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Do you often enjoy listening to new or old music more?

Poll Results: Do you often enjoy listening to new or old music more?

 
  • 28% (7)
    NEW MUSIC - meaning music recently released that you're hearing for the first time.
  • 24% (6)
    OLD MUSIC - meaning music from years/decades centuries past that you're hearing for the first time.
  • 20% (5)
    FAMILIAR MUSIC - meaning new or old music you've already listened to, you're already familiar with, that you're simply revisiting.
  • 28% (7)
    I see no relationship between the above options and the music that I usually enjoy/appreciate.
25 Total Votes  
post #1 of 25
Thread Starter 
So we have three poll options:

1) new music - meaning music recently released that you're hearing for the first time
2) old music - meaning music from years/decades centuries past that you're hearing for the first time
3) familiar music - meaning new or old music you've already listened to, you're already familiar with, and you're simply revisiting

The fourth option I'm leaving for those who see no correlation to the above three options and their musical appreciation.

Personally, I enjoy new music the most... Music that's truly fresh that relatively few people have had a chance to hear, discuss and form an opinion on. Also... I quite like the current state of music compared to music of the past.
post #2 of 25

I'm mostly listening to old music that I'm familiar with as well as music from those eras that I haven't heard before.

 

 

Quote:

 

I quite like the current state of music compared to music of the past.

Please define the past - 5yrs ago, 20yrs ago, 50yrs ago? Today's music will never be as good as the past, but then again I'm old.

post #3 of 25

I am 19 years old, and mostly listen to music from the early to late '90's. Why? Because of the mastering. After having heard properly mastered albums from those years, my definition of music has been redefined, in a way that I can no longer enjoy modern music. Sorry, when you listen to albums with 14 dB of dynamic range and then put on one that has 4, the latter just doesn't really feel like music anymore. Makes me feel like I'm listening to online radio, or a preview, of what the song could have been... had it not been a casualty of the loudness wars.

 

There is the odd gem here and there, like underground artists that didn't make it big and haven't had their albums "professionally" mastered yet... but it's only a matter of time before they too go for that "hot and loud" sound.


Edited by WrxSTI - 10/14/11 at 1:10pm
post #4 of 25

I been trying to hear music that's new to me. The musicians may have been around for a few years but don't seem to be very well known. I check out sites on You Tube to find this type music. I find places like Musicfog is good for Folk, Folk-Rock. I have spent a lot of time with NPR Radio's Tiny Deck Concerts. They cover a broader type of music style. There are other such places that have what is new to me. Music like the"Tiad" site has music from  the Middle East and India.

post #5 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zotjen View Post

I'm mostly listening to old music that I'm familiar with as well as music from those eras that I haven't heard before.

 

 

Please define the past - 5yrs ago, 20yrs ago, 50yrs ago? Today's music will never be as good as the past, but then again I'm old.

In other words, I enjoy the music from this century more than the last century.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WrxSTI View Post

I am 19 years old, and mostly listen to music from the early to late '90's. Why? Because of the mastering. After having heard properly mastered albums from those years, my definition of music has been redefined, in a way that I can no longer enjoy modern music. Sorry, when you listen to albums with 14 dB of dynamic range and then put on one that has 4, the latter just doesn't really feel like music anymore. Makes me feel like I'm listening to online radio, or a preview, of what the song could have been... had it not been a casualty of the loudness wars.

 

There is the odd gem here and there, like underground artists that didn't make it big and haven't had their albums "professionally" mastered yet... but it's only a matter of time before they too go for that "hot and loud" sound.

I think it's mostly a matter of what you listen to. What have you listened to from the last 10 years?
Edited by fuseboxx - 10/14/11 at 7:05pm
post #6 of 25
Well, it was new music when I started listening to it! biggrin.gif
post #7 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuseboxx View Post

I think it's mostly a matter of what you listen to. What have you listened to from the last 10 years?


 

A good variety of genres. I mainly listen to electronica, but it is represented equally there, as well as in rock/metal, rap, even reggae. I think the only genres which have not been wholly affected by it that much yet are jazz and classical.

 

I've seen claims that say certain genres of music need that compression to make the sounds "glued together" and give it continuity - I don't buy it, I heard dubstep with 8-10 dB of headroom and it sounds better than all the Skrillex, Klaypex, and other -ex that you can think of combined. Basically, it sounds more like music. If you play a real instrument, let's say a mouth harmonica and you play the notes with varying strength you notice just how much dynamic range there is. I don't remember anyone ever saying a real instrument wasn't loud enough, and they are generally further away from the listener than speakers are. People seem to have forgotten about the volume knob.

