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The Audeze LCD-2 Ortho thread (New) - Page 354

post #5296 of 7128

how good is the objective 2 with the hd 700?

post #5297 of 7128

just saw 5 years warranty on the mini-x a-100 and i kinda jizzed a little lol, ill research it a little more

post #5298 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefQon View Post

Funny thing is that you're the first to object what I've said so far, I've mentioned about it the past only with other user's experience mirroring mine and the fact that some percentage of the large amount of LCD2's that pop in the F/S section are users disliking the laid back sound of the LCD2's, some calling it dark, warm whatever, you can say that it doesn't suit there sound pref's.

 

This comes back to what I also should've mentioned, pairing the LCD2's with a warm sounding source/amp/dac is the last thing I would personally do which. I've played around with enough LCD2's to know that this congestion is not just with my own pair only, to a few other people that I have met IRL here that own the LCD2's they did not know or couldn't quite put it down for sure what was wrong with the smearing going on till I pointed out a few cues for them listen to carefully that there is a congestion going on. An airy sounding headphone would be something like a stat, SA3/5k's, HD800 or the K/Q701/2's, wide soundstage, good imaging, bright sounding at times, cold or brittle to some. These characteristics are not that of the LCD2's.

 

I would agree this. My ears can't handle treble with too much sparkle, or headphones that have high peaks. I get ear fatigue really easily. The HD-800 and the HD-700 massacred me. To the point that I had headaches for almost a week. Similarly, the Grado's also did a number on my ears. I even had an issue with the AKG-702s.


I think that's why I've finally settled on the HD-650/600 and LCD-2. The darker/warmer sound signature of these cans make it more tolerable. I agree that the LCD-2 have a very musical sound signature where everything blends together and sounds really smooth. But if you want absolute detail retrieval and clarity, then these would have a "smear"/single sound to them. I guess I just see the other side of that (because I love their sound signature). So I don't really see it as a smear, but a very musical/smooth sound (as I said above). 

 

If my ears actually weren't so sensitive, I would still love the LCD-2s, and would keep them just to have as a specific sound signature to pull out for certain music.

EDIT: I clearly don't know what you two are talking about. Ignore my post. LMAO


Edited by satanigatan - 6/29/13 at 11:28pm
post #5299 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Compared to what Zoom? The O2 is comparable to a lot of different amps, so it would be helpful to state why the O2 is so terrible.

I think the O2 would be fine, not the best, but you could do a whole lot worse. A better pairing would be the Lyr (which almost always involves tube rolling),
in which case costs more money. 

If OP TealRice set a budget perhaps we could better recommend a pairing for him.

I've mentioned this a couple of times on this forum before. I think it was probably some other threads. I'll keep it short.

O2 with LCD-2 was similar in performance to Fiio E10 and Fiio E11. They all had thin mids and were lacking in bass extension and bass impact. I simply wasn't enjoying the combination with those three at all. O2 had better transparency over the two Fiio though. HE-500 on the other hand did okay with other amps mentioned so far. Regardless of a reference point from equipment, the O2 + LCD-2 was far from engaging to me. It sounded quite lifeless to me.

Now hook up the LCD-2 to speaker amps and it finally became enjoyable for me. I have tried it with Emotiva mini X a 100 as well as a few Marantz integrated amps (the modern lineup, and not their vintage amps as of now). They totally blew away O2 with LCD-2. It was a night and a day difference, easily. With HE-500 as well, the speaker amps also brought up the performance quite nicely. Although with O2 it was at least tolerable.

I'd basically have to agree with Mike on this one after several months of using each piece: http://www.headfonia.com/nwavguys-objective-2-by-jdslabs-and-epiphany-acoustics/

"Its bigger brother, the HE-500 I also appreciated with the O2, but not on the same level as the HE-400. In the beginning my ears had to adjust a little to the O2 mids and bass, as explained before, but once I got used to it I quite enjoyed the HE-500 with the O2. I won’t call it my favorite amp with these headphones, but the O2 made it sound pretty good"


^ Roughly the same experience. I'd say it was okay/good at best instead of pretty good. I listen to primarily electronic music so bass was the biggest disappointment with O2. Although O2 + D2000 is excellent.

