Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › V-MODA Crossfade M-80 Reviews
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

V-MODA Crossfade M-80 Reviews - Page 162

post #2416 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiderNhan View Post

It's not loudness. I had a similar experience with the V-80 on airplanes. It's almost like it amplifies the sound of the airplane noise. I swapped them out for my $50 Sony noise-cancelling IEMs to much MUCH better results than the V-80. The M-100s work pretty well for flying, though.

also why would the m-100 work better, they have vents just like the m-80s if anything bigger vents since the headphones full size... but it is over ear but i wouldn't think that would have THAT MUCH effect

post #2417 of 2757
I don't know that it's necessarily the vents that are the issue on a plane, the vents have only become prominent for me if it's very windy outside (or you decide to stand in front of an industrial fan for some reason...), you'll hear a subdued whistling as wind leaks in. On a plane I think it's just a combination of the enclosed and reflection prone space plus engine rumble, most on ears would probably suffer equally. The M-100 are over the ear so they create a better seal, potentially mitigating that a bit.

I've worm my M-80 on a plane but like I said, only because I was too lazy to fetch my IEM, and I remember not even wearing them the whole flight so I was probably not enjoying them much... I'm not very critical of SQ on a plane anyway since I've usually got other things on my mind, I've flown once or twice a year for the last 20 but lately I tend to get sick on like every other flight. Not sure why, I don't get car/sea sick or suffer from vertigo or anything.

I never use volume purely to drown out noise btw.
Edited by Impulse - 4/11/13 at 5:14pm
post #2418 of 2757
Btw, this discussion is great and all but if you wanna get more technical or specific then Innerfidelity has isolation plots for pretty much all the relevant options being discussed... The M-80 doesn't start isolating significantly until after 500Hz, after that isolation starts increasing and by 1KHz it's up to -10dB, past 3KHz it's up to -30dB.

The Senn HD25-1 II is one if the most isolating on-ears you'll find (it's also much more vice-like), sports announcers use these things during basketball games, if that tells you anything... Isolation starts creeping up on them earlier, around 250Hz, and by 900Hz it's up to -25dB, by 3KHz it increases again to -30dB. So these will probably do better with a screaming throng of fans (or just, y'know, people noise in general) but I doubt it'll do significantly better with engine rumble.

Some of the best isolating IEM out there, like Etys, will get you around -25dB of isolation against low frequencies that on ears won't mitigate by even one decibel... So you're never gonna get anywhere near that with passive on-ears. Same pair of IEM will do -35dB against mids (300Hz+) where on ears barely start to isolate, and -50dB against the highest frequencies.

I'm no expert at interpreting graphs but all of that maps pretty well to what I've heard of those headphones... Someone was wondering whether the M-80 are more isolating than the Zoro's, now I haven't heard these but going by the graph the Zoros don't start isolating outside freqs significantly until 900Hz, so there's a difference right there. At 3KHz they're near -35dB, they reach -10dB at nearly 2KHz.

Someone else brought up the M-100, haven't heard those either but according to Inner Fidelity's charts they start isolating a bit earlier than even the HD25, at 200Hz, though isolation seems to increase at a lower rate than with any of the on-ears. By 1KHz they're at -15dB and by 3KHz they're at -30dB (though isolation drops again by 7KHz, still, it remains at -25dB). So they do better than the M-80 (specially at the low end) but not better than the HD25-1 II, or IEM obviously.

Just a matter of what kinda noise you're trying to drown out and how much of it. Seems like the M-80 would do better than the Zoros in general (specially with voices) but if you want near absolute isolation then there's better choices out there. If you're a frequent air traveler then get active NC or IEM, period. (I'm partial to the latter but my Dumbo ears aren't very sensitive to having stuff shoved in)

Hope that helps! You should check out the IF graphs for yourself, maybe look at some of the other IEM. Etys are as invasive as it gets, I get along fine with them but YMMV, and at some point I'll probably try those custom molded tips they offer for $100... Seems like a bargain compared to fully custom shelled IEM.

I stand by what I said earlier about the M-80 isolating just enough for my general needs, any more and I wouldn't be able to wear them while wanting to remain somewhat aware of certain outside cues (PA announcements, a store employee trying to get my attention, etc).
Edited by Impulse - 4/11/13 at 6:42pm
post #2419 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impulse View Post

Btw, this discussion is great and all but if you wanna get more technical or specific then Innerfidelity has isolation plots for pretty much all the relevant options being discussed... The M-80 doesn't start isolating significantly until after 500Hz, after that isolation starts increasing and by 1KHz it's up to -10dB, past 3KHz it's up to -30dB.