 

The whole trend started around 1996 or so, and after that it's been a downward spiral. It is sad that people have to come back to vinyl to enjoy their music in a decent fashion (as vinyl will not tolerate hyper-compression), because the senseless idiots that are pioneering the music industry still have not come to the realisation that such terrible mastering does not increase sales in any way.

post #8 of 25
Mostly older music, but it has some sort of familiarity. I'm not listening to old folk music or anything like that, but stuff similar to Elvis would please me. smily_headphones1.gif
post #9 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WrxSTI View Post

A good variety of genres. I mainly listen to electronica, but it is represented equally there, as well as in rock/metal, rap, even reggae. I think the only genres which have not been wholly affected by it that much yet are jazz and classical.
I was hoping for a decent number of artists/albums just so I could see if I also consider those to have mastering problems.

What about Radiohead's Kid A? Madvillain's Madvillainy? Arcade Fire's Funeral?

I think this track from Godspeed You! Black Emperor doesn't have that problem with dynamic range that you were mentioning:

post #10 of 25

Some albums take some time to appreciate so I said familiar music. Some old albums I've listened to a few dozen too many times. 

post #11 of 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuseboxx View Post


I was hoping for a decent number of artists/albums just so I could see if I also consider those to have mastering problems.
What about Radiohead's Kid A? Madvillain's Madvillainy? Arcade Fire's Funeral?
I think this track from Godspeed You! Black Emperor doesn't have that problem with dynamic range that you were mentioning:


The track you listed comes up with a DR of 7. That's certainly not bad by today's standards, but the recommendation by conscious recording engineers was at least 8 dB, and preferably more than 10.

 

Sadly, very few pieces today even have 7. Unfortunately I haven't heard the albums you mention, I spend most of my time exploring underground and relatively unknown music, but, I can give you two albums which have very bad mastering:

 

Hadouken - For the Masses (2010) - They push the envelope here with tracks in the range of 2 dB DR, this whole thing sounds atrocious, particularly good example is on the track Bombshock, which starts with a good build-up intro and then when you expect a massive kick you just get this splotch of sound that is the same volume as everything else because there is just no more headroom for the drop to be louder than the rest of the intro. Like trying to jump while crouching in a duct.

 

Eluveitie - Slania (2008) - probably no worse than most other recent metal albums but for something that contains folk instruments it is an absolute mistake to bury them under the guitar and drums in songs with no more than 3 dB of DR. Noise, not music.

 

There are plenty more, but those artists are not that popular so I didn't bother to list them. All in all, most of the modern releases sit in between 4-6 dB of DR which just, to put it simply, isn't enough. Shameful waste of today's technology and recording abilities. There are few modern artists who use high-tech digital equipment to it's full potential, but here are a few just to show you how it sounds when it's done properly (although YouTube's compression will take some of the DR out of there as well):

 

Area 51 - Into Oblivion (2004) - DR 13

Manifold - Find your Pokemon (2005) - DR 10

Distance - Skeleton Grin (2008) - DR 10 - Great example here, listen to the difference in volume between the first few claps and the one at 0:13. If this was DR 3, all of those would probably sound equally loud, and the whole impact of that clap would have been lost.

Suidakra - Ramble (2006) - DR 11 - This acoustic track is left intact, while the rest of the album is pretty smashed. A shame.

Pete Rock - What You Waiting For (2001) - DR 10 - I didn't even like hip-hop that much, until I heard these instrumentals...

 

I wish I had more examples, but it is what it is. Not many modern albums deliver in this aspect. If you're using foobar2k, you can get this component that can measure the DR of your music.

post #12 of 25

IMO; 50s, 60s & 70s were the best times for music overall.

post #13 of 25
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WrxSTI View Post

If you're using foobar2k, you can get this component that can measure the DR of your music.
Ah nice, this is what I was looking for. I was wondering the whole time what you were using to measure DR. I checked those albums that I mentinoned earlier:

Radiohead - Kid A (2000)
Official DR value: DR8
Genre: Rock

Madvillain - Madvillainy (2004)
Official DR value: DR7
Genre: Hip Hop

Arcade Fire - Funeral (2004)
Official DR value: DR8
Genre: Rock


And some other albums from this decade, which seem to have a good dynamic range:

