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The discovery thread.! NEW sfwalcer's earphone comparo PG 1727. DannyBai multi phone impressions... - Page 1003

post #15031 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by fzman View Post
 

Here in the USA most companies post a disclaimer on print and internet "ads" which clearly indicates they are not responsible for errors or 'typos'.  Once an order is accepted, and a credit card is charged, that may be another story. I am not an attorney, so take this as my personal viewpoint only, and not legal advice....  Seems to me that, prior to charging the credit card and shipping out the product, it is simply a matter that either part can change their mind and cancel their order.  Lawyers in the audience?  correct me if I am wrong here.

 

The website's disclaimers will generally become part of the contract for sale and will still apply even if the purchaser has paid (accepted the contract terms and performed, in the legal speak).  The terms might state, for instance, that the website's only obligation in the case of typos is to return the money paid.

post #15032 of 26100

Usually the error/typo disclaimer only applies to ads. I am not sure but once a price is displayed officially in a store there's no going back. At least in the country where I leave this is a sure thing, if you see a product with a price in a store and the references match, then you have all the right to buy the item at that price even if it is a obvious typo and if they don´t sell you at that price you press charges and go to court and you will make 3/4x the initially sum of money involved. That's if you pressure them a bit and be nice to arrogant they will let that one go.

You can see if a price in a store was not legally definitive what kinda of manipulative market practises would arise.

 

Again what I mentioned is from my country not sure about other countries.

post #15033 of 26100
what's that? where's the hype?
rolleyes.gif
[/quote]

no hype just discovery
post #15034 of 26100

Well, I'm a lawyer but honestly this strictly depends on the country's law. Big online sellers like amazon etc do have disclaimers though and generally they always have the right to reject a sale due to a pricing mistake or any other error in the listing of the product. The ones that do not object the sale are usually sellers, who don't want a bad rep or lose clients and probably accept it as a sort of a paid advertisement that they are reputable. But in most countries at least in Europe they are not obliged to accept the sale and pressuring them by means of being arrogant about it won't work. You can pressure them with a lawsuit though but depending on the judicial practice in that country you might just be wasting your time and money.

post #15035 of 26100

I think of it this way.  If the price is low, but 'close' to normal, it's one thing, but if it's in the 'too good to be true' range, it's probably a mistake, and savvy shippers will know it's a mistake.  So, then the question becomes whether it's morally acceptable to take advantage of an obvious error-- e.g., if a cashier gives you back too much change, and you immediately notice it, do you take it, or give it back?  More importantly, what should you do?

 

defend your answers with a 40 word essay - Yes, this will be on the final!

post #15036 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by kova4a View Post
 

Well, I'm a lawyer but honestly this strictly depends on the country's law. Big online sellers like amazon etc do have disclaimers though and generally they always have the right to reject a sale due to a pricing mistake or any other error in the listing of the product. The ones that do not object the sale are usually sellers, who don't want a bad rep or lose clients and probably accept it as a sort of a paid advertisement that they are reputable. But in most countries at least in Europe they are not obliged to accept the sale and pressuring them by means of being arrogant about it won't work. You can pressure them with a lawsuit though but depending on the judicial practice in that country you might just be wasting your time and money.

I meant not arrogant, it was a typo, oh the irony. In my county false advertisement and changing prices is kinda of a big deal, it is strictly prohibited and you will in most cases end up with the item you wanted at the price you saw and with some sort of monetary compensation and with all the expenses due to the process paid.

