it does at concerts (imo usually way too loud and poorly controlled), but it is clear and alive. I just listened back-to-back with my Alpha Dogs and (aside from the startlingly different sound of the ADs) the bass presence is similar. 

Thank you for your impression. On my cans the bass sound somewhat muted. As if played in the next room. Very clear and defined, yes, but very low as well. 

 

Now bass at concerts can be really bloated and bad, but not necessarily :)

post #2745 of 4451
I don't think you'll get concert level bass power from that recording no matter what you play it through because studio recordings are mixed differently than live rock concerts. In a rock concert the drums and bass are typically way more up front. I'm sure there are many reasons for that but any accurate playback of the recording of Money for Nothing will not have live bass power. That album has been an audiophile staple for years so I've heard it over very large super high end speakers and it still doesn't sound like a concert.
Edited by donlin - 6/6/14 at 5:18am
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