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FiiO E17 "ALPEN" - First Impression + Final Thought - Page 117

post #1741 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill-P View Post

I'm just reposting this, I guess, but again, advancedmp3players seems to have stock of the E17.

 

http://www.advancedmp3players.co.uk/shop/Gadgets.4/FiiO.406/E17/FiiO_E17_Portable_Headphone_Amplifier_with_USB_Digital_Audio_Convertor__DAC_.13679.html

 

It's a bit pricier, but they can ship international, too.



I've got my itchy finger on the confirm order button...Has anyone ever used this place to ship internationally to the U.S.?

post #1742 of 6581

Well my E17 arrived today  Thank you Micca Store.  I looked over the E17 "instructions" and I'm not sure how I should look it up for what I'm trying to do, or if it is even possible.  I also just bought an E10 that I hooked up to my wife's laptop. I bought it to use as a headphone amp and the DAC was just a plus.  I noticed it had a line out 3.5mm jack so I plugged her Bose Companion 3 speakers into it.  I figured I would do the same on my computer with the E17, but I just noticed it doesn't have a 3.5mm line out jack.  The instructions show speakers being hooked up using the L7 LOD.  So if I do that with the E17, will I still be able to plug in my headphones to use the E17 as a headphone amp?.  Since the E10 and E17 will both be connected to the computer by USB will I be getting the benefit of the amp and DAC function out of the E10 and E17 even if I use the L7?  Hope that make sense.

post #1743 of 6581
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdyoung216 View Post

Well my E17 arrived today  Thank you Micca Store.  I looked over the E17 "instructions" and I'm not sure how I should look it up for what I'm trying to do, or if it is even possible.  I also just bought an E10 that I hooked up to my wife's laptop. I bought it to use as a headphone amp and the DAC was just a plus.  I noticed it had a line out 3.5mm jack so I plugged her Bose Companion 3 speakers into it.  I figured I would do the same on my computer with the E17, but I just noticed it doesn't have a 3.5mm line out jack.  The instructions show speakers being hooked up using the L7 LOD.  So if I do that with the E17, will I still be able to plug in my headphones to use the E17 as a headphone amp?.  Since the E10 and E17 will both be connected to the computer by USB will I be getting the benefit of the amp and DAC function out of the E10 and E17 even if I use the L7?  Hope that make sense.

With L7, you can get both the line-out fro speaker and headphone-out.

I don't understand what you mean by the highlighted part - are you saying you will connect both E10 and E17 to the same PC? You can only set one sound device at a time in windows, either E10 or E17, but not at the same time.
post #1744 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post


With L7, you can get both the line-out fro speaker and headphone-out.
I don't understand what you mean by the highlighted part - are you saying you will connect both E10 and E17 to the same PC? You can only set one sound device at a time in windows, either E10 or E17, but not at the same time.


The E10 is connected to my wife's laptop and I'm going to connect the E17 to my desktop, both will be connected by USB. My main reason for buying both is the headphone amp, but since they both are DACs, would like get use of that as well.  So can I run a pair of speakers and headphones with the E10 and E17 and get the benefit of the DAC for the headphones and speakers?  Does the L7 have a line out and headphone jack?

post #1745 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyogen View Post

...

It's not about volume at all.  I'm getting plenty of volume.  like i said above, I just want to FULLY drive these.  What you're saying is to get a more expensive headphone that's like 32ohm, right? 

 


Here's some quotes from an article I found online: http://www.headfonia.com/the-upgrade-fiio-e17-alpen/

 

"E17 versus the E11

We’re talking strictly amplifiers here, and I have to conclude that the E11 is the better amplifier. More ample power, smoother, more refined. The E11 has much more depth in the soundstage though the width is slightly narrower. But everytime you have to choose between depth and width, it’s always the depth because that’s what gives you three dimensionality. Well anyway remember that the E11 is an amplifier only unit, no DAC."
 

So, is anyone using an E11 with DT880s? If so, does the E11 drive them with room to spare? (If so, then the amp on the E17 should drive the headphones fully.)

 

hyogen: also, as I searched the web I saw different versions of the DT880 - 32ohm, 250ohm, and 600ohm. 

 

post #1746 of 6581

The L7 doesn't block the headphone jack. It only cover the auxiliary port.

post #1747 of 6581
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdyoung216 View Post



The E10 is connected to my wife's laptop and I'm going to connect the E17 to my desktop, both will be connected by USB. My main reason for buying both is the headphone amp, but since they both are DACs, would like get use of that as well.  So can I run a pair of speakers and headphones with the E10 and E17 and get the benefit of the DAC for the headphones and speakers?  Does the L7 have a line out and headphone jack?
L7 only gives you an USB-in (for PC input) and a line-out (for your speaker). The headphone-out on the E17 is still functional and it is independent from the line-out - in simpler term, you can use line-out (from L7) and headphone-out (on E17) at the same time. This is the same for E10 as its line-out and headphone-out are also independent of each other.
post #1748 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by xxhaxx View Post

The L7 doesn't block the headphone jack. It only cover the auxiliary port.



