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Source for ATH-W2002! (if you are interested) - Page 2

post #16 of 55
This thread has been a delight to read.

It had to be said

I was losing faith in Head-fi after so many immature posts these past few days, thanks guys.
post #17 of 55
I second that emotion.
post #18 of 55
Yes, I must say, you guys are excellent writers, which is so rare to see on the internet! Maybe there's still hope for the English language...?
post #19 of 55

For those who are interested to order from Singapore, I thought you might be interested to know that the cans cost S$990.

I just got back from there. Cheers.
post #20 of 55
By the way, Tomcat, your avatar is pretty doggone funny! Is that Arnold?
post #21 of 55
post #22 of 55
Those old ladies don't look too impressed! Maybe because that's how their arms looked after churning the butter.
post #23 of 55
This thread was perfect until we started to deviate towards Arnolds guns.

Concentrate people and lets get back on track!

OK, back to the work of art called the W2002.
post #24 of 55
I got 3 words for you :

Attention Deficit Disorder
post #25 of 55
Hmm how much is that in USD?

I can get them W2002s here in HK for ~USD$650, would that be cheaper than the Singapore deal? (edit: erm, probably not )

I'll buy one or two for you guys if you want

Condition is I get to break in and listen to one of them
post #26 of 55
Hi, I actually saw the same cans in Mong Kok going for 4880 HK (which is about $1157) few days before I got to Singapore. Price not negotiable!!

The price that I saw was much higher compared to Singapore. If you can get it for anything less than $990 (US$534), do let me know where. Thanks in advance.

post #27 of 55
Thread Starter 
I'd like to get a copy of this Japanese audio magazine too while you're at it, its the January 2002 issue:

I did an experiment with the W2002's yesterday using a device from Hughes Aircraft Co. (!), its a pretty scientific piece of audio gear that boosts and inserts the stereo difference signal into what you hear. Its adjustable too. The difference signal is whats left when you subtract L from R during playback, and it contains most of the room and/or ambience information in stereo recordings. Hughes developed it and marketed this unit, but Hughes Aircraft being Hughes Aircraft, it didnt exactly catch on with the audio world. Sony saw the potential in it and apparently they license some part of the technology from Hughes. The idea of using the difference signal isnt new.. I think I read there was a small 3 channel stereo movement at one time (long ago) which obviously didnt go anywhere. Theres also a passive way to extract the difference signal in your home system that David Hafler suggested in the 70's, and it works too (I'll post a pic if someones interested.) Where was I. Oh yeah,

Adding the stereo difference signal to headphone listening adds a tremendous sense of spaciousness and air, and through the W2002's it was initially very fun to listen to. After plowing through several CD's and bypassing the unit to compare to the original stereo though, I came to favor the original much more. Headphone listening, for all its limitations, already gives you a deep impression of ambience. What limits headphone ambience is not the quantity, its that the sound is contained inside your head. David Haflers idea of using the difference signal in a home system is for the 3rd speaker (the one containing the difference signal) to be placed behind the listening position. With a headphone there is obviously is no 3rd speaker, and so you get an amalgam of information too big for its britches.
The original stereo signal sounds powerfully focused and grounded by comparison. Its too bad.. the Hughes unit is very well made and is a precise instrument; its not a piece of audio garbage they cooked up because they needed cash. I think it was an offshoot of their aviation research as a matter of fact.
Oh well. It actually sounds really good in my floor system! But my Sony AV receiver already has a bunch of sound fields and I think one or two of them already use difference signal information by the sound of them.
I'm still very interested in sound processing for headphones, but the difference signal seems best left to floor systems.
post #28 of 55
M Real, are you talking about the old BBE processor from Hughes?
Sony now uses the technology in some of their TV sets.
I was never really impressed with it and for speakers the effect only worked at the sweet spot.

Hafler's idea was the beginings of dolby surround.
post #29 of 55
Thread Starter 
Originally posted by bootman
M Real, are you talking about the old BBE processor from Hughes? Hafler's idea was the beginings of dolby surround.
This was was called 'SRS AK-100', standing for Sound Retrieval System. They make a point of saying its not a crossfeed device, not a reverb generator, no delay.. it just reintroduces a boosted difference signal, thats all. And the difference signal contains mostly ambience and room sound information (depending on the type of recording and music.) Whether or not added ambience is a good thing? I dunno, but it doesnt improve headphones to a new and more binaural level. Its better suited to floor speakers. The ak-100 doesnt process the sound as much as extract certain things and amplify them.
post #30 of 55
I wonder how the processing would sound through an amp with crossfeed?
Will you get too much of the crossfeed effect or will it lock the image in the center of your head? Do you have an amp with crossfeed to try?
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