Wilco - Yankee Hotel Foxtrot (2002)
Official DR value: DR10
Genre: Alt-Country

Joanna Newsom - Ys (2006)
Official DR value: DR11
Genre: Folk

Sigur Rós - ( ) (2002)
Official DR value: DR9
Genre: Post-Rock

I checked the Eluveitie album you mentioned though... I don't think I'm getting the same reading as you're getting. It's relatively bad, but not as bad as you were describing:

Analyzed: Eluveitie / Slania

DR Peak RMS Duration Track
DR6 -10.15 dB -17.66 dB 1:49 01-Samon
DR5 -9.49 dB -15.73 dB 4:19 02-Primordial Breath
DR6 -9.50 dB -16.43 dB 4:09 03-Inis Mona
DR5 -9.66 dB -15.88 dB 4:21 04-Gray Sublime Archon
DR8 -7.61 dB -17.03 dB 3:26 05-Anagantios
DR5 -9.70 dB -15.98 dB 3:21 06-Bloodstained Ground
DR5 -9.43 dB -15.80 dB 4:01 07-The Somber Lay
DR6 -9.87 dB -16.85 dB 5:41 08-Slanias Song
DR9 -6.19 dB -16.42 dB 1:23 09-Giamonios
DR5 -10.99 dB -16.76 dB 4:39 10-Tarvos
DR5 -9.40 dB -16.23 dB 5:06 11-Calling the Rain
DR6 -9.51 dB -17.78 dB 6:32 12-Elembivos

Number of tracks: 12
Official DR value: DR6

And then I checked one of the most maligned albums I know in terms of mastering - Metallica's Death Magnetic - and this is what I got, a bit worse than Slania:

Analyzed: Metallica / Death Magnetic

DR Peak RMS Duration Track
DR5 -10.66 dB -17.63 dB 7:09 01-That Was Just Your Life
DR6 -10.64 dB -17.42 dB 7:53 02-The End of the Line
DR5 -11.96 dB -17.92 dB 6:26 03-Broken, Beat & Scarred
DR4 -11.78 dB -17.56 dB 7:56 04-The Day That Never Comes
DR5 -11.93 dB -17.79 dB 7:58 05-All Nightmare Long
DR5 -11.95 dB -17.72 dB 6:40 06-Cyanide
DR5 -10.90 dB -18.44 dB 7:47 07-The Unforgiven III
DR5 -11.87 dB -17.59 dB 8:01 08-The Judas Kiss
DR5 -12.12 dB -18.78 dB 9:58 09-Suicide & Redemption
DR5 -11.99 dB -17.34 dB 5:01 10-My Apocalypse

Number of tracks: 10
Official DR value: DR5

So... then I checked some albums from Dave Matthews Band since I've always liked how their albums were mastered:

Dave Matthews Band - Under the Table and Dreaming
Official DR value: DR11

Dave Matthews Band - Crash
Official DR value: DR10

Dave Matthews Band - Before These Crowded Streets
Official DR value: DR10

Nice.

So finally.... I tried Miles Davis' Kind of Blue that I figured would have great dynamic range:

Analyzed: Miles Davis / Kind of Blue

DR Peak RMS Duration Track
DR13 -4.47 dB -22.71 dB 9:25 01-So What
DR13 -4.59 dB -22.12 dB 9:49 02-Freddie Freeloader
DR13 0.00 dB -18.60 dB 5:38 03-Blue in Green
DR14 -3.52 dB -22.29 dB 11:36 04-All Blues
DR15 -2.68 dB -23.39 dB 9:26 05-Flamenco Sketches
DR14 -3.70 dB -23.17 dB 9:32 06-Flamenco Sketches (alternate take)

Number of tracks: 6
Official DR value: DR14

And it did.
post #14 of 25

The albums that differ could be a different pressing.

 

I've always subconsciously listened to more dynamic songs more often, way before I knew what DR was. I lost count how many times I replayed Skytech's "Floating Clouds" in the past 3 years, and when I analyzed it a few months ago it came up as DR10, which is a lot more than most trance tracks get these days.

post #15 of 25

Usually new music, also, The Visitor by Jim 'o Rourke is mastered really well as far as I can remember. I'll check it tonight with that foobar plugin.

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