I know that it connects similar to how an iPod would connect, but if I do connect the L-7 to my E17 can I still use the E17 as a headphone amp, or is it just a DAC with the L7 connected.  If I can do both fine.  If not I'll do a splitter off the headphone jack, since the headphone amp is more important to me than a DAC for the speakers.

post #1749 of 6581

So far I am happy with the E17 performance with my Bose Mie2i. It sound great when I set the treble to +4 for most songs. I have been using it a lot at the office with this setup. Laptop (usb) -> E17 -> Mie2i. 

 
At home, I have been using the E17 with my HD650 for almost a month now. I knew I needed a better amplifier for my HD650. Thus, I have ordered a Lyr with 6BZ7 NOS  tube last week. Will be getting it tomorrow. Can't wait to listen to it. I will be using the E17 (for now) as the DAC. I have ordered the Fiio L7 from Amazon (arriving next Friday). My home setup will be Laptop usb -> E17 with L7 (DAC) -> Lyr -> HD650.
post #1750 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by AgentXXL View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by hyogen View Post

 

I agree.  I'm not sure if they ARE being driven to the max.  I'm almost positive they aren't....I mean it's a 250ohm headphone.    comparable HD650 is just adequately driven by the E17....but again most likely not fully driven.  that's what I want....fulllllly driven :o

 


these DT880 250ohm aren't high level enough?  I think they are...    I don't think I've heard these fully driven yet.  I've only heard from my phone/wolfson/voodoo control and 5db amp/ 

 

It's not about volume at all.  I'm getting plenty of volume.  like i said above, I just want to FULLY drive these.  What you're saying is to get a more expensive headphone that's like 32ohm, right? 

 


What you mean is that you want to enjoy the detail and clarity as well as having enough volume. I wouldn't necessarily be looking at easier to drive headphones, but instead something that has a wide soundstage and plenty of clarity/detail. Beyer T1. Senn HD800, Audeze LCD-2 or -3, maybe even a Stax electrostatic setup. All of these of course are even harder to drive so they may/will require even more powerful amps.

 

While you have just taken a leap forward by moving to a phone/media player with a better DAC, your next step is probably to start with better encoded files. If you can, start with some lossless files in FLAC or ALAC format. With your new phone though, you're limited to dual amping via the headphone output as I don't believe it has a line out and it won't support digital out unless you load a modded Android kernel. That's not to say that dual-amping out of your phone won't improve the audio, but almost guaranteed you won't see as big of an improvement as you have by changing player hardware (with the Wolfson DAC).

 

That said, using Poweramp to play FLAC lossless files on your new phone may yet reveal another layer of detail and clarity. It really depends on the quality of the FLAC encoding though, so as with anything, it will require experimentation. I'd definitely give your E17 a try when you receive it - if it doesn't provide the boost you're looking for, you can probably sell it with little difficulty, being that it's so new. Good luck!

 


I didn't realize with an android kernel you could support digital out.   isn't that what ppl have been dying to get?  line out via microusb?  I don't think it exists yet...   I do use Poweramp and thanks for the advice with FLAC and source files.  I'm not looking to upgrade headphones at all....these sound perfect to me as it is.  Which was why I was doubting the E17's ability to really improve my phones.  As the guy who posted right before this said, the E17 does not drive his HD650.  It may be ADEQUATE...and loud enough.....but obviously he's feeling the need for more.

 

thanks for the reply
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKam View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by hyogen View Post

...

It's not about volume at all.  I'm getting plenty of volume.  like i said above, I just want to FULLY drive these.  What you're saying is to get a more expensive headphone that's like 32ohm, right? 

 


Here's some quotes from an article I found online: http://www.headfonia.com/the-upgrade-fiio-e17-alpen/

 

"E17 versus the E11

We’re talking strictly amplifiers here, and I have to conclude that the E11 is the better amplifier. More ample power, smoother, more refined. The E11 has much more depth in the soundstage though the width is slightly narrower. But everytime you have to choose between depth and width, it’s always the depth because that’s what gives you three dimensionality. Well anyway remember that the E11 is an amplifier only unit, no DAC."
 

So, is anyone using an E11 with DT880s? If so, does the E11 drive them with room to spare? (If so, then the amp on the E17 should drive the headphones fully.)

 

hyogen: also, as I searched the web I saw different versions of the DT880 - 32ohm, 250ohm, and 600ohm. 

 

 

I did read that.  and I know the E17 will drastically improve sound from my laptop, BUT it will not work as a DAC for my phone.  But since I'm satisfied with the wolfson dac on my phone now, like AgentXXL suggested I will look to better quality mp3s/FLAC. 

 

I know there are diff versions of the DT880.  I have the 250ohm.  I hope I don't regret getting the 600s.....  To me the 250ohm version is perfect.....wonder if it could sound any better. 

 

 

post #1751 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by weitn View Post

So far I am happy with the E17 performance with my Bose Mie2i. It sound great when I set the treble to +4 for most songs. I have been using it a lot at the office with this setup. Laptop (usb) -> E17 -> Mie2i. 