Here's what he has to say about the Audeze pairing: 

"A lot of people on the web swear with the O2 and Audez’e LCD-2 combination (I never heard NwAvGuy to make such claims) but I can’t find myself in that. The O2, who supposedly can take on amps 3 to 4 times its price, can hardly get out of the LCD-2 what I can with my other amps like the Violectric. Bass depth and rumble is mediocre and where did those gorgeous mids of the LCD-2 go to? In my opinion it would be a shame to use the O2 with such an excellent headphone. Probably a lot of others will enjoy this combination as it is very neutral and detailed but that’s not enough to make me enjoy the LCD-2."


I strongly agree with this. It was simply not enjoyable.

EDIT: http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/amplifiers/products/a100

Emotiva is on sale for $189 currently. It's around the same price as O2. There's also a huge thread on Emotiva mini here at head-fi. Myself and others have done this comparison many time and the overall consensus is to get the Emotiva over O2, by a large margin...just in case TealRice wants to save time.

It'll double as a great speaker amp as well from experience

Also haven't tried the LCD-3 yet with O2. Too lazy as Emotiva is doing quite well.


Hey zoom, I have never hooked headphones up to my LCD 2s yet, how is it done - adaptor or custom wire? How do you know if it might damage the headphones? I have a 150 watt rotel receiver and a 500 watt dedicated amp not being utilized - would these work? Can you point me in the right direction?
post #5300 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefQon View Post

Funny thing is that you're the first to object what I've said so far, I've mentioned about it the past only with other user's experience mirroring mine and the fact that some percentage of the large amount of LCD2's that pop in the F/S section are users disliking the laid back sound of the LCD2's, some calling it dark, warm whatever, you can say that it doesn't suit there sound pref's.

 

This comes back to what I also should've mentioned, pairing the LCD2's with a warm sounding source/amp/dac is the last thing I would personally do which. I've played around with enough LCD2's to know that this congestion is not just with my own pair only, to a few other people that I have met IRL here that own the LCD2's they did not know or couldn't quite put it down for sure what was wrong with the smearing going on till I pointed out a few cues for them listen to carefully that there is a congestion going on. An airy sounding headphone would be something like a stat, SA3/5k's, HD800 or the K/Q701/2's, wide soundstage, good imaging, bright sounding at times, cold or brittle to some. These characteristics are not that of the LCD2's.

 

I'll give you the HD800, never heard the Sony's.  But when you mention K701 in the same breadth, this reveals your "smear" definition is frequency response related and not resolution related.  To my ears, the HD800 trebles is beatifully trace smeared in transients - not unlike an OTL tube amp, very smooth.  But bright.  The LCD2 is not smeared, anywhere.

post #5301 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barra View Post


Hey zoom, I have never hooked headphones up to my LCD 2s yet, how is it done - adaptor or custom wire? How do you know if it might damage the headphones? I have a 150 watt rotel receiver and a 500 watt dedicated amp not being utilized - would these work? Can you point me in the right direction?

 

Me neither. tongue.gif

 

If you go to the Emotiva thread here on head-fi, there is a lot of information on all types of cable arrangement. A lot of people use 1/4'' instead of XLR. This is fine with Emotiva, however with balanced outputs, 1/4" fails, so I recommend going the XLR route, just to ensure it will work in future with balanced as well as unbalanced shared ground amps.

 

I'm guessing your amps are rated that at 8 ohms. At around 40-50 ohms, where the LCD-2/3 falls, that's still a lot of power. 150 and 500 Watt is too much to use directly without a resistor. I use Emotiva mini x a 100 without a resistor - 50 Watts @ 8ohms. It's safe and I get a little bit of volume play. Regarding safety, always have the amp turned down to the minimum. Then slowly increase the volume to your desired level. Be very careful until you have gotten a good handle on it.

