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The Audeze LCD-2 Ortho thread (New) - Page 353

post #5281 of 7128

Just get a Mojo and bam done.

post #5282 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Compared to what Zoom? The O2 is comparable to a lot of different amps, so it would be helpful to state why the O2 is so terrible.
Under 500? I said the objective 2 cuz it was really cheap and I've read good things about it

I think the O2 would be fine, not the best, but you could do a whole lot worse. A better pairing would be the Lyr (which almost always involves tube rolling),
in which case costs more money. 

If OP TealRice set a budget perhaps we could better recommend a pairing for him.
post #5283 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxper View Post

Compared to what Zoom? The O2 is comparable to a lot of different amps, so it would be helpful to state why the O2 is so terrible.

 

I think the O2 would be fine, not the best, but you could do a whole lot worse. A better pairing would be the Lyr (which almost always involves tube rolling),

in which case costs more money. 

 

If OP TealRice set a budget perhaps we could better recommend a pairing for him.

 

I've mentioned this a couple of times on this forum before. I think it was probably some other threads. I'll keep it short.

 

O2 with LCD-2 was similar in performance to Fiio E10 and Fiio E11. They all had thin mids and were lacking in bass extension and bass impact. I simply wasn't enjoying the combination with those three at all. O2 had better transparency over the two Fiio though. HE-500 on the other hand did okay with other amps mentioned so far. Regardless of a reference point from equipment, the O2 + LCD-2 was far from engaging to me. It sounded quite lifeless to me.

 

Now hook up the LCD-2 to speaker amps and it finally became enjoyable for me. I have tried it with Emotiva mini X a 100 as well as a few Marantz integrated amps (the modern lineup, and not their vintage amps as of now). They totally blew away O2 with LCD-2. It was a night and a day difference, easily. With HE-500 as well, the speaker amps also brought up the performance quite nicely. Although with O2 it was at least tolerable.

 

I'd basically have to agree with Mike on this one after several months of using each piece: http://www.headfonia.com/nwavguys-objective-2-by-jdslabs-and-epiphany-acoustics/

 

"Its bigger brother, the HE-500 I also appreciated with the O2, but not on the same level as the HE-400. In the beginning my ears had to adjust a little to the O2 mids and bass, as explained before, but once I got used to it I quite enjoyed the HE-500 with the O2. I won’t call it my favorite amp with these headphones, but the O2 made it sound pretty good"

 

^ Roughly the same experience. I'd say it was okay/good at best instead of pretty good. I listen to primarily electronic music so bass was the biggest disappointment with O2. Although O2 + D2000 is excellent.

 

Here's what he has to say about the Audeze pairing: 

 

"A lot of people on the web swear with the O2 and Audez’e LCD-2 combination (I never heard NwAvGuy to make such claims) but I can’t find myself in that. The O2, who supposedly can take on amps 3 to 4 times its price, can hardly get out of the LCD-2 what I can with my other amps like the Violectric. Bass depth and rumble is mediocre and where did those gorgeous mids of the LCD-2 go to? In my opinion it would be a shame to use the O2 with such an excellent headphone. Probably a lot of others will enjoy this combination as it is very neutral and detailed but that’s not enough to make me enjoy the LCD-2."

 

I strongly agree with this. It was simply not enjoyable.

 

EDIT: http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/amplifiers/products/a100

 

Emotiva is on sale for $189 currently. It's around the same price as O2. There's also a huge thread on Emotiva mini here at head-fi. Myself and others have done this comparison many time and the overall consensus is to get the Emotiva over O2, by a large margin...just in case TealRice wants to save time.

 

It'll double as a great speaker amp as well from experience

 

Also haven't tried the LCD-3 yet with O2. Too lazy as Emotiva is doing quite well.


Edited by Zoom25 - 6/29/13 at 5:31pm
post #5284 of 7128

Did I just see O2 and LCD2 in the same sentence?

post #5285 of 7128
Quote:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post
 

 

I've mentioned this a couple of times on this forum before. I think it was probably some other threads. I'll keep it short.

 

O2 with LCD-2 was similar in performance to Fiio E10 and Fiio E11. They all had thin mids and were lacking in bass extension and bass impact. I simply wasn't enjoying the combination with those three at all. O2 had better transparency over the two Fiio though. HE-500 on the other hand did okay with other amps mentioned so far. Regardless of a reference point from equipment, the O2 + LCD-2 was far from engaging to me. It sounded quite lifeless to me.

 

Now hook up the LCD-2 to speaker amps and it finally became enjoyable for me. I have tried it with Emotiva mini X a 100 as well as a few Marantz integrated amps (the modern lineup, and not their vintage amps as of now). They totally blew away O2 with LCD-2. It was a night and a day difference, easily. With HE-500 as well, the speaker amps also brought up the performance quite nicely. Although with O2 it was at least tolerable.

