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Q701 impressions thread - Page 272

post #4066 of 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by PleasantSounds View Post
 

 

Another way to avoid holes in your skull:

 

 

These are simply stripes of self-adhesive foam - just like the one used for window sealing. Cut it to shape and stick in between the bumps. 5 minute job that does not damage your headphones, and you'll never know the bumps were there.

 

Oh, I love this idea!  Time to try it.

post #4067 of 9490

Might try it in the next pair. :biggrin: 

post #4068 of 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by PleasantSounds View Post
 

 

Another way to avoid holes in your skull:

 

 

These are simply stripes of self-adhesive foam - just like the one used for window sealing. Cut it to shape and stick in between the bumps. 5 minute job that does not damage your headphones, and you'll never know the bumps were there.

 

Looks great!  Gonna give it a shot this weekend.

post #4069 of 9490
Pretty sweet, PleasantSounds, awesome job. Count me in.
post #4070 of 9490

Just removed the bumps on mine as well.

 

I removed the 4 middle bumps, leaving only the outer 4 bumps. I then covered the ugly parts with a piece of black thin rubbery material which I cut from a backpack strap. Right now it is just stuck on with double sided tape, I may either glue it on or sew it on eventually. It took me a whole year to finally do this. The bumps didn't bother me as bad as some other people claim, but I figured that since I'm never ever selling this headphone ever, that I may as well hack it up and make it more comfortable. It doesn't look bad though really, but honestly headphones are made to sound good, not win beauty contests. I've only had them on for about 20 minutes since doing this, but so far so good. They feel lighter on my head which really just means that the weight is distributed more evenly now. 

 

 

This headphone really is perfect for me. It sounds amazing, especially after the bass mod, and now with additional comfort I really don't know how it could get any better. 

post #4071 of 9490
Thread Starter 

Could also try Creatology Foam that has adhesive backing. That's at Michaels or you can find a generic version at Wal-Mart.

Could either use those strips like in the above photo or maybe a whole piece?

 

Best of all you could make it all pink! The foam comes in a package with multiple colors. A Neon Green Q701 with pink headband would look great!

 

Doubt the Creatology foam is soft enough for your heads though? Never tried that.

post #4072 of 9490

The little piece of thin rubber I used is no more than a mm thick. It's there just to cover the uglyness of the bumps being cut off. I did not add any soft padding. I do have an almost full sheet of regular adhesive backed felt. I didn't even think about using that, but I could simply use a piece of that instead. The Annie and the 712 headbands look to be just plain old leather, they don't look to be padded. I don't think they really need to be padded, there just needs to be no bumps there. 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post
 

Could also try Creatology Foam that has adhesive backing. That's at Michaels or you can find a generic version at Wal-Mart.

Could either use those strips like in the above photo or maybe a whole piece?

 

Best of all you could make it all pink! The foam comes in a package with multiple colors. A Neon Green Q701 with pink headband would look great!

 

Doubt the Creatology foam is soft enough for your heads though? Never tried that.

post #4073 of 9490
Thread Starter 

I wonder if the soundstage of the HD-800 is larger than the modded Q701? I imagine so. If so is it bigger than the K501? Bigger isn't better really when it comes to soundstage.

K501 had the biggest soundstage i've ever heard and that's why I prefer the K400 to the K501.

 

I swear that the modded Q701 now has much better soundstage depth than stock. How or why..I have no idea.

Supposedly the HD-800 has very good soundstage depth. Yeah I know it's partially the recording but still...

 

The modded Q701 sounds really speaker like, but nothing too distant. Depends on recording of course.

I'm kind of sad right now because I just sold my entire home theater system. Just no room for them now. :(

Listening to movies with just TV speakers kind of stinks.

 

I was attached to some JBL Northridge floorstanding speakers. They were not expensive but I loved how they sounded and preferred them to some $1000 Axiom speakers I bought (when I actually had money).

I also had some Paradigm Titans but never really liked them much. All the cheap Infinity stuff I tried I didn't like also. It's weird to think that JBL is owned by Harman.

