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The Neutral / Balanced Thread - Page 18

Poll Results: Best Neutral IEM and Headphone 2011 (Pick 1 IEM and 1 Headphone only)

This is a multiple choice poll
  • 18% (43)
    Etymotic ER-4S
  • 3% (7)
    Hifiman RE-272
  • 3% (9)
    Shure SE425
  • 1% (3)
    Sony EX510
  • 7% (17)
    Vsonic GR07
  • 3% (8)
    Westone UM3X
  • 8% (20)
    Audeze LCD-2
  • 14% (33)
    Sennheiser HD600
  • 11% (27)
    Sennheiser HD800
  • 7% (18)
    Beyerdynamic DT880
  • 3% (7)
    Shure SRH 840
  • 8% (19)
    AKG 702
  • 9% (22)
    Stax SR-009
  • 0% (1)
    Denon DN-HP1000
  • 0% (1)
    ESP950
  • 10% (24)
    Ultimate Ears Reference Monitor Custom
  • 3% (9)
    Unique Melody Miracle
  • 2% (6)
    KRK-KNS8400
  • 2% (5)
    Koss ESP950
231 Total Votes  
post #256 of 353
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by purrin View Post

Voted 009. A second place vote would go to the UERM, but that IEM is not on the list. LCD2 - LOL - that's hardly neutral. Pleasant and forgiving yes, neutral no. Same thing with HD800. HD800 goes the other way - too bright.


Anyone else that can confirm this? 

 

https://audeze.com/about-us -> Audez’e provides innovative solutions for accurate sound acquisition and reproduction.

 

http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/home_en.nsf/root/private_headphones_audiophile-headphones_500319 -> You will form an altogether new height of sonic perspective as you experience a high-fidelity natural hearing experience.

 

post #257 of 353

The hd800 is quite neutral, graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=863 , brightness is a sonic quality.

 

The lcd-2 is very neutral until 2khz graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=3221

post #258 of 353
Thread Starter 

eek.gif Looking just at the FR graph, the LCD-2 looks very neutral. *Writes down the LCD-2 in my bucket list*

post #259 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRG1990 View Post

The hd800 is quite neutral, graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=863 , brightness is a sonic quality.


Nope. Sorry, those HR graphs are totally wrong because they don't reflect what trained ears hear.

Better HD800 measurements below:

a72366c7_HD800AnaxMod.gif

The yellow is a modified HD800. The green is stock. Measures bright and sounds bright to me.

 


Edited by purrin - 11/12/11 at 2:54pm
post #260 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRG1990 View Post

 

The lcd-2 is very neutral until 2khz graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=3221

 

Ummm, that's not neutral, that's rolled off - rather severely too i.e. -15db at 10kHz


Edited by purrin - 11/12/11 at 2:43pm
post #261 of 353

It's got horrible treble roll off though starts around 8khz, id expect more from a headphone costing that much, the lindy headphones are quite neutral, 1c0f862f_lindy_fr.png It looks like a u curve but because the human ear is more sensitive to the midrange frequences where the human voice would be that would sound quite netrual to the human ear, and it covers 20hz-20khz quite well no treble roll off until 18khz.

post #262 of 353

Never heard the Lindys, but I would agree that is a lot more neutral than most of other headphones in the list.

post #263 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikp View Post


Anyone else that can confirm this? 

 

https://audeze.com/about-us -> Audez’e provides innovative solutions for accurate sound acquisition and reproduction.

 

http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/home_en.nsf/root/private_headphones_audiophile-headphones_500319 -> You will form an altogether new height of sonic perspective as you experience a high-fidelity natural hearing experience.

 


I've gotten some time in with the LCD-2(thanks Purrin) and agree, it is bottom heavy, not neutral.

 

post #264 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by purrin View Post

 

Ummm, that's not neutral, that's rolled off - rather severely too i.e. -15db at 10kHz


This is assuming that a flat curve sounds neutral, though. That's not true for everyone, or compared to every reference.

post #265 of 353
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Head Injury View Post


This is assuming that a flat curve sounds neutral, though. That's not true for everyone, or compared to every reference.


Hehehe, it's funny that the statement came out of someone in Team Objecti-Fi.

 

post #266 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikp View Post

Hehehe, it's funny that the statement came out of someone in Team Objecti-Fi.


It's not, really. The frequency response should match a reference. Which reference is supposed to be matched isn't entirely agreed upon, and what shape that would entail depends on how the graph is compensated.

 

I think it would be fairly trivial to design a headphone specifically for flat frequency response by Headroom graphs. It just wouldn't sound neutral. Look at the HD800's graph. The treble peak isn't even as high as the mid-bass, but it's considered bright as hell. Frequency response graphs are good for comparison between headphones, if they're compensated the same way. They're not a good indication of neutrality unless you know exactly what reference you're aiming for.

post #267 of 353

I'm not sure what to make of the LCD-2.  It has neutral qualities but the treble is a bit less than I would consider neutral.

 

The Stax SR-009 does a very similar shelf style drop starting at 1000 Hz.  Look at the graphs for the SR-009 and the LCD-2 rev 2 over at InnerFidelity and they both look very similar.  The graph for the SR-009 looks to have a little more treble or a little bit less of a shelf.  But very very similar.  That shelf doesn't make the SR-009 or LCD-2 not neutral.  That shelf is just taking advantage of natural frequency bump that the ear does.  Adding that shelf just makes the sound more natural sounding and less like the headphone is yelling into your ear.  It's an acoustic trick on the ear and sounds very natural.  Just not sure how neutral and balanced it makes it.  And I'm not sure if the LCD-2 does enough of a treble bump compensation around 8-10 kHz.  I'm not sure if the SR-009 makes enough of a treble bump compensation either.  I've never heard the SR-009 to have an opinion on that.

 

I do consider my HD600 to be balanced and neutral for a headphone.  But it has no shelf.  It sound like the headphone is talking a few inches away into my ears.  What I consider the typical headphone neutral.  While the LCD-2 is a natural sounding neutral with the sense that the headphone is not yelling or talking into my ears.

post #268 of 353

Have any of you guys pulling up random FR curves actually heard the LCD2, SR009, and HD600. I mean every one of them and compared them to each other?

post #269 of 353

You were the one who pointed to the LCD-2's shelf and called it "not neutral". If the SR-009 has a frequency response that's similar, it can't be neutral either if that's true.

post #270 of 353

OK guys. I have had my HD 25 1 II for a couple days now. I will tell you right now there is no way these are neutral. They are bassy and trebly with a slightly laid back midrange. If anything i consider them bass heavy. But extremely good quality bass though.

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