 

I'd basically have to agree with Mike on this one after several months of using each piece: http://www.headfonia.com/nwavguys-objective-2-by-jdslabs-and-epiphany-acoustics/

 

"Its bigger brother, the HE-500 I also appreciated with the O2, but not on the same level as the HE-400. In the beginning my ears had to adjust a little to the O2 mids and bass, as explained before, but once I got used to it I quite enjoyed the HE-500 with the O2. I won’t call it my favorite amp with these headphones, but the O2 made it sound pretty good"

 

^ Roughly the same experience. I'd say it was okay/good at best instead of pretty good. I listen to primarily electronic music so bass was the biggest disappointment with O2. Although O2 + D2000 is excellent.

 

Here's what he has to say about the Audeze pairing: 

 

"A lot of people on the web swear with the O2 and Audez’e LCD-2 combination (I never heard NwAvGuy to make such claims) but I can’t find myself in that. The O2, who supposedly can take on amps 3 to 4 times its price, can hardly get out of the LCD-2 what I can with my other amps like the Violectric. Bass depth and rumble is mediocre and where did those gorgeous mids of the LCD-2 go to? In my opinion it would be a shame to use the O2 with such an excellent headphone. Probably a lot of others will enjoy this combination as it is very neutral and detailed but that’s not enough to make me enjoy the LCD-2."

 

I strongly agree with this. It was simply not enjoyable.

 

EDIT: http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/amplifiers/products/a100

 

Emotiva is on sale for $189 currently. It's around the same price as O2. There's also a huge thread on Emotiva mini here at head-fi. Myself and others have done this comparison many time and the overall consensus is to get the Emotiva over O2, by a large margin...just in case TealRice wants to save time.

 

It'll double as a great speaker amp as well from experience

 

Also haven't tried the LCD-3 yet with O2. Too lazy as Emotiva is doing quite well.

 

 

I can understand that. Just wanted to know if you were preferring x$500-1k amp over an O2 comparatively, for example.

post #5286 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefQon View Post

Personally I did not find much difference between the LCD3 and my LCD2's. Although I own a pair of modded rev.1's which sound most closely to the sound of the LCD3 but improved only in a few areas not all as some people here are claiming to be such a big difference too be. 

There is still 3 area's that LCD3's still don't do right, lack of treble extension and problems with the upper mids, there is this congestion that is still there even with the LCD2's, this can lead to poor instrumentation on complex tracks. Soundstage, if the LCD2's rev.2 is a 7/10 for soundstage, the LCD3's is a 7.4-7.5 only due to the slight sense of clarity to to most of the sound spectrum. This is all from the latest batch of LCD3's, from what I've read the first batch was pretty bad, sound and QC wise.

I'm still going to stick by what I said as my amp recommendation for the LCD2's, Audeze headphones + tubes = does not sound right, so best to stick with a good solid state from my personal experience. The best ortho is still the HE-6 or the HE-5 for me or a modded pair of rev.1's. The rev.2's can also sound good with the mods I applied to my rev.1's but imvho it takes too much away.

Hi, I have seen the descriptions "congested" and "complex music" used here on Head-Fi.

what do they mean - what is it an example of music which would bring out those characteristics?

Thank you!
post #5287 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by solserenade View Post




Hi, I have seen the descriptions "congested" and "complex music" used here on Head-Fi.

what do they mean - what is it an example of music which would bring out those characteristics?

Thank you!

A good clean sounding headphone can reproduce notes and parts of the music with great separation and imaging. Sometimes the LCD2's sound very smeared with the mid's and treble range when listening to fast and multi-layered mixed EDM or classical music when a lot of things happening at the same time. An example of how to tell when this is happening is when you notice a bleed into the upper or lower registers of the mids, there is this fuzzy or confused like sound to it. This is just a flaw of the "not so much" airy sound signature from the LCD2's. It is also present on the LCD3's but not as much as a stock LCD2's. Modding can fix this issue a slight bit but it is still there due to how these planars are engineered and made.

 

Which is why I recommend strongly pairing the LCD2's and 3's with an amp that is capable of delivering clean neutral or bright sounding power to balance the flaws.


Edited by DefQon - 6/29/13 at 6:23pm
post #5288 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by DefQon View Post

A good clean sounding headphone can reproduce notes and parts of the music with great separation and imaging. Sometimes the LCD2's sound very smeared with the mid's and treble range when listening to fast and multi-layered mixed EDM or classical music when a lot of things happening at the same time. This is just a flaw of the "not so much" airy sound signature from the LCD2's. It is also present on the LCD3's but not as much as a stock LCD2's. Modding can fix this issue a slight bit but it is still there due to how these planars are engineered and made.