Those Axioms reminded me of like a K701 or DT-880 :confused_face_2: Really harsh sounding for me.

 

I'm actually glad to not be into buying speakers since I make way less than 5 years ago.

post #4074 of 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post
 

I swear that the modded Q701 now has much better soundstage depth than stock. How or why..I have no idea.

 

The modded Q701 sounds really speaker like.

I agree with this as well. Maybe it is a perceived side effect of the increased bottom end.

 

I stole your idea of the adhesive backed felt:

 

 

Now I am happy with the looks again as well. No harm done IMO.

post #4075 of 9490

You guys are pushing me to buy these :D

 

also, why are the bumps there in the first place?

post #4076 of 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Bird View Post
 

You guys are pushing me to buy these :D

 

also, why are the bumps there in the first place?

 

"Padding."  They are foam.  Push them in, they'll come back out.  An ill-conceived idea, I guess, or so it seems from the complaints.  And I'll say, with my lack of hair, I noticed two red marks on my scalp after wearing them for an hour.  A bit disconcerting.  I never found them uncomfortable to the point of distraction, but there's room for improvement.  I did the "foam between the bumps" mod mentioned above, but haven't had a chance to wear them for any length of time.  Just trying them on after sticking the foam on, they seem more comfortable.  Hoping it'll pass a real test.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Edit to give props to PleasantSounds.  Cheers, mate :k701smile:


Edited by ThurstonX - 10/2/13 at 8:16pm
post #4077 of 9490

Sounds silly, but I'll live with it.

 

I'm deciding between the Topping tp30 and the fiio E10 for my amp/dac combo.

 

Which would you guys spring for?

post #4078 of 9490

Here are my impressions of the bass port mod:

(I tried it with one side modded for a day, and then with both sides modded).

 

 

  • The main difference the mod makes is that the low bass is a little more forward. I tested the low bass playing low frequency (14hz, 18hz, 20hz, 30hz, etc).  test tones in each channel, and I can hear the modded side is stronger. From what I can hear the bass evens out more after the low-bass.  I can't be sure at what frequency it evens out though - that's where you'd need to measure them. It would be interesting to look at measurments, where I imagine you will see the low bass being a tad less rolled off on the modded can.  Here are some low frequency test tones. http://www.audiocheck.net/testtones_subwooferharmonicdistortion.php

 

  • Not too much change in soundstage.  It might be slightly more open, but if it is it's very minor and not really worth mentioning.

 

  • I don't hear fuller mids.  If anything, the mids are less forward and less full.
 
 
 
I played full range frequency sweeps used for driver matching.  If both sides are identical the sound image should stay in the center, where if it's stronger on one side it will pan to either the left to right.  I can hear the sweep is panned harder to the modded side when it starts out (low bass) then eventually pans to the center somewhere or before the mid-bass.
 
For better or worse, a modded Q701 is still not going to sound like an Anniversary or K712.  Apart from some change in the bass, the rest of the differences remain.   The Q701 is still going to have it's cooler, airier, drier sound and the K712 & Anniversary will still have their warmer, thicker, darker sound.  So there's no real need to re-compare them.  If you prefer the Q701 to the Anniversary or K712, that's perfectly fine.  It's 100% subjective though.
 
The mod doesn't transforms it into a flagship-killing headphone or anything.  It's not like a little low bass roll-off was the only issue separating the Q701 from the flagship.  It still has a somewhat harsh upper mid peak, graininess, blurriness, compressed dynamics, and lacks some soundstage depth.  That's being harsh on the Q701 of course, and mid-fi headphones are still about 85% as good as flagships.  This mod doesn't make up that last 15% though or anything like that.  It's just modifies the sound a little to add a bit more low bass.
 
This mod isn't too hard to do, and I don't really hear any glaring faults with it, so I'd say it's worth playing around with at least.  Don't expect too much change apart from the low bass though.
 
