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Koss Pro DJ 100 - The Budget King - Page 132

post #1966 of 2250
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwayniac View Post

I have both but I like the 200 because it has less bass and better clarity than the 100. As a matter of fact,I modded my 200 with plasticine clay around the drivers for tighter bass and a different cable,a Griffin Survivor cable to be exact. The stock cables are not useful me so I switched to a straight cable. I amp my 200's with a Fiio E11 so I get plenty of volume.

 

But how is that? I feel the same about the Pro DJ 100 and 200. They should be the same. I'm still in contact with Koss and they said they should sound the same, but the support guy wants to talk with engineers and get back to me.

 

I now have the Shure 840 Pads on the DJ 100, which improves detail and clarity A LOT, but takes away the bass, almost too much.

And I have the Pro DJ 100 Pads on the DJ 200. I've been listening to the 100 exclusively since my last post, deliberately. And right now, as I type, I'm listening to the DJ 200 with the DJ 100 pads on a Fiio E11 attached to my little Retina 13" MacBook – sadly no USB DAC for me yet ;)

Bass seems to have improved a lot, compared to my experience with the stock 200 pads.

 

How can that be? They look exactly the same. Or I'm just too stupid. I'll take them off later and compare them again and do some pad-switcheroo and then post again.

 

Right know I can say that I kinda like the setup I now seem to have: Pro DJ 200 with 100 pads, improves bass and better clarity than stock Pro DJ 100. 

Stock Pro DJ 100 -> too much bass and not enough clarity. Now with Shure 840 Pads just barely enough bass, super comfy and lots of clarity. Great mids and treble.  A lot of detail. Almost Grado-like. Yes: closed Grados. ;) Well, not really, ;)

 

A duo of great headphones I now seem to be able to alternate between depending on mood ... ;)

post #1967 of 2250
I think Tdock mentioned something about some holes inside the drivers being different depths. Got me I haven't did a side by side.
Here's my take, its the cable on the 200's. Since it's removable it changes the sound. Yep, I'm not a cable believer but these cans you can tell plain as day. I have the 100's and TBSE (Basically the 200), and side by side the TBSE are brighter with less bass.
Doesn't matter on the pads used, they just are brighter.
Best thing to do is replace the 200 cable, even with a cheap one. I recommend this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Choseal-Q-354-6ft-Gold-1-8mm-Male-to-Male-Audio-Cable-N-/110739303786?pt=US_Audio_Cables_Adapters&hash=item19c893ad6a
They are dirt cheap and are fantastic, These are the same cables that come with most Chinese portable amps, but of course much shorter. Choseal also makes high end cables but you don't need to go there. They are some of the most flexable cables as well.

This cable will darken down the 200 and make it sound just like the 100. if you want the sound of the 100 in your 200, swap the cable, trust me...

Another tip, put M50 pads on the 100...They work great as mentioned in the whole thread!!
Edited by Magicman74 - 10/14/13 at 11:50am
post #1968 of 2250
Quote:

This cable will darken down the 200 and make it sound just like the 100. if you want the sound of the 100 in your 200, swap the cable, trust me...

Another tip, put M50 pads on the 100...They work great as mentioned in the whole thread!!

 

Thanks. Very helpful post.

 

I figure that I must have misinterpreted some info in this thread. I ordered the Shure 840 pads, which are extremely comfortable and add so much nice clarity, but bring the bass way down ... a little too much. And I thought the M50 pads would turn hard after a while?


Edited by Electonic - 10/14/13 at 3:49pm
post #1969 of 2250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electonic View Post

Thanks. Very helpful post.