The Senn HD25-1 II is one if the most isolating on-ears you'll find (it's also much more vice-like), sports announcers use these things during basketball games, if that tells you anything... Isolation starts creeping up on them earlier, around 250Hz, and by 900Hz it's up to -25dB, by 3KHz it increases again to -30dB. So these will probably do better with a screaming throng of fans (or just, y'know, people noise in general) but I doubt it'll do significantly better with engine rumble.

Some of the best isolating IEM out there, like Etys, will get you around -25dB of isolation against low frequencies that on ears won't mitigate by even one decibel... So you're never gonna get anywhere near that with passive on-ears. Same pair of IEM will do -35dB against mids (300Hz+) where on ears barely start to isolate, and -50dB against the highest frequencies.

I'm no expert at interpreting graphs but all of that maps pretty well to what I've heard of those headphones... Someone was wondering whether the M-80 are more isolating than the Zoro's, now I haven't heard these but going by the graph the Zoros don't start isolating outside freqs significantly until 900Hz, so there's a difference right there. At 3KHz they're near -35dB, they reach -10dB at nearly 2KHz.

Someone else brought up the M-100, haven't heard those either but according to Inner Fidelity's charts they start isolating a bit earlier than even the HD25, at 200Hz, though isolation seems to increase at a lower rate than with any of the on-ears. By 1KHz they're at -15dB and by 3KHz they're at -30dB (though isolation drops again by 7KHz, still, it remains at -25dB). So they do better than the M-80 (specially at the low end) but not better than the HD25-1 II, or IEM obviously.

Just a matter of what kinda noise you're trying to down out and how much of it. Seems like the M-80 would do better than the Zoros in general (specially with voices) but if you want near absolute isolation then there's better choices out there. If you're a frequent air traveler then get active NC or IEM, period. (I'm partial to the latter but my Dumbo ears aren't very sensitive to having stuff shoved in)

Hope that helps! You should check out the IF graphs for yourself, maybe look at some of the other IEM. Etys are as invasive as it gets, I get along fine with them but YMMV, and at some point I'll probably try those custom molded tips they offer for $100... Seems like a bargain compared to fully custom shelled IEM.

I stand by what I said earlier about the M-80 isolating just enough for my general needs, any more and I wouldn't be able to wear them while wanting to remain aware of some outside cues (PA announcements, a store employee trying to get my attention, etc).

thanks for the fantastic reply!! i really appreciate your input, i use innerfidelity too its a fantastic website! i actually started to learn only a little bit on how to interpret the frequency response... still really bad at it but i can guess where the bass starts, mids and treble are ROUGHLY!! 

 

 

however i always wanted to learn how to interpret the isolation graphs i never did get it... .i did compare the m100 m80 and the noontecs before... wasn't sure what i was looking at i was basing the isolation on what tyll said on the written portion of the review

 

for the headphones i just wanna tune out the subway cart noise or the bus engine..... voices i'm not too concerned about ppl in toronto are pretty quiet on the bus... generally... but there are those times....

 

and for the etymotic example i used... i got that info from amazon... not even sure if its correct but thats what their advertised at...

 

thank you for your patience i really do appreciate it


Edited by Tom22 - 4/11/13 at 6:30pm
post #2420 of 2757
The isolation graphs are basically just a plot of how much outside noise is reduced at different frequencies... The FR corresponds to the outside noise and the reduction in decibels of that is what the headphones provide you.

So if you know the frequency range of something in your environment (let's say, voices, 300-3K) then you can look at the graph and it tells you by how many dB that frequency will be reduced. Now decibels are a logarithmic scale so an increase in isolation of 3dB vs 9dB isn't linear (i.e. 9dB isn't 3x more), but you can Google that for a far better explanation than I can provide. tongue.gif

I don't think a bus engine (while you're sitting inside it) goes anywhere near as deep as a plane's engine rumble, which you don't just hear but can plainly feel... Not really sure about subways. Mass transit in Puerto Rico sucks so I drive almost everywhere... frown.gif I think subway carts would be a mix of frequencies no? Buncha parts rattling all over plus the actual grind (screech?) of the rail system itself.
Edited by Impulse - 4/11/13 at 6:58pm
post #2421 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impulse View Post

The isolation graphs are basicallyt a plot of how much outside noise is reduced at different frequencies... The FR corresponds to the outside noise and the reduction in decibels of that is what the headphones provide you.

