or Connect
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › LCD3 Kirkland Bath Tissue Edition, a.k.a. ToiletPants
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

LCD3 Kirkland Bath Tissue Edition, a.k.a. ToiletPants - Page 11

post #151 of 275

I was returning the LCD3 loaner pair tonight.

 

Then rhythmdevils rolled some different materials in for damping.  

 

Was that yellow stuff fiberglass??? blink.gif

 

Things were not going the right way until..THE TP.

 

Much better in the bass to low-mids/mid-mids, less "murkiness".

 

I hope to listen again at home for a couple nights to confirm.

 

No joke.

Reply
post #152 of 275

Did you try microporous tape over the felt or whatever damping material glued to the driver? This is what I've done on my LCD2R2 together with removing the cup grills felt. And I stuffed the internal of the cups with 100% not died wool fibers to reduce resonances. No more murkiness. Only a slight honk in the mid lows that I'm sure there still space too reduce and that probably was there even before (but I couldn't detect in all that congestion). No microdynamic reduction for what I can see so far with both orchestral and camera classical, jazz and drum and bass music.

That, for me, transformed the lcd2 from a mediocre can to an outstanding one and now I can look at cable improvements rather than sell it.

May be something in the same line works for the lcd3 as well.

 

post #153 of 275

Question:

 

What would you do if you have a bathroom rig with the TP-modded LCD3 and you ran out of toilet paper?

 

post #154 of 275

In that case one of those ridiculous chain cables would come in handy

post #155 of 275

Frankly, way better the TP in the LCDx than the LCDx in the toilet.

post #156 of 275

Nah, too coarse for toilet use dude.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by n3rdling View Post

In that case one of those ridiculous chain cables would come in handy



 

 

post #157 of 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by Antistase View Post

Frankly, way better the TP in the LCDx than the LCDx in the toilet.



We are in murky waters.

post #158 of 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by WNBC View Post

Very interesting.  I modded my Fostex T50 orthos and dampening decreased the soundstage but tightened the bass.  In any case, glad you have modded it to your liking.  Looking forward to your review on the Arete + LCD-3 combo.  

 



weird. i actually increased the imaging and soundstage on mine with experimentation while in the process killed resonance and tighten the bass response. all the stuff i did to it is completely reversible as well. still messing with it though and trying to think on how i can improve it any farther. so far i got it way i like but something just seems off to me. just can't pin-point it though. i just have a feeling something is off in the sound somewhere.
post #159 of 275
Thread Starter 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RexAeterna View Post

i just have a feeling something is off in the sound somewhere.


I get that feeling too. I think the driver is just way too big for a headphone. Tyll's measurements show less distortion at 100db than 90db. It's all speculation and conjecture at this point, but this tells me that the driver is more suited to playing at louder volumes (speakers.) A quick look at the Fostex, and you realize how much sound you can get for such small ortho drivers. It could also be a surround or diaphragm suspension issue related to such a large driver.

 

I also feel the T50RP driver is more responsive and is able to express the nuances that the LCD2 couldn't. The LCD3 is better in this regard.

 

post #160 of 275

The same thing shows up in a number of Tyll's measurements.  For example:

 

All the Audeze headphones

HE5

HE500

HD600/650 in midrange/treble

HE60

SR009

SR007

SR507

SR404

T50p

T70

DT770

D1100

D2/5/7000 in mids/treble

SR003

 

A number of other low end headphones.

 

It's interesting that the dynamics (outside of those Beyers) have lower distortion at 90 dB than 100 dB with a few exceptions showing lower distortion in the bass and higher distortion in the mids/treble.  The orthos and stats on the otherhand generally seem to have less distortion at 100 dB than 90 dB through the audible spectrum.  Notable exceptions are some of the HiFiman headphones (which have pretty high distortion in general for orthos) and the SR Sigma (which has pretty high distortion for an electrostat and is also a really unique design).  I'm guessing the backwave from these dipole type drivers has something to do with this?

post #161 of 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by purrin View Post




I get that feeling too. I think the driver is just way too big for a headphone. Tyll's measurements show less distortion at 100db than 90db. It's all speculation and conjecture at this point, but this tells me that the driver is more suited to playing at louder volumes (speakers.) A quick look at the Fostex, and you realize how much sound you can get for such small ortho drivers. It could also be a surround or diaphragm suspension issue related to such a large driver.