 

My setup from Emotiva to LCD-3 looks like:

 

1) Emotiva adapter: banana plugs to 4 pin XLR female balanced cable (I leave this plugged in all the time in Emotiva)

2) Audeze 4 pin balanced XLR male cable (I plug this into Emotiva)

3) Female 4 pin XLR to 3.5 mm (I can leave the balanced cable on permanently. Even when I have to use it with single ended amps, I simply attach this adapter to the balanced cable. On top of that, I can add a 1/4" screw on adapter)

 

With this adapter set, I can use it with pretty much any configuration out there. Minus electrostats and vintage amps with pins (as they didn't have banana plugs back then)

 

Again check out Emotiva thread here, lots of good info: http://www.head-fi.org/t/629352/he-500-lcd2-d5000-dt770-sr80-on-a-speaker-amp-emotiva-mini-x-a-100-project

post #5302 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by SP Wild View Post

 

I'll give you the HD800, never heard the Sony's.  But when you mention K701 in the same breadth, this reveals your "smear" definition is frequency response related and not resolution related.  To my ears, the HD800 trebles is beatifully trace smeared in transients - not unlike an OTL tube amp, very smooth.  But bright.  The LCD2 is not smeared, anywhere.

As much as I dislike the AKG K/Q70X headphones I only mentioned it as an example to the airy sounding sig headphones that I also mentioned. I did not say anything about them being in the same league, detail retrieval or clarity of the other headphones so please don't get confused between the differences as such. I see congestion happening as the following possibilities:

 

1. Underpowered or incorrectly powered. Yes you might know about synergy with amp's and certain flagship headphones but this principle pretty much applies to any and every headphone. You pair a very coloured/warm sounding WA6 or WA3 with an already warm/laid back sounding HD650 you're not doing your ears and the headphones a favour. By balancing the flaws of the headphones and amps, pair only opposite to each other. Trust me it helps and brings good musical bliss.

2. The LCD2's are extremely dampened (drivers) not the back opening. How do I know this? Because the LCD2's are not very responsive to EQ as much as any of the other headphones on the market. 

3. The bass. Although very nicely articulated and goes down very low, it is a wall of bass. There are mods to reduce the bass without taking away detail and other sound extraction but it is a matter of trial and error and a massive PITA process as no - one's ears/preferences are tuned/equal to the same.

4. Not relating to FR graphs/plots, it could be just the Audeze house signature. Hard to be concrete on this one because I haven't exactly had every LCD2 rev.2 I've played around with, along with the LCD3 I've heard and my own LCD2 rev.1's on a table all the same time.

5. Preference. Again these are my findings based on the experience I've had. Other's have mirrored my findings with you being the first to object it, not that there is anything wrong, preference, gear and ear's have a major role in this too. Also depends on the music/source too.

 

I don't understand what you mean by HD800 trebles is beautifully smeared in transients. Transients is referred to the speed of how sound aspects is articulated, I've owned 3 HD800's all different S/N's and I found none of them having smeared treble ranges at all. Bright and peaky treble? Yes, but this is your amp to blame and with mods such as the Anax mod, it helps reduce that 6k peak further.


Edited by DefQon - 6/30/13 at 12:51am
post #5303 of 7128

Has anyone changed the earpads on the LCD2s? 

 

Are they hard to change out?

post #5304 of 7128

No just rip them off carefully and use accordingly to the supplied rings and 3M adhesive and make sure you align the earpad position correctly how it fits on your ears.

post #5305 of 7128

Yeah, mine was always uneven left to right that led to a slight off centre if I focused hard enough.  I guess I could always use a balance control to adjust seeing as I've had great success with EQ and every heaphone I've ever had.

post #5306 of 7128

Yeah I have to admit it is sort of PITA to get it aligned right again, the first time I replaced the ones on mine I had the fatter end on the opposite end on my LCD2's so it looked quite funny lol.

post #5307 of 7128

Ok sounds good.  You reckon I should go ahead and order the LCD3 pads or LCD2 pads?  I still got the very first batch LCD2s with foam headband and all.  Any ideas which pads offer...perhaps a slight leaning of the sound?

post #5308 of 7128

LCD3 pads no questions asked if you have the rev.1's. Sphinxc did a comparison many moons ago when he had the LCD2's and he did report that the later batch rev.1's + LCD3 pads is closer to the sound of the original LCD3's than the rev.2's of the time. Back then when Audeze did not sell the 3 pads to 2 owners. 

post #5309 of 7128

Hi, I have a Marantz PM8003 70 wpc RMS and I'm considering ordering the speaker tap adapter from Q to use with LCD2 and HE500. In your opinion is it worth the cost of the adapter?

post #5310 of 7128

You can make one yourself for less than $20 worth of parts. But it doesn't hurt to buy it from a reputable cable co such as Q.

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