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The discovery thread.! New NiceHCK DZ7 1DD+6 BA iem impression by ericp10. Page 2153 - Page 1685

post #25261 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayson73 View Post
 

I just got the Singolo.  They have a lot less bass than Tenore and KC06.  I thought they were supposed to have more bass than them, since they're supposed to be a combination of Tenore and Basso.  Do I need to burn in with music?

yes, they need massive burn in, being carbon nano. mine didn't sound right till 200 hours of burn in and sounded really good after 400 hours of burn in.

and they keep getting better.  don't be discouraged, keep burning!

post #25262 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbluenewmexico View Post

yes, they need massive burn in, being carbon nano. mine didn't sound right till 200 hours of burn in and sounded really good after 400 hours of burn in.
and they keep getting better.  don't be discouraged, keep burning!

I thought they're single ba?
post #25263 of 32897
They are single BA.

Manufacturers and experts on BA technology assert there is no burn in. Yet you have claims of this phenomenon on this forum and random number of hours are thrown in with no basis whatsoever. I think this further proves burn-in is psychological likely for dynamic as well.
post #25264 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inks View Post

They are single BA.

Manufacturers and experts on BA technology assert there is no burn in. Yet you have claims of this phenomenon on this forum and random number of hours are thrown in with no basis whatsoever. I think this further proves burn-in is psychological likely for dynamic as well.

While I agree with the statement, I also slightly disagree.

The manufacturers and experts on BA technology, like the rest of the industry, have yet to provide any research paper showing evidence to their claim. If they had, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

It doesn't mean that it's real, but it's real in their mind so what does it matter?

Even if a paper was released showing no change in frequency response or some other current measurement, that doesn't disqualify the possibility that there are aspects that we can't accurately measure or even know about currently.
Science is ever-changing.

Maybe 10,000 hours makes them sound like audio euphoria or maybe it just reduces the product life span. The situation remains the same: Opinion = Opinion. Not Opinion > Opinion.
post #25265 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamakahah View Post


While I agree with the statement, I also slightly disagree.

The manufacturers and experts on BA technology, like the rest of the industry, have yet to provide any research paper showing evidence to their claim. If they had, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

It doesn't mean that it's real, but it's real in their mind so what does it matter?

Even if a paper was released showing no change in frequency response or some other current measurement, that doesn't disqualify the possibility that there are aspects that we can't accurately measure or even know about currently.
Science is ever-changing.

Maybe 10,000 hours makes them sound like audio euphoria or maybe it just reduces the product life span. The situation remains the same: Opinion = Opinion. Not Opinion > Opinion.

its the NANO fiber aspect of these that requires significant burn in.  i remember when JVX started putting out nano fiber headphones they sounded just trashy out of the box and needed colossal burn in to sound right.  advanced speaker manufacturers like ZU AUDIO are not nano coating their drivers and strongly recommending 400 hrs of burn in for their speakers to sound right!

post #25266 of 32897
The Singolo is believed to be a Molex 504410-1119 Series BA. There are no carbon nano-tubes.
Edited by shotgunshane - 6/19/14 at 11:56am
post #25267 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbluenewmexico View Post

its the NANO fiber aspect of these that requires significant burn in.  i remember when JVX started putting out nano fiber headphones they sounded just trashy out of the box and needed colossal burn in to sound right.  advanced speaker manufacturers like ZU AUDIO are not nano coating their drivers and strongly recommending 400 hrs of burn in for their speakers to sound right!

I'm just saying that you should believe what you want. No one else is going to try on your ears.

That said, I cannot overlook your post. Capitalizing "nano" for emphasis means nothing. Nano is simply a metric prefix for one billionth. Fiber refers to a structure type. Nano fiber means nothing unless placed in the proper context of materials and processes used.
I'll save the majority of my thoughts about ZU Audios's claims for the proper place and time; However, I'll simply reiterate my sentiments concerning actual peer-reviewed scientific research. They, like the rest, have none. So again, it's all opinion and preferences and that's okay. But it doesn't make it fact.
Maybe future technology will unlock those mysteries. I certainly hope so. Until then, I say do whatever works for you and everyone can go "kick rocks."
post #25268 of 32897

