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New Hifiman Headphone HE-400 is out - Page 157

post #2341 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinQY View Post


This is very interesting. So it seems the two have different technical merits. When I had the HD650, I loved the smoothness of the midrange, but always left wanting more detail, even as I scaled them with different amps. What other effects do the velvet pads have on the sound?
And you mention soundstage as well, how does the imaging compare, and on a less related note, the timbre? I found that the HD650 didn't do anything special with pianos, how would the HE-400 compare?
And thanks for the help, the great, detailed comparison is much appreciated. This definitely helps prepare me for the audition with the HE-300/400 tomorrow.


Usually when people say "HD650 doesn't have enough detail" what they mean is "it doesn't have enough treble emphasis and sparkle compared to others."  Which would be a true accusation.  With the steep treble rolloff they lack treble sparkle almost entirely, and the neutral treble region in general won't emphasize the treble section which happens to be where a lot of detail perception resides.  Meaning people don't want more detail, they want the detail to be emphasized so they perceive it more readily.   HD650 is extremely detailed.  It just doesn't shove the detail in your face the way some people prefer.

 

HE-400 is also extremely detailed, and it tries to make it slightly more emphasized with specific treble peaks, however it also rolls off some of that "sparkle" region.  It prevents the treble from being fully recessed, but it also doesn't accentuate it in the way Beyer or others would. 

 

While I love HD650 and HE-400 almost equally,  I generally give the edge in terms of technical performance to HD650.  But I won't deny that HE-400 works perhaps the most magical performance of piano of any headphone I've heard.  Most things I listen to on HD650, but orchestra and piano is dedicated to HE-400 alone.


Edited by IEMCrazy - 7/20/12 at 11:11am
post #2342 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by IEMCrazy View Post

 

 

WHOA.  Tell me you did not have music playing into the Lyr when that happened.  At max gain with stock tubes and music incoming that would be a full 6-10W being pumped in.  I'm not sure they could take that without SOME effect.

 

 

Yeah,  there was music playing but they seem to have no damage to them... no harm, no foul i suppose. They were on his head at the time so he got a rude wake up.  Just like in my car, friends should never touch buttons.

post #2343 of 6020

That's crazy. The lyr is really a beast for power. It's a wonder that your friend does not have hearing loss and a pair of damaged hp's.

post #2344 of 6020

Took off the grills out of curiosity today, and auditioned some live songs whilst holding the two grills in hands and having them "on" and "off" the drivers, unfortunately it does seem like the grills cause a pretty significant negative effect on the soundstage. Not sure what they do to the FR exactly (it's definitely subtle) but they seem to restrict the HE400s from having a holographic speaker-like effect.

 

Now I'm wondering if a simple mod where the two grills are replaced by acoustically transparent but still rigid material is of interest.

post #2345 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

That's crazy. The lyr is really a beast for power. It's a wonder that your friend does not have hearing loss and a pair of damaged hp's.

They were mine and they are fine. They really do handle the Lyrs power well, I am sure at that gain increase for a longer time they would have been toast.

post #2346 of 6020

Friend of mine is kind to lend his HE400...while he is on month long vacation...he is ok me trying Velours on them...I am not sure when can I order them...Please give a link

post #2347 of 6020
post #2348 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

https://head-direct.com/Products/?act=detail&id=117

 

biggrin.gif

Thanks a lot

post #2349 of 6020

lucky lucky you. Friends with same expensive interest undefined

post #2350 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by IEMCrazy View Post


Usually when people say "HD650 doesn't have enough detail" what they mean is "it doesn't have enough treble emphasis and sparkle compared to others."  Which would be a true accusation.  With the steep treble rolloff they lack treble sparkle almost entirely, and the neutral treble region in general won't emphasize the treble section which happens to be where a lot of detail perception resides.  Meaning people don't want more detail, they want the detail to be emphasized so they perceive it more readily.   HD650 is extremely detailed.  It just doesn't shove the detail in your face the way some people prefer.