So if you know the frequency range of something in your environment (let's say, voices, 300-3K) then you can look at the graph and it tells you by how many dB that frequency will be reduced. Now decibels are a logarithmic scale so an increase in isolation of 3dB vs 9dB isn't linear (i.e. 9dB isn't 3x more), but you can Google that for a far better explanation than I can provide. tongue.gif

I don't think a bus engine (while you're sitting inside it) goes anywhere near as deep as a plane's engine rumble, which you don't just hear but can plainly feel... Not really sure about subways. Mass transit in Puerto Rico sucks so I drive almost everywhere... frown.gif I think subway carts would be a mix of frequencies no? Buncha parts rattling all over plus the actual grind (screech?) of the rail system itself.

I have also been researching headphones and have decided on the M80's as my first decent set of headphones. I fly once a year on a 10 hour flight to Europe and would prefer to be able to somewhat use my headphones on the flight. In the past I have used the included in-ear buds from my Galaxy Nexus but that required me raising the volume quite a bit.
Are the M80's somewhat usable on a plane by raising the volume a bit above what you normally listen too? Can you comment on the comfort of the M80's as well?
post #2422 of 2757
As far as comfort goes, your best bet would be to find a Radio Shack or Microsoft store to try them in. It just varies a lot from person to person, specially with on-ears.

I have big ears (they're not very sensitive tho), lots of hair, and a medium sized head and I find them comfortable enough to wear for a couple hours at a time even while walking etc. They don't get particularly hot for me, but they'll induce a bit of sweat if you aren't sitting still (the 90%+ humidity here might have something to do with that tho). They're even comfortable to wear around the neck if you need to take them off for whatever reason.

Like I said tho, it varies a lot. Some people in this very thread have returned them because it was just not comfortable enough for them. There's some degree of bend achievable on the steel headband but some people prefer models with more cup swivel or rotation regardless. I didn't really adjust mine at all, but I did notice the pads get more comfortable after a bit... That's something V-moda themselves advertise but I hadn't put much stock in it. The pads warm up and mold to your ear, they retain this a bit after break in.

Sound quality will definitely be compromised to an extent on a plane ride, you can read some of the recent posts above on that subject. To what extent will depend what kinda flight and plane you're on and even where you're seated (wing seats = noisiest, also the safest and most comfortable tho! it's the plane's structural strong point and often an emergency exit).

Even a $20-30 IEM is gonna be more effective at blocking out plane engine noise tho.
post #2423 of 2757
:cool:Should I trade my M-80 for the Momentum? I've been using the M-80 for nearly a year and I love it's sound so much. My friend just bought the Momentum and he doesn't like it so he want to exchange it with my M-80. I listen to all kind of music but most of them are pop and dance to pump up the mood biggrin.gif. Oh and does it worth to exchange my used M80 + 150$ for the brand new Momentum?. Hope u guys can help me biggrin.gif. Thanks you all biggrin.gif
post #2424 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impulse View Post

As far as comfort goes, your best bet would be to find a Radio Shack or Microsoft store to try them in. It just varies a lot from person to person, specially with on-ears.

I have big ears (they're not very sensitive tho), lots of hair, and a medium sized head and I find them comfortable enough to wear for a couple hours at a time even while walking etc. They don't get particularly hot for me, but they'll induce a bit of sweat if you aren't sitting still (the 90%+ humidity here might have something to do with that tho). They're even comfortable to wear around the neck if you need to take them off for whatever reason.

Like I said tho, it varies a lot. Some people in this very thread have returned them because it was just not comfortable enough for them. There's some degree of bend achievable on the steel headband but some people prefer models with more cup swivel or rotation regardless. I didn't really adjust mine at all, but I did notice the pads get more comfortable after a bit... That's something V-moda themselves advertise but I hadn't put much stock in it. The pads warm up and mold to your ear, they retain this a bit after break in.

Sound quality will definitely be compromised to an extent on a plane ride, you can read some of the recent posts above on that subject. To what extent will depend what kinda flight and plane you're on and even where you're seated (wing seats = noisiest, also the safest and most comfortable tho! it's the plane's structural strong point and often an emergency exit).

Even a $20-30 IEM is gonna be more effective at blocking out plane engine noise tho.

Wow, Thanks for the very knowledgeable post! The only authorized reseller of V-Moda products in Vancouver is Headphone Bar so I would need to head out to them to try them out.
As for the sound produced by the M80's, would you describe it as flat(lifeless) or fun and engaging. My preference would be fun and engaging considering I listen to Pop,Rock,HipHop and R&B.
Would you consider the M80's to be a good 1st pair of headphones and a good value for the money?
post #2425 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impulse View Post

The isolation graphs are basically just a plot of how much outside noise is reduced at different frequencies... The FR corresponds to the outside noise and the reduction in decibels of that is what the headphones provide you.