 

Edited by chicolom - 10/2/13 at 11:48pm
post #4079 of 9490

Big Bird, just a guess but I think the bumps are there because it's not like a concerted outcry from fans around the world that hate the dang things would be enough to change the designers' minds on including them.  Being an American living in Europe, I can tell you that some AKG engineer wouldn't let a little thing like whopping discomfort get in the way of tradition.  :blink:

 

ThurstonX, I hear you.  My bald head started developing two scarily permanent looking indentations from the things, which made me look eerily Sleestak.  Took several weeks to go away when I sold the cans during my move overseas.

 

Jasonb, there is one way the headphones actually can get better - Katy Perry wearing her Roar video outfit and feeing you grapes while you listen to it.

 

 

chicolom, you've brought up several interesting points which I'd love to ask you about:

 

How is the illusion of soundstage created in a headphone?  Like, how does the human ear perceive it?  I guess knowing that would answer how the bass port mod affects it one way or another.  For me, bigger IS better, when it comes to soundstage.  I chose the K702 over several other high-end headphones not only for the sound signature, but the soundstage was something I just couldn't give up.  I couldn't "go back" in a sense to lesser soundstages.

 

I guess it could be too big, but I can't see how.  What was it you didn't like about the massive presentation of the K501?

 

I'm a little worried about your other notes, though, that the you feel the mod may push the mids and vocals more into the background.  To me, the K702 barely presents the vocals forward enough to be acceptable.  The K701 didn't, for example, which is why I don't use one.  I'm worried the bass port mod could make the Q701 sound more like the K701, and thus ruin the whole sound for me.  (Though yes, I know it's reversible so I'll try it anyway).

 

Also, I'm super intrigued by your comparisons to the K712.

 

The big reason I love this AKG K/Q7xx series so much is the dry, airy sound of all three models.  All the instruments are well separated, without muddying, and it's like watching them alone in a theater on a massive stage, all spread out with lots of room to express themselves.  I often picture myself in the Hollywood Bowl or something, by myself, with a 5-person band just spread way out across the stage, each musician in their own little quadrant with a minimal setup.  Or, like when I saw Rush with their minimal Roll the Bones setup at Irvine Meadows.  I loved playing that way when I was in a band, and the freedom it made you feel just to play at the top of your game.  In no headphone does Trance sound as immersive and clean - you can really hear every single detail, without the instruments smacking into each other like a freeway traffic pileup, as Trance sounds in so, so many other headphones.

 

Anyway... my point:  when you say the K712 have a warmer, thicker, darker sound, does this in any way sacrifice all that I just said above?  For example, I felt the M-Stage was a perfectly capable amp for the K702 I ran them with last year, but the darkness and warmth of the sound stole too much from the strong points of the K702, so I dumped the amp.  It took away it's expressiveness in too many ways, made them darker, warmer, cloudier, but without the detail and clarity of a great tube amp (which also honeys them up a bit, of course).

 

Finally, with all the other issues you mentioned separating the Q701 from the flagship nature of the K712: do you really, honestly feel the differences are enough to warrant paying twice as much (or more) for the K712?  I can get the Q701 for $200, used on Amazon, in new condition with a warranty through Amazon who backs those warranties up flawlessly.  I'd hate to spend double that price for a headphone that's basically the same, with only marginal improvements.

post #4080 of 9490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kouzelna View Post
 

chicolom, you've brought up several interesting points which I'd love to ask you about:

 

How is the illusion of soundstage created in a headphone?  Like, how does the human ear perceive it?  I guess knowing that would answer how the bass port mod affects it one way or another.  For me, bigger IS better, when it comes to soundstage.  I chose the K702 over several other high-end headphones not only for the sound signature, but the soundstage was something I just couldn't give up.  I couldn't "go back" in a sense to lesser soundstages.

I don't know what elements all factor into creating soundstage.  I know that the best soundstage headphones are usually full-sized circumaural with large spacious earcups (and sometimes angled-drivers).  There are some other various factors that go into it, but I don't know the science behind it.

 

 

I guess it could be too big, but I can't see how.  What was it you didn't like about the massive presentation of the K501?

