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Newbie post & new to forums: onboard sound v. DAC v. non-DAC amp, what to do?

post #1 of 9
11/6/11 at 10:37am
Thread Starter 

Hi Mates, 

 

I'm new to the forums and new to this audiophile world in general, so I appreciate your patience and help.  I bought a pair of Sennheiser PC350 headhphones a while back for use with my desktop computer, but they sounded like garbage.  I was really pretty surprised.  Then after reading up, I realized that it might be because I needed to use a headphone amp with them.  I was just plugging them into my front-panel headphone jack that was connected to the mobo onboard sound.  

 

I've done some reading here and on the web and it's time to do something about this.  I looked at the FiiO E9 desktop amp, but am a bit confused between this amp and the digital-to-analog-converter DAC amps.  If I use something like the E9 (non-DAC), that means that I'm using the onboard soundcard to do the digital-to-analog conversion, and the E9 is simply amplifying whatever the motherboard puts out, right?  But if I used something like the FiiO E7 or some other DAC amp and plug it into a USB port, then the DAC amp is itself doing the conversion AND amplifying the signal to power the headphones, right?

 

So I wonder: to run my PC350s or whatever decent set of headphones that I'm using, does this difference matter?  In other words, are onboard/motherboard DACs generally totally fine, because all they're doing is simple conversion of digital to analog, but it's the actual amplification that's the problem?  If that's a "yes," then I don't need a DAC, I just need an amp.  But then why would anyone ever need a DAC amp instead of just a regular amp, for example to power their portable mp3 player?  I'm a bit confused about this.  Just as I'm confused about why the E9 can "dock" with the E7, suggesting that there is some benefit to using them together with a computer.  

 

So I guess this is all a convoluted way of asking: does it matter whether I get a DAC or non-DAC amp to power my PC350s for use with my computer?  What's the benefit of something like the FiiO E9 (http://www.amazon.com/FiiO-Desktop-Headphone-Amplifier-Dock/dp/B004M172FY/ref=sr_1_10?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1320601061&sr=1-10) versus the E7 (http://www.amazon.com/FiiO-E7-Portable-Headphone-Amplifier/dp/B003E6K1VK/ref=sr_1_7?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1320601061&sr=1-7)?  

 

Thanks very much!

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post #2 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:31am

Onboard dacs are in a noisey pc case though and the advantage of the extenal 1 is it isn't, the E7 isn't that expensive so if you get the E9 you might aswell get the E7 to go with it.

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post #3 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:36am
Thread Starter 

How about just the E7 and no E9?  Will that serve its purpose for this setup?  What do people use a non-DAC E9 for anyway?  For vinyl?

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post #4 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:41am

The E9 is just an amplifier.  If you have the rest of your signal chain covered, and you need the extra power the E9 has vs an E7  (for example) you buy an amp.

 

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post #5 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:41am

People hook the E9 up to another DAC.

 

It's almost always a good idea to get away from onboard sound. It's noisy and not well designed. That doesn't mean you'll hear a difference, but it's a sort of "good sound guarantee" to get a better DAC.

 

Get just the E7, or the E10 (which will be a better choice if you don't need portability, it's more powerful). The E9 may be beneficial later on depending on what headphones you get next, but I'd only worry about that if you don't get enough volume.

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post #6 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:42am

Your headphones are 150ohm, 108db spl , my sennheiser pxc450 are the same and the E7 alone struggles to drive them properly, the E10 might be ok though but I think really you need the E9.

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post #7 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:47am

108 dB/V or dB/mW? The E7 should have no problem at all with those specs, either way. It does 1.87 Vrms at 150 ohms, with 108 dB/V that would be just over 113 dB.

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post #8 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:51am

I had to max the E7 out with my sennheiser pxc450 and still then sometimes it wasn't enough, the E9 drives them much better but the E10 should be ok.

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post #9 of 9
11/6/11 at 11:51am

In short, there is nothing simple about digital to analog conversion when it comes to audio. There are no simple rules that always work for all situations. That said, I will share my experience with that headset.

 

The PC350 is an excellent gaming headset. It is still a favorite of mine for gaming . . . it is just for solo gaming now that the mic is no longer working reliably. The PC350s worked well with a variety of gaming surround sound cards and systems (like the ASTRO Mixamp Pro - a headphone favorite for console gaming) that simulate surround sound with headphones. The problem was music. A quick check demonstrated to my satisfaction that a supposedly high quality rip of a CD was far less convincing coming from my SoundBlaster equipped PC than was the case from out the headphone jack on my AVR (mid-range Sony AVR with CD playback via a Panasonic DVD player).

 

Depending on your source music and your tastes, a better headphone may be a better upgrade for you. In my experience, the PC350 does sound better with higher quality amplification (and the fine grained volume control you would hopefully get), but there are better (and less expensive) headphones for music - again - depending on your tastes. Try your PC350s with a stereo receiver or AVR to see if a headphone amp is a useful upgrade for you. A better DAC is also worthy of consideration, but only if you committed to going lossless with your CD rips and/or buying high sample-rate recordings (e.g. 24-bit at 88 kHz and above). That bit about DACs is my opinion - YMMV.

 

Good luck!


Edited by MtnSloth - 11/6/11 at 12:08pm
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