So if you know the frequency range of something in your environment (let's say, voices, 300-3K) then you can look at the graph and it tells you by how many dB that frequency will be reduced. Now decibels are a logarithmic scale so an increase in isolation of 3dB vs 9dB isn't linear (i.e. 9dB isn't 3x more), but you can Google that for a far better explanation than I can provide. tongue.gif

I don't think a bus engine (while you're sitting inside it) goes anywhere near as deep as a plane's engine rumble, which you don't just hear but can plainly feel... Not really sure about subways. Mass transit in Puerto Rico sucks so I drive almost everywhere... frown.gif I think subway carts would be a mix of frequencies no? Buncha parts rattling all over plus the actual grind (screech?) of the rail system itself.

thanks for explaining!! i'm definately gonna look more into it,

 

i'm from toronto and i'm a student soo i commute a lot, also the fact that im up here in toronto prevents me from trying the m-80s out, no where has it!!

 

also i was wondering since u put the m80s around your neck do u notice the the underside of the headband discolouring?? (kinda gross but depending on what colour m-80 u have, i like the white one i have the feeling that having a headphone hang around your neck would cause some sweating) the underside of the white headband has quite a bit of white there to turn yellow >.< wish the underside was all grey so it would look less gross after sweating)

 

anyways i'm probably nitpicking but i'm definately waiting for hte cliqfold hinge m80 or ppl call it here m-85... until then i'm definately gonna save up for a pair... 

post #2426 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by legendcheater View Post

:cool:Should I trade my M-80 for the Momentum? I've been using the M-80 for nearly a year and I love it's sound so much. My friend just bought the Momentum and he doesn't like it so he want to exchange it with my M-80. I listen to all kind of music but most of them are pop and dance to pump up the mood biggrin.gif. Oh and does it worth to exchange my used M80 + 150$ for the brand new Momentum?. Hope u guys can help me biggrin.gif. Thanks you all biggrin.gif

dude, decide for yourself. I don't think asking the forum can really help you with such a case specific question. Listen to them. Do you think they'll be worth it? Well there ya go

post #2427 of 2757
My M-80's underside seems just fine but I haven't even had them for a full year yet, and they're the black/shadow ones. The underside (center) of the band is this sorta neoprene-like fabric tho... I think if anything would stain first it'd be the side edge (that wraps around to the top), it's sort of a smooth suede, assuming the shadow & white ones use the same materials anyway. Maybe someone with the white ones can chime in. The headband's not that large, maybe an inch?

M-80 look deceptively large in pictures, the cups aren't larger than an average ear (my large ears peek out from the top/bottom, just a bit) and the forks are maybe two inches wide at most (going off memory, I can measure them if anyone's really that curious); point is I'm not sure you'll sweat any more because they're hanging from your neck. Now if you're walking a few miles outside in the summer, that's a different story. tongue.gif I was surprised at how small they were when I first saw them, even tho they're on ears so they aren't supposed to be huge.

msavic6, I'd definitely characterize them as fun sounding... Bass is punchy but not overdone, mids are very nice (they actually render some vocals a little sweeter than my Beyers even tho those are clearer sounding overall), highs are a little rolled off but it's not massive and works well with the overall sound (and some of my other headphones are a little bright, hf3/DT880, so I'd be put off if the treble roll off was too exaggerated). They won't satisfy a total basshead but they're still on the warm/fun side of things.

I think they're an excellent value as an overall package, specially for the price they've been going for on Amazon ($150-160); once you factor in the durability, the removable cable(s), the nice case (even tho sometimes I don't even use it when I toss them in my book bag, I still use a pouch tho), the excellent warranty, and even the looks... Makes a very strong case even for MSRP. If they were full size closed cans with the same sound but none of the extra perks I probably wouldn't rate their value quite that high, but for portables they mark a lot of the right boxes.

Too many portables out there are built out of this mix of glossy plastics and the same sorta angular design, dunno, it's starting to get monotonous. I wasn't crazy about the M-80's sorta goth/punk look but it grew on me and they aren't as flashy as they look on pictures (well the black ones aren't...). I like some of Philip's recent designs too, sorta retro but still built very very well. Looks aren't my first or second consideration but c'mon, if you're gonna wear them in public it factors in unless you're a schmuck (says the guy who looks like a hobo at the moment after not shaving for a week or two...).
post #2428 of 2757
Quote:
Originally Posted by Impulse View Post

My M-80's underside seems just fine but I haven't even had them for a full year yet, and they're the black/shadow ones. The underside (center) of the band is this sorta neoprene-like fabric tho... I think if anything would stain first it'd be the side edge (that wraps around to the top), it's sort of a smooth suede, assuming the shadow & white ones use the same materials anyway. Maybe someone with the white ones can chime in. The headband's not that large, maybe an inch?