 

I've never tried the K501, but I've yet to hear a headphone with a soundstage too-big for me.

 

 

I'm a little worried about your other notes, though, that the you feel the mod may push the mids and vocals more into the background.  To me, the K702 barely presents the vocals forward enough to be acceptable.  The K701 didn't, for example, which is why I don't use one.  I'm worried the bass port mod could make the Q701 sound more like the K701, and thus ruin the whole sound for me.  (Though yes, I know it's reversible so I'll try it anyway).

 

I don't think the mids and vocals are that affected.  I certainly didn't hear the mids as being any fuller though, so I wanted to comment on it.  Like you said, you can always reverse the mod if you don't like it.

 

 

Also, I'm super intrigued by your comparisons to the K712.

 

The big reason I love this AKG K/Q7xx series so much is the dry, airy sound of all three models.  All the instruments are well separated, without muddying, and it's like watching them alone in a theater on a massive stage, all spread out with lots of room to express themselves.  I often picture myself in the Hollywood Bowl or something, by myself, with a 5-person band just spread way out across the stage, each musician in their own little quadrant with a minimal setup.  Or, like when I saw Rush with their minimal Roll the Bones setup at Irvine Meadows.  I loved playing that way when I was in a band, and the freedom it made you feel just to play at the top of your game.  In no headphone does Trance sound as immersive and clean - you can really hear every single detail, without the instruments smacking into each other like a freeway traffic pileup, as Trance sounds in so, so many other headphones.

 

Anyway... my point:  when you say the K712 have a warmer, thicker, darker sound, does this in any way sacrifice all that I just said above?  For example, I felt the M-Stage was a perfectly capable amp for the K702 I ran them with last year, but the darkness and warmth of the sound stole too much from the strong points of the K702, so I dumped the amp.  It took away it's expressiveness in too many ways, made them darker, warmer, cloudier, but without the detail and clarity of a great tube amp (which also honeys them up a bit, of course).

 

From my experience, anytime a headphone sounds darker and warmer it usually also gives a perception of sounding more intimate.  A lighter signature usually sounds less grounded and the sounds will float more which can make the soundstage sound more open.  The same is true for the Q701 and K712.  If you listen to the K712 and adjust to it and then go back to the Q701, the soundstage doesn't sound as different.   It's coming from the other direction (Q701 to K712) that it will strike you as being more intimate. 

 

Keep in mind you can always stick angled pads onto the K712 and it will then sound lighter and airier again, although not quite to the same extent as the Q701. I consider that a good thing though, as I find the Q701 to be just slightly too dry.

 

 

 

Finally, with all the other issues you mentioned separating the Q701 from the flagship nature of the K712: do you really, honestly feel the differences are enough to warrant paying twice as much (or more) for the K712?  I can get the Q701 for $200, used on Amazon, in new condition with a warranty through Amazon who backs those warranties up flawlessly.  I'd hate to spend double that price for a headphone that's basically the same, with only marginal improvements.

 

When I said "flagships" I meant things like the HD800 and other ~$1000 headphones.  I was comparing how the Q701 is deficient next to them.

 

The K712 may technically be a "flagship" (until the K812 is released, at least), but it's still what most would consider a "mid-fi" headphone.  It's more of a variation on the Q701s sound, so it will still share some of same the issues that I mentioned the Q701 as having.  I can't say whether the K712 would be worth it to you, but I like it over the Q701.  It improves a couple issues I had such as overly dry and peaky upper mids, and it has a smoother signature with more body.  The K712 can be considered AKG's attempt to further refine that model given the existing design and drivers they have to work with.  Some people are still going to prefer the Q701 to the K712 though and others vice a versa.  I can't say which camp you'd fall in.  You said you like a dry and airy sound, so that's probably more the Q701.

 

I'd say you can go the route I went and try the Q701 first, and then later get the K712.  That way you will know for yourself which you prefer.  Or you can get the K712, and then get angled pads for it.  Either way, it's just a part of the head-fi journey.


Edited by chicolom - 10/3/13 at 3:36am
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