I got a 2000€ computer this way. In a ad, on the text they had a specific model announced at around 400€ but they displayed the 2000€ computer that happened to be of my knowlodge. I explained what they did, explained the legal consequenses that could arise from that and that's how I ended up with a 2000€ computer for 400€,

post #15037 of 26100

Well, as I said - it depends where you live. And probably in a lot of cases the manager if it's actually a bigger company or most often the store manager if you saw an ad and went directly to the store might decide to still acknowledge the stated price to avoid any unnecessary problems but actually if such a case ends up in court in many cases it will be dismissed. I assume it will be a lot easier to sue or pressure a seller with threats in US coz with a legal system based on precedents you can probably find thousands of cases relevant to you and win in court.

post #15038 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by kova4a View Post
 

Well, as I said - it depends where you live. And probably in a lot of cases the manager if it's actually a bigger company or most often the store manager if you saw an ad and went directly to the store might decide to still acknowledge the stated price to avoid any unnecessary problems but actually if such a case ends up in court in many cases it will be dismissed. I assume it will be a lot easier to sue or pressure a seller with threats in US coz with a legal system based on precedents you can probably find thousands of cases relevant to you and win in court.

Usually I dont exploit this kinda of situation but since the workers from the store were really arrogant towards me telling me I was wrong and I to suck it up, lucky mine I recently read some articles from a consumers association magazine about the subject. They ended up with a internal disciplinary process too.

The company understood everything what I said and acknowlodged that I had the right and that they would act accordingly. Another thing was that the ad was only from a local store of the chain.

post #15039 of 26100

So, I didn't think I would be home until Friday, but managed to make it to the house today. On a couple of threads and in my inbox I've been asked to compare the DN1K to the KEF M-200. Here you go:

 

DN1K - a much wider soundstage than the M-200. The Dunu gives you an out of head soundstage experience and pushes you at least 10 rolls (maybe more) from the stage in say a 1000-seat theater. The earphone has great timbre and imaging. Wonderful instrument separation. Of course, wonderful bass and mids with just the right highs that have very good extension. Vocals have wonderful clarity and stand out from the other instruments.

 

M-200 -  To get right to it, the KEF is much more refined than the DN-1K. Yes, the DN-1K has a very good refined sound to it, but A/Bing it to KEF, there is just no competition. The KEF beats the Dunu clarity and timbre, and I don't think they're close at all. The M-200 simply sounds more natural in the performance of the instruments to my ears with more details. Now, in all fairness, my M-200 has more than 100 hours burn-in on it compared to the about less than 10 on the Dunu. Yes, I expect the Dunu to get better, but I don't expect it to catch up with the M-200. And to be honest, before I had a chance to compare them, I thought the Dunu might surpass the M-200 in imaging, refinement and timbre (that is a testament of how good the DN-1K sounds to my ears), but there is no contest. So once again, I have to smash "we like something more because it's new" theory that some of you have. The Dunu, 750i or S2 doesn't touch the M-200. It't the most refined and clear of all four. KEF has the best timbre and live sounding effects.

 

Bass -  Where I have the sound ring on the DN-1K now, bass is about even between it and the M-200. As a matter of fact, there may be a bit more (smidgen more) bass in the Dunu, but KEF - again - wins hands down in quality of bass if it doesn't beat in quantity. 

 

Mids- I think this is where both are closer in sounding similar (thickness of notes and details), but the KEF is still the clear winner in clarity and transparency. The mids are a bit more forward in the M-200 too (I think you're sitting in the second or third roll in that same theater).

 

Highs - Actually the highs sound about the same to me in extension (great on both), but maybe a little more in the KEF. Again, refinement and quality goes to KEF.

 

I should point out that the M-200's soundstage is pretty wide and definitely spacious from front to back, but it just stops short of giving you the "out-of-head"  experience.  The Dunu gives you that.

 

Fullness - Again, KEF wins, but the Dunu is definitely a full-sounding earphone, just not M-200 level. The DN-1K is like some of the finest premium ice cream you can buy, whereas the M-200 is like some of the finest and richest gelato you can buy. That's the difference to my ears. But I want to stress that the DN-1K does have a nice refined sound, but not on M-200 level.

