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Powering the AKG K1000 - Whats all the fuss about?

post #1 of 63
12/12/11 at 4:09pm
Thread Starter 

Hey there, I had a K1000 some months ago, and I'm considering getting a pair again. But I got wondering: Whats all the fuss about them being hard to drive, needing a speaker amp or a high power balanced amp? 

I mean when i got them, i just plugged them into my receivers jack, and voila - great sound...Then for the heck of it i even plugged it into my laptop and my ipod...All of them were able to run them at high volumes, and sound stunningly well. So yea...Whats all the fuss about? 

 

PS. Dont kill me xD

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post #2 of 63
12/12/11 at 4:11pm

If they sound good to you... don't worry about it then.

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post #3 of 63
12/12/11 at 4:39pm
Thread Starter 

If your profile didn't say "Headphoneus Supremus" I'd have guessed you were either new to the hobby, or you were my...Never mind. But its all about looking for the best sound, and i mean - theres obviously some reason why people say they should be hooked up to a speaker amp etc. But as far as i can make out, its not because its hard to drive at least...

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post #4 of 63
12/12/11 at 6:16pm

Don't k1000's take 4W to get 110dB?

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post #5 of 63
12/12/11 at 6:31pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PelPix View Post

Don't k1000's take 4W to get 110dB?


theyre 74dB/mW and 120Ohm, so taking them to 110dB wont take much - your average portable amp could do it. And 110dB is extremely unhealthy anyways :P

 

From what i experienced, my iPhone 4 could drive them louder than i could listen to, so thats also an indication that though they may not be very sensitive, they're not exactly a HE6 to drive either...

 

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post #6 of 63
12/12/11 at 6:53pm

What? I think you're messing up your calculations.

 

The amount of energy required for it to hit 110dB can be found by doing antilog((110-74)/10) = 3981mW of power. Now we take that and convert to voltage by taking SQRT(3.981 * 120) =  21.85V. That's more energy than any portable amp I've EVER seen pull. 
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorHalgaard View Post


theyre 74dB/mW and 120Ohm, so taking them to 110dB wont take much - your average portable amp could do it. And 110dB is extremely unhealthy anyways :P

 

From what i experienced, my iPhone 4 could drive them louder than i could listen to, so thats also an indication that though they may not be very sensitive, they're not exactly a HE6 to drive either...

 



 

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post #7 of 63
12/12/11 at 7:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorHalgaard View Post

If your profile didn't say "Headphoneus Supremus" I'd have guessed you were either new to the hobby, or you were my...Never mind. But its all about looking for the best sound, and i mean - theres obviously some reason why people say they should be hooked up to a speaker amp etc. But as far as i can make out, its not because its hard to drive at least...



Ok, so I guess you want a better answer.  

 

The k1000 is really hard to pair with a good amp IMO.  Sure you can toss them on any speaker amp or stereo receiver but the magic typically just isn't there.  I tried some of the "this is the best amp for k1000's amps" and left shaking my head in confusion as I really didn't like what I was hearing.  It's not just about the volume.

 

Best pair I had was with a Moth EC2a3 which was underpowered (imo) but had a very nice synergy going.  I had to max the volume to get just a hair under my normal listening levels; which quite frankly is a bit high.

 

I gave up after several attempts; going vintage receivers seems to be a good bet, but then you pay out the tooth for something that may be a pile of headaches!  I've also heard a 300b amp vs 2a3 could be the way to go for more power; Edie Current should have some stuff in the works too...


Edited by Mr.Sneis - 12/12/11 at 7:24pm
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post #8 of 63
12/12/11 at 8:28pm

Laptop and iPhone huh.....

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post #9 of 63
12/12/11 at 10:28pm

I plugged them to the Lyr and needed it at max to even get decent volume. Either you listen at very low volumes, I listen at very high, or you have some especially powerful iPhone.

 

In comparison the LCD2 with the Lyr is too loud for me at 12 o clock.

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post #10 of 63
12/12/11 at 10:32pm

83 dB SPL max peaks (with 1V from iPhone) is very reasonably loud for some listening with some types of music...Get back to us when you're listening to an orchestral solo at about -60 dBFS.