 
At home, I have been using the E17 with my HD650 for almost a month now. I knew I needed a better amplifier for my HD650. Thus, I have ordered a Lyr with 6BZ7 NOS  tube last week. Will be getting it tomorrow. Can't wait to listen to it. I will be using the E17 (for now) as the DAC. I have ordered the Fiio L7 from Amazon (arriving next Friday). My home setup will be Laptop usb -> E17 with L7 (DAC) -> Lyr -> HD650.


I plan on this exact set-up in the future. Except maybe with the LD MKIII, aye or nay? 
 

 

post #1752 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyogen View Post


I didn't realize with an android kernel you could support digital out.   isn't that what ppl have been dying to get?  line out via microusb?  I don't think it exists yet...   I do use Poweramp and thanks for the advice with FLAC and source files.  I'm not looking to upgrade headphones at all....these sound perfect to me as it is.  Which was why I was doubting the E17's ability to really improve my phones.  As the guy who posted right before this said, the E17 does not drive his HD650.  It may be ADEQUATE...and loud enough.....but obviously he's feeling the need for more.

 

thanks for the reply


The only Android kernel that supports digital out, that I'm aware of is CyanogenMod7. I've also seen mention of a Nook kernel based on ICS 4.0.3 that supports digital out via USB, but so far that's it for the Android market. I too have never seen line out via microusb - nor have I seen an Android phone that has a line out similar to iDevices, i.e. a separate jack from the headphone jack or requiring a special cable (LOD) to make use of line out on a dock connector. In fact, I don't recall seeing a single Android device which has a dock connector - just microusb. So it's very likely that line out from an Android device is pretty much non-existent except in rare cases where they have a separate jack or perhaps firmware that enables them to switch the headphone jack from variable to fixed line out. All of this is just a guess on my part, having never experienced it in person.

 

One other thing mentioned earlier - someone was stating that digital out of iDevices isn't possible other than the iPad 2 with CCK (and powered USB hub in the case of the E17). That's not entirely true - there are devices such as the Fostex HP-P1, the Cypher Labs Algorithm Solo and the HRT iStreamer that bypass the DAC in iDevices to use their own. There is also the Pure AV digital dock, but that basically makes the iDevice + USB/SPDIF DAC a transportable solution, not a portable one. There are options out there to do more with our devices, but they almost always cost a fortune or severely limit the portability. If portability isn't an issue for you, then the advantage of a true desktop amp is probably more appropriate than the E17. But you never know until you try... smile.gif

 

post #1753 of 6581

OK I ordered the L7 from the Micca Store.  Figured I would throw them some business for getting the E17 to me.

post #1754 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleDappleman View Post


I plan on this exact set-up in the future. Except maybe with the LD MKIII, aye or nay? 
 

 



Lyr or LD MKIII - either one will drive the HD650 acceptably. Myself, I'm just not a fan of tube amps. I haven't listened to a lot of them, but it seems that I'm only happy when I hear the > $1000 systems. For that kind of cash, I'll stick with a nice neutral solid state amp. The warmer sound of tube amps just doesn't appeal to me, but again, that's my personal opinion based on my ears and brain. In no way should it influence what you decide to try to improve your listening station - to each their own! smily_headphones1.gif

post #1755 of 6581
Quote:
Originally Posted by AgentXXL View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by hyogen View Post


I didn't realize with an android kernel you could support digital out.   isn't that what ppl have been dying to get?  line out via microusb?  I don't think it exists yet...   I do use Poweramp and thanks for the advice with FLAC and source files.  I'm not looking to upgrade headphones at all....these sound perfect to me as it is.  Which was why I was doubting the E17's ability to really improve my phones.  As the guy who posted right before this said, the E17 does not drive his HD650.  It may be ADEQUATE...and loud enough.....but obviously he's feeling the need for more.

 

thanks for the reply


The only Android kernel that supports digital out, that I'm aware of is CyanogenMod7. I've also seen mention of a Nook kernel based on ICS 4.0.3 that supports digital out via USB, but so far that's it for the Android market. I too have never seen line out via microusb - nor have I seen an Android phone that has a line out similar to iDevices, i.e. a separate jack from the headphone jack or requiring a special cable (LOD) to make use of line out on a dock connector. In fact, I don't recall seeing a single Android device which has a dock connector - just microusb. So it's very likely that line out from an Android device is pretty much non-existent except in rare cases where they have a separate jack or perhaps firmware that enables them to switch the headphone jack from variable to fixed line out. All of this is just a guess on my part, having never experienced it in person.

 

One other thing mentioned earlier - someone was stating that digital out of iDevices isn't possible other than the iPad 2 with CCK (and powered USB hub in the case of the E17). That's not entirely true - there are devices such as the Fostex HP-P1, the Cypher Labs Algorithm Solo and the HRT iStreamer that bypass the DAC in iDevices to use their own. There is also the Pure AV digital dock, but that basically makes the iDevice + USB/SPDIF DAC a transportable solution, not a portable one. There are options out there to do more with our devices, but they almost always cost a fortune or severely limit the portability. If portability isn't an issue for you, then the advantage of a true desktop amp is probably more appropriate than the E17. But you never know until you try... smile.gif

 



hehe, yes I will give the e17 a shot.  So, digital out for android......that WOULD be through microUSB, right? 

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