*Gasp's the Abyss!

post #5289 of 7128

Stop talking nonsense. The O2 is the greatest amp that has ever been built by humankind. It can drive all headphones to 180% potential and more. Maybe even 200%. The genius who designed this amp doesn't have a single engineering degree or any experience working in the audio industry or designing amps BUT he was put on this earth by God All Mighty to build the greatest amp mankind has ever known and will ever know. The heroic genius was banned from Head-Fi because he spoke the truth about the awesomeness of his amp and about how bad all other amps are compared to his masterpiece. If you doubt my words, go to his Holy Blog. It is the very word of the audio gods and the science and numbers is beyond what normal scientists and engineers know or can ever conceive in their little minds and their useless degrees from top universities. Prove to me that the O2 is not the best amp in the world or shut-up, for I have read the blog and I have memorized all the numbers. I'm not afraid of being banned for speaking the truth.


Edited by M-13 - 6/29/13 at 7:56pm
post #5290 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by M-13 View Post

Stop talking nonsense. The O2 is the greatest amp that has ever been built by humankind. It can drive all headphones to 180% potential and more. Maybe even 200%. The genius who designed this amp doesn't have a single engineering degree or any experience working in the audio industry or designing amps BUT he was put on this earth by God All Mighty to build the greatest amp mankind has ever known and will ever know. The heroic genius was banned from Head-Fi because he spoke the truth about the awesomeness of his amp and about how bad all other amps are compared to his masterpiece. If you doubt my words, go to his Holy Blog. It is the very word of the audio gods and the science and numbers is beyond what normal scientists and engineers know or can ever conceive in their little minds and their useless degrees from top universities. Prove to me that the O2 is not the best amp in the world or shut-up, for I have read the blog and I have memorized all the numbers. I'm not afraid of being banned for speaking the truth.

^ This!

post #5291 of 7128

LOL!

post #5292 of 7128

The devils advocate suggest that there are a few amongst us that hears not what you describe, and is capable of discerning "air" from the "not so much" airy "flaw" of the LCD2s.  Perhaps these people just do not need more treble to be able to achieve what commoners (as indeed we seem to be a minority) aspire to from the majority of headphones. 

 

For these people, the only open headphone was the HD650.  Now we also have Audeze. 

 

They also sound gorgeous out my tube amps thank goodness.  Layering of busy sections of music seem to be a strength compared to my HD650s.  These headphones have sounded mostly very clear to me.

 

I have no doubt in my mind that many recordings that sound to dull seem to be those aspiring to audiophiles and their "audiophile reference" as opposed to "studio reference". 

 

Audiophilia's endless chase for details give a clue to the catch 22.

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DefQon View Post

A good clean sounding headphone can reproduce notes and parts of the music with great separation and imaging. Sometimes the LCD2's sound very smeared with the mid's and treble range when listening to fast and multi-layered mixed EDM or classical music when a lot of things happening at the same time. An example of how to tell when this is happening is when you notice a bleed into the upper or lower registers of the mids, there is this fuzzy or confused like sound to it. This is just a flaw of the "not so much" airy sound signature from the LCD2's. It is also present on the LCD3's but not as much as a stock LCD2's. Modding can fix this issue a slight bit but it is still there due to how these planars are engineered and made.

 

Which is why I recommend strongly pairing the LCD2's and 3's with an amp that is capable of delivering clean neutral or bright sounding power to balance the flaws.

post #5293 of 7128

so is the O2 good or are ppl trolling lol, can i get more input or forum link for the Emotiva mini X 

post #5294 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by TealRice View Post

so is the O2 good or are ppl trolling lol, can i get more input or forum link for the Emotiva mini X 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/629352/he-500-lcd2-d5000-dt770-sr80-on-a-speaker-amp-emotiva-mini-x-a-100-project

 

LOL to put it simply: don't get the O2 if you want to use it primarily with planars. For me 3 planars so far haven't worked out anywhere near their best performance.

post #5295 of 7128
Quote:
Originally Posted by SP Wild View Post

The devils advocate suggest that there are a few amongst us that hears not what you describe, and is capable of discerning "air" from the "not so much" airy "flaw" of the LCD2s.  Perhaps these people just do not need more treble to be able to achieve what commoners (as indeed we seem to be a minority) aspire to from the majority of headphones. 

 

Funny thing is that you're the first to object what I've said so far, I've mentioned about it the past only with other user's experience mirroring mine and the fact that some percentage of the large amount of LCD2's that pop in the F/S section are users disliking the laid back sound of the LCD2's, some calling it dark, warm whatever, you can say that it doesn't suit there sound pref's.

 

This comes back to what I also should've mentioned, pairing the LCD2's with a warm sounding source/amp/dac is the last thing I would personally do which. I've played around with enough LCD2's to know that this congestion is not just with my own pair only, to a few other people that I have met IRL here that own the LCD2's they did not know or couldn't quite put it down for sure what was wrong with the smearing going on till I pointed out a few cues for them listen to carefully that there is a congestion going on. An airy sounding headphone would be something like a stat, SA3/5k's, HD800 or the K/Q701/2's, wide soundstage, good imaging, bright sounding at times, cold or brittle to some. These characteristics are not that of the LCD2's.

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