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post #11 of 63
12/12/11 at 11:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorHalgaard View Post

Hey there, I had a K1000 some months ago, and I'm considering getting a pair again. But I got wondering: Whats all the fuss about them being hard to drive, needing a speaker amp or a high power balanced amp? 

I mean when i got them, i just plugged them into my receivers jack, and voila - great sound...Then for the heck of it i even plugged it into my laptop and my ipod...All of them were able to run them at high volumes, and sound stunningly well. So yea...Whats all the fuss about? 

 

PS. Dont kill me xD



 If you do get another pair ~ they're likely to make you a popular chap down at your local audio store. Pop on down to try out the best

 selection of headphone amps on offer. Surely, you might come away with a different impression or two.

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post #12 of 63
12/12/11 at 11:44pm
i think the speaker amp was bit of marketing by AKG at the time and cause the drivers have such ridiculous low sensitivity of any headphone so driving from speaker outputs must been a must for most people. at 120ohm impedance they should work well out of most things like you experience but will most likely improve with good amplification like lot of AKG's discontinued line-up. the other headphone was hassle due to it's low sensitivity was their 240DF at only 88db and 600ohms nominal so they benefit out of driving directly from speaker outputs as well.

if you liked them out of a iphone and laptop then that's fine. while most people will probably shun and look down at you for that, it shouldn't matter and matter most to what you hear, but i do suggest trying the manuals route and drive them from speaker outputs. speaker outputs will offer endless voltage and current demands capable of frying any headphone and great for low sensitive headphones like the k1000 and will have complete control over the driver due to close to around 0 ohm output impedance amps have at the speaker outputs.
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post #13 of 63
12/13/11 at 3:04am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanjiWatsuki View Post

What? I think you're messing up your calculations.

 

The amount of energy required for it to hit 110dB can be found by doing antilog((110-74)/10) = 3981mW of power. Now we take that and convert to voltage by taking SQRT(3.981 * 120) =  21.85V. That's more energy than any portable amp I've EVER seen pull. 
 



 


My iBasso PB2 had 32V and so does the RSA SR 71b and the Rx MK3... :)

And i dont see how those calculations can be right if i am able to drive them that lout just off an ipod...
 

Oh and i may not be a eletrical engineer but i do know how to use a calculator. To get the amount of power needed is simply 110/74 = 1.48mW through 120Ohm which is not much - Had it been 600 ohm, the ipod probably couldnt handle it (though it can run a T1) but never mind.

 


Edited by VictorHalgaard - 12/13/11 at 3:16am
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post #14 of 63
12/13/11 at 3:11am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RexAeterna View Post

i think the speaker amp was bit of marketing by AKG at the time and cause the drivers have such ridiculous low sensitivity of any headphone so driving from speaker outputs must been a must for most people. at 120ohm impedance they should work well out of most things like you experience but will most likely improve with good amplification like lot of AKG's discontinued line-up. the other headphone was hassle due to it's low sensitivity was their 240DF at only 88db and 600ohms nominal so they benefit out of driving directly from speaker outputs as well.
if you liked them out of a iphone and laptop then that's fine. while most people will probably shun and look down at you for that, it shouldn't matter and matter most to what you hear, but i do suggest trying the manuals route and drive them from speaker outputs. speaker outputs will offer endless voltage and current demands capable of frying any headphone and great for low sensitive headphones like the k1000 and will have complete control over the driver due to close to around 0 ohm output impedance amps have at the speaker outputs.


Shun at me? You bet ya - seems some almost think im lying ^^

But I'll try hook it up to my Thule IA150B - Thats 150w of Hifi amplification, so if good quality power is supposed to make them shine, that sshould at least give me an idea what theyre on about...
 

 

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post #15 of 63
12/13/11 at 11:44am

I'm not sure if you had K1000's at all, but I don't think you're lying.  I just think you've got your headphones mixed up.

4416422128_85768b9006.jpg

These are AKG K1000's

 

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorHalgaard View Post

 

Oh and i may not be a eletrical engineer but i do know how to use a calculator. To get the amount of power needed is simply 110/74 = 1.48mW through 120Ohm which is not much - Had it been 600 ohm, the ipod probably couldnt handle it (though it can run a T1) but never mind.

 



No it isn't.  dB are logarithmic.  You need logarithmically more power for every dB.


Edited by PelPix - 12/13/11 at 11:49am
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