M-80 look deceptively large in pictures, the cups aren't larger than an average ear (my large ears peek out from the top/bottom, just a bit) and the forks are maybe two inches wide at most (going off memory, I can measure them if anyone's really that curious); point is I'm not sure you'll sweat any more because they're hanging from your neck. Now if you're walking a few miles outside in the summer, that's a different story. tongue.gif I was surprised at how small they were when I first saw them, even tho they're on ears so they aren't supposed to be huge.

msavic6, I'd definitely characterize them as fun sounding... Bass is punchy but not overdone, mids are very nice (they actually render some vocals a little sweeter than my Beyers even tho those are clearer sounding overall), highs are a little rolled off but it's not massive and works well with the overall sound (and some of my other headphones are a little bright, hf3/DT880, so I'd be put off if the treble roll off was too exaggerated). They won't satisfy a total basshead but they're still on the warm/fun side of things.

I think they're an excellent value as an overall package, specially for the price they've been going for on Amazon ($150-160); once you factor in the durability, the removable cable(s), the nice case (even tho sometimes I don't even use it when I toss them in my book bag, I still use a pouch tho), the excellent warranty, and even the looks... Makes a very strong case even for MSRP. If they were full size closed cans with the same sound but none of the extra perks I probably wouldn't rate their value quite that high, but for portables they mark a lot of the right boxes.

Too many portables out there are built out of this mix of glossy plastics and the same sorta angular design, dunno, it's starting to get monotonous. I wasn't crazy about the M-80's sorta goth/punk look but it grew on me and they aren't as flashy as they look on pictures (well the black ones aren't...). I like some of Philip's recent designs too, sorta retro but still built very very well. Looks aren't my first or second consideration but c'mon, if you're gonna wear them in public it factors in unless you're a schmuck (says the guy who looks like a hobo at the moment after not shaving for a week or two...).

thanks for your insight... i don't want them to be big especially when wearing around my neck, i've seen too many people wear headphones around their neck and they can't turn their neck because either 1) their necks are short 2) the headphone cups are far too large 

 

i have about an average length neck and my ears are on the slightly on the smaller to average size

 

i guess i'll have to wait for them to come up to canada or if i go to states anytime soon i will definately try them on to evaluate their comfort level

 

i agree with you too many companies are ripping off the beats look ( but i do admit the swiveling system on it is definately good) and the hinge system too 

 but beats is making a fortune sooo it sells! other companies probably think why not get into it?! companies do need to add some style flair into their headphones, too many of these probably fantastic audiophile headphone are bland and uninteresting.... at least to me... and the typical consumer evaluates based on their first visual impression.. once their attention is capture thennn they'll actually put it on...


Edited by Tom22 - 4/12/13 at 11:37am
post #2429 of 2757
Are there any compatibility issues with the V-Moda M80's and the Galaxy Nexus? I don't want to have to flip the cables around as I actually want to us the one button remote.
post #2430 of 2757
I think one of the two cables included should always work, accounting for the main button & mic even (though volume buttons on the iPhone cable one won't do anything on Android obviously)... That's why they bundle two different cables to begin with. There's basically two types of TRRS jack terminations, the first one was established by Nokia or Sony before the current smartphone era, and then Apple came around and decided to flip the ground and mic contacts around for the iPhone (of course)...

Now the problem is that for a while some Android OEMs used one termination and others used the other... I think they may all be on the same page now but I'm not sure. I know Samsung actually used both depending on the specific model. I think I remember reading the Galaxy Nexus in particular used the opposite termination from the S2, xda's forum is probably a good place to ask or search for an answer. There's always adapters like this one, but I doubt you'll need it.

On my HTC phone both cables actually worked just fine, the black iPhone one (3-button) and the red Android one (1-button); although I might've only tested whether the button paused music and not the mic, so take it FWIW. I traded my iPhone cable (with another Head-Fi'er) for the 1-button orange one that comes with the M-100, so I haven't got it anymore.

I do have a pair of Ety hf3 which are meant for iPhones (and even have the volume buttons) and it also works just fine with my phone, even though Ety sells the 1-button hf5 for Android/others. Not sure if the phones can sense what's plugged in and actually switch mic/ground around or if they're just doing something else for compatibility's sake.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › V-MODA Crossfade M-80 Reviews