 

What else can I tell you about the two? Hmmm? Well, I think most will find the DN-1K more of a comfortable fit (although out of ear for me the shells are heavy. I don't think the metal is aluminum). Oh, I don't have the H-200 anymore (sold them), but thinking back, I think the H-200 had a more richer and refined bass than the the DN-1K, but it also had a lesser amount of bass. The H-200 just almost hit basshead levels, but didn't cross into that territory. The DN-1K jumps over into basshead levels (but not deep into it, but it's over the line). But the sound as a whole, I think the DN-1K is a more refined sound as whole than the H-200. It's definitely a fuller sound. I think the Dunu has more micro details or at least it's a draw. Now, I'm going by recent memory on the H-200 (and I know how some of you feel about memory), so feel free to take my H-200/DN-1K thoughts with a grain of salt. I won't be offended. I'm am sure, however, about the thicker sound in the Dunus compared to the H-200.

 

Finally, comparing value  of the Dunu, H-200, and M-200.  When I first heard the H-200, I think I wrote it could compete with some $300 (+) earphones (considered top tiers back in the day). I still feel that way about it. And I feel that way about the DN-1K too. But the $200 earphone market has really stepped of its game in the past year or two, that it is fair to compare these earphones in their perspective price brackets now. So for what you can get in sound quality now for about $200 to $250, the Dunu and H-200 are clearly worth it and both are premium earphones in that mid-tier market. But the M-200 is also a $200 earphone. I would have to say the M-200 keeps punching quite far beyond its price bracket to me. It could have cost $350 and I wouldn't feel cheated (maybe even $400). I don't consider the M-200 mid-tier premium sound. I consider the KEF top tier sound. And that's where I'm at fellas. Hope this helps someone make a decision. Happy listening.

post #15040 of 26100

^ Hmmmm interesting comparo ericp. Thanks a ton meng!!! :beerchug:

 

... great job. :)

post #15041 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfwalcer View Post
 

^ Hmmmm interesting comparo ericp. Thanks a ton meng!!! :beerchug:

 

... great job. :)

 

:beerchug:

post #15042 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericp10 View Post
 

 

:beerchug:

^ your impressions/ thoughts might change with further burn-in so don't be shy to keep us updated. :ksc75smile:

 

Thanks again.

 

 

edit: oh forgot to say in the meantime ENJOY all dem sweet new gears meng, no need to worry about us thirsty mofos for impressions. ;)


Edited by sfwalcer - 10/3/13 at 6:29pm
post #15043 of 26100

There is one slot open for the Geek Dac for 139$ if someone is still interested in. 

post #15044 of 26100
Quote:
Originally Posted by jekostas View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayson73 View Post
 

 

Just ordered the Gratitude for $58.  Hope I find them to be an upgrade to the Tenore/Basso!

 

Hope?

 

The Gratitudes run circles around the Zero Audios. 

Great purchase, I agree, no comparison (at least not to the Tenore, and I like the Tenore)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mackem View Post
 

Anyone done a comparison of the Carbo Basso vs CKS1000 and just want to give me a quick rundown?

Haven't done direct comparisons (and I actually only have the Tenore), but, my impression is, given good source and fit (both of which are more problematic with the AT than the Zero Audio, at least for me), the AT will win hands down, can do direct comparisons to the Tenore if you would like, but that will have to wait a bit because.....

 

MY RHA'S HAVE ARRIVED!!

 

Came home, just unboxed, man, nice packaging, nice case, nice tip selection, listen tonight.

 

As far as the Amazon DTs, bought them on impulse, certainly not essential to the (too large) headphone collection, if Amazon caught the typo and cancelled, wasn't meant to be, certainly not making a fuss.

post #15045 of 26100

On a totally unrelated note-I'm walking with a group from my office to raise money for Breast Cancer,the Making Strides Walk, procedes will go to the American Cancer Society, the walk will be Sunday October 20, anyone who would like to make a contribution can PM me (you can even bet against me making it to the end of the walk!). Thanks very much.

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Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › The discovery thread.! NEW sfwalcer's earphone comparo PG 1727. DannyBai multi phone impressions PG 1729!!