I've talked to Dale - creator of the Aurisonics line - quite a bit. He believes that BAs can and do go through some burn-in process. That (and my ears) is good enough for me. I'm a believer. I heard NO bass when I first listened to the Doppios. I was mad at Dsnuts and thought he lied to me about the bass. He said burn them in for a good 100 hours. Bass came in after that and I almost swear someone switched Doppios on me. Burn in is real! 

post #25269 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericp10 View Post
 

I've talked to Dale - creator of the Aurisonics line - quite a bit. He believes that BAs can and do go through some burn-in process. That (and my ears) is good enough for me. I'm a believer. I heard NO bass when I first listened to the Doppios. I was mad at Dsnuts and thought he lied to me about the bass. He said burn them in for a good 100 hours. Bass came in after that and I almost swear someone switched Doppios on me. Burn in is real! 

Many other factors could explain that change, you're just choosing to believe it's burn-in. I think a Knowles/Sonion/Molex engineer may be more qualified, since they don't just tune a finished product like Dale and from what I know, they mention that there is no bun-in.

 

I will still recommend to give an IEM some to time to settle, but countless hours playing for no reason isn't doing anything nor is it going through the trouble of counting hours of play or other things of the sort

post #25270 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inks View Post
 

Many other factors could explain that change, you're just choosing to believe it's burn-in. I think a Knowles/Sonion/Molex engineer may be more qualified, since they don't just tune a finished product like Dale and from what I know, they mention that there is no bun-in.

 

I will still recommend to give an IEM some to time to settle, but countless hours playing for no reason isn't doing anything nor is it going through the trouble of counting hours of play or other things of the sort

 

 

And you're just choosing to believe it's not burn-in. I think I'll trust what Dale and some other people who are experts in the field of audio technology, and who actually make these products we enjoy. If they say burn-in exists, who am I to disagree? And in addition, I've clearly heard the changes with my own ears (I didn't say I think I heard changes, but I actually did hear the changes). There is no need to debate this. It's clear we won't change each other's mind on the subject. I've rarely seen anyone change their mind regardless of what side of the topic they fall under.

post #25271 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inks View Post
 

Many other factors could explain that change, you're just choosing to believe it's burn-in. I think a Knowles/Sonion/Molex engineer may be more qualified, since they don't just tune a finished product like Dale and from what I know, they mention that there is no bun-in.

 

I will still recommend to give an IEM some to time to settle, but countless hours playing for no reason isn't doing anything nor is it going through the trouble of counting hours of play or other things of the sort

Inks, open your mind up.  You think bias works only one way?  If you look at a graph, and you made a decision, that's a bias.  If you heard that burn-in don't exist, and it's most likely you will ignore it.  

 

Expectation bias goes both way.  Just because somebody read graphs, don't make them objective.

post #25272 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverEars View Post
 

Inks, open your mind up.  You think bias works only one way?  If you look at a graph, and you made a decision, that's a bias.  If you heard that burn-in don't exist, and it's most likely you will ignore it.  

 

Expectation bias goes both way.  Just because somebody read graphs, don't make them objective.

Graphs weren't even mentioned. The way you put it, any science will be useless because it's "bias". 

 

Dale will be the first case of an "expert" claiming there is burn-in that I've heard, all others I've heard disregard it. Again, Dale doesn't make these drivers, he likely just chooses a configuration and tunes it as is the case of most manufacturers. The engineers that do build these don't even mention it much most of the time .

post #25273 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by shotgunshane View Post

The Singolo is believed to be a Molex 504410-1119 Series BA. There are no carbon nano-tubes.

why is called  a CARBO SINGULO then??? 

post #25274 of 32897
Quote:
Originally Posted by drbluenewmexico View Post

why is called  a CARBO SINGULO then??? 

Due to the Carbon Fiber Housing.
post #25275 of 32897

Guys, what do you think it would be "better"?

 

I need a replacement for my broken earphones (Brainwavz M3) and I´m thinking about the Narmoo's S1, and the Zero Audio Carbo Basso or Tenore. I´m looking for an eaprhone that can do it well with lots of different genres. I´m a bit of basshead, so I usually use them with the Bass Boost setting of my Cowon.

 

Thanks in advance :(

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Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › The discovery thread.! New NiceHCK DZ7 1DD+6 BA iem impression by ericp10. Page 2153