I also feel the T50RP driver is more responsive and is able to express the nuances that the LCD2 couldn't. The LCD3 is better in this regard.

the driver is pretty big now that i think about it when comparing it to the actual cup size. no wonder it had major resonance and cancellations when i looked inside. easy to solve the cup issue like it is to solve speaker box issue by making the driver believe it's in a bigger enclosure. it can help from my experience from messing around and stuff. i would think the same can be done with the LCD2 but thinking about it since it's open design it'll be little bit more difficult to provide the driver with the same illusion.

i'm guessing working with an open headphone is like working with a ported box maybe? it's all i can guess as of now. not really expert on things. i just see something and experiment and to best of my ability use my imagination and ears to do the fine tuning or tinkering. i really don't know much on the technical parts of things. i have used TP before,and not just for headphones. good for plugging holes in foam surrounds with aid of some rubber cement for doing quick repair jobs till you can completely fix the new foam surround,unless it's cloth or something(i seen speakers with cloth surrounds).
post #162 of 275
Thread Starter 

We are kind of SOL with the open design. Not like a ported box at all, but more like a dipole or H-frame. There's not much room to play with.

post #163 of 275
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by n3rdling View Post

The same thing shows up in a number of Tyll's measurements.  For example:

 

All the Audeze headphones

HE5

HE500

HD600/650 in midrange/treble

HE60

SR009

SR007

SR507

SR404

T50p

T70

DT770

D1100

D2/5/7000 in mids/treble

SR003

 

A number of other low end headphones.

 

It's interesting that the dynamics (outside of those Beyers) have lower distortion at 90 dB than 100 dB with a few exceptions showing lower distortion in the bass and higher distortion in the mids/treble.  The orthos and stats on the otherhand generally seem to have less distortion at 100 dB than 90 dB through the audible spectrum.  Notable exceptions are some of the HiFiman headphones (which have pretty high distortion in general for orthos) and the SR Sigma (which has pretty high distortion for an electrostat and is also a really unique design).  I'm guessing the backwave from these dipole type drivers has something to do with this?

 

Don't have the LCD3s on hand since they are on the West Coast tour. Have LCD2s though and can take some of my own measurements. Tonight maybe. One thing to note; THD can be a percentage or a dB relative to the fundamental. So for example:

 

  1. 100Hz sine wave at 90db with a 2nd harmonic at 200Hz at 40db
  2. 100Hz sine wave at 100db with a 2nd harmonic at 200Hz at 42db

 

#1 expressed as a percentage is higher.

post #164 of 275

Excellent point and I have a feeling you nailed it on the head.  This makes sense because the distortion on many of those headphones is lower than pretty much everything else.  Combine this fact with the logarithmic scaling on the distortion graphs (Y axis) and it could be quite deceiving.  

post #165 of 275
Quote:
Originally Posted by purrin View Post

 


I get that feeling too. I think the driver is just way too big for a headphone. Tyll's measurements show less distortion at 100db than 90db. It's all speculation and conjecture at this point, but this tells me that the driver is more suited to playing at louder volumes (speakers.) A quick look at the Fostex, and you realize how much sound you can get for such small ortho drivers. It could also be a surround or diaphragm suspension issue related to such a large driver.

 

 


maybe for these reasons, i have been preferring more absorbent stuffing in my last few modding attempts. 

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: High-end Audio Forum
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Summit-Fi (High-End Audio) › High-end Audio Forum › LCD3 Kirkland Bath Tissue Edition, a.k.a. ToiletPants