 

HE-400 is also extremely detailed, and it tries to make it slightly more emphasized with specific treble peaks, however it also rolls off some of that "sparkle" region.  It prevents the treble from being fully recessed, but it also doesn't accentuate it in the way Beyer or others would. 

 

While I love HD650 and HE-400 almost equally,  I generally give the edge in terms of technical performance to HD650.  But I won't deny that HE-400 works perhaps the most magical performance of piano of any headphone I've heard.  Most things I listen to on HD650, but orchestra and piano is dedicated to HE-400 alone.

Ah, sorry for my poor choice of words. When I said that they didn't have enough detail, I had really meant that they just weren't fast enough at times to keep up with some of my music, which were pretty rare, isolated occasions (Maybe I had been spoiled from back when I had heard the HE-500). Probably due to the overall warmness of the phones giving the wrong impression. Don't get me wrong, I loved the HD650's for what they did, and I definitely agree with you on how they kept great microdetails while without skewing the treble with emphasis. On that note, it is interesting to hear about how the HE-400 has treble peaks - how does that affect the brightness/darkness of the phones I've been hearing so much about being very dark? It's also great to hear that the HE-400 does piano well. The one thing I enjoy above all others in a headphones (well, aside from smooth vocals and guitars with proper timbre) are nicely rendered pianos - much of the music I listen to is centered on that.

 

I'll probably refrain from asking any more questions, not until I get to hear them tomorrow. Everyone's been a great help, I can hardly wait to listen to them!

post #2351 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevenlongs View Post

lucky lucky you. Friends with same expensive interest undefined

he took along my sennheiser pxc 450, it was kind of trade off, but lucky to have friend with same interest

post #2352 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinQY View Post

Ah, sorry for my poor choice of words. When I said that they didn't have enough detail, I had really meant that they just weren't fast enough at times to keep up with some of my music, which were pretty rare, isolated occasions (Maybe I had been spoiled from back when I had heard the HE-500). Probably due to the overall warmness of the phones giving the wrong impression. Don't get me wrong, I loved the HD650's for what they did, and I definitely agree with you on how they kept great microdetails while without skewing the treble with emphasis. On that note, it is interesting to hear about how the HE-400 has treble peaks - how does that affect the brightness/darkness of the phones I've been hearing so much about being very dark? It's also great to hear that the HE-400 does piano well. The one thing I enjoy above all others in a headphones (well, aside from smooth vocals and guitars with proper timbre) are nicely rendered pianos - much of the music I listen to is centered on that.

 

I'll probably refrain from asking any more questions, not until I get to hear them tomorrow. Everyone's been a great help, I can hardly wait to listen to them!

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/586885/new-hifiman-headphone-he-400-is-out/2280#post_8543810 answers it.

post #2353 of 6020

~~Hifiman Re-grilling mod (pre-alpha 0.10)~~

 

 

Separate thread describing the mod:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/619447/hifiman-he400-500-etc-re-grilling-mod

 

 

Photo:

 

700

 

 

 

 

soundstage is much more open and less closed in, width-wise, especially noticeable in live recorded tracks. Imaging is more 3D and natural, feels more speaker-like.


Edited by jerg - 7/21/12 at 11:26am
post #2354 of 6020

eek.gif...

post #2355 of 6020
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

eek.gif...

 

I look like a gangsta with all the black fabric jutting out of the headphones lol.

 

The inspiration of this mod came from user Plin, who posted a similar mod on his HE500s but only with the fabric, I thought why not add some steel mesh on top of those to mechanically protect the drivers, and voila.

 

As for the effect, it's very real, the stock grills cause a very significant narrowing of the soundstage (makes it more "headphone"-like) compared to no grills on at all, so the idea is to re-do the grills so it's more acoustically transparent but still protect the drivers from dust as well as accidental poking.

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