I figure that I must have misinterpreted some info in this thread. I ordered the Shure 840 pads, which are extremely comfortable and add so much nice clarity, but bring the bass way. And I thought the M50 pads would turn hard after a while?
Yes that's the only bad thing about the M50 pads. They do get hard. You can use skin lotion to keep them soft...LOL,
I'm serious, just rub the lotion on the skin, I'm mean pads. LOL...Just use a little, rub it in let it dry. They will stay soft..I know it sounds nasty but it works. Plus lotion won't hurt your skin like a leather softener would, since it's close to your skin.
post #1970 of 2250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicman74 View Post

I think Tdock mentioned something about some holes inside the drivers being different depths. Got me I haven't did a side by side.
Here's my take, its the cable on the 200's. Since it's removable it changes the sound. Yep, I'm not a cable believer but these cans you can tell plain as day. I have the 100's and TBSE (Basically the 200), and side by side the TBSE are brighter with less bass.
Doesn't matter on the pads used, they just are brighter.
Best thing to do is replace the 200 cable, even with a cheap one. I recommend this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Choseal-Q-354-6ft-Gold-1-8mm-Male-to-Male-Audio-Cable-N-/110739303786?pt=US_Audio_Cables_Adapters&hash=item19c893ad6a
They are dirt cheap and are fantastic, These are the same cables that come with most Chinese portable amps, but of course much shorter. Choseal also makes high end cables but you don't need to go there. They are some of the most flexable cables as well.

This cable will darken down the 200 and make it sound just like the 100. if you want the sound of the 100 in your 200, swap the cable, trust me...

Another tip, put M50 pads on the 100...They work great as mentioned in the whole thread!!



I agree with you about the holes in the drivers because I saw for myself when I modded my 200's. I think those holes and and a different cable changes the sound quality,for the better,to my ears.
Edited by dwayniac - 10/14/13 at 4:57pm
post #1971 of 2250

Can you give me an Advice which one to choose between the Koss Pro DJ100 or the Yamaha RH5-MA?

post #1972 of 2250
Thread Starter 

I got my new M50 pads in. The TB/DJ100 really isn't the same for me without them.

People probably think I'm nuts for saying this but my TB/DJ100 is more revealing of gear changes than even my Q701, HD-598, HD-650 and the K712 I had. It also seems to improve more with every single upgrade i've made. It's the most picky headphone I have for sure and actually is the most detailed (takes a little work though). It's held back with portable players and weak amps.

 

I had the Modi and it's about perfect for it. The Modi is not super duper detailed and excessively revealing to me. It's crystal clear and smooth sounding. Even some lower bit-rate recordings sound good and nothing is put under a Microscope really (same with ODAC).

 

I recently upgraded to the Headroom Micro DAC and it made the DJ100 and everything else even MORE revealing. I can hear a track that sounds bad and can actually pick out which ones are low bit-rate with ease. It's much harder on the Modi. I don't know what causes the changes. With the Micro DAC it DOES seem to put all music under a microscope and it makes bad/poor recordings much worse and some music isn't as smooth sounding yet it measures flat. It's like the Modi is more forgiving of harsh tracks and ones with weird peaks. The ODAC was too.

 

There is stuff on my DJ100/TB with M50 pads with my main setup that's nearly inaudible on my other headphones (even the K712!). It's like it's gone. There's even very low bass that the others don't even pick up but the DJ100 does. There is a track from the Yoshida Brothers called "Aiya" that has some ultra subtle details that's only audible on the DJ100, KRK KNS-8400 and T90. It's like a rattling sound. Something that is bouncing on a table and reflecting off the walls (it's not cup resonance!).

 

The DJ100 now finally is more able to recreate the air/echos etc found in some recordings. The NIN song "Ringfinger" is good for this. You get all that and even amazing soundstage depth, but it requires M50 pads and a good DAC for all this. This airy sound is just not as present on the Modi I think. It really does feel like an open headphone now all thanks to my new DAC. Well, not quite but even closer.

 

The TB/DJ100 though now seems a little bassier than I remember. Might be because i've been listening to the K712, modded Q701 and HD-650 too much. The DJ100 has more low bass than the HD-650 and K712 for sure. No doubt there. A little more. The low bass of the DJ100 is comparable to the KRK KNS-8400 (which most say is bass light!).

 

Unfortunately there is a huge variation in how warm recordings sound. On some of my Jpop the DJ100 is very accurate and they feel often thin/tinny due to recording. You switch songs and it's totally different, just like on the modded Q701.

 

Modded Q701 is the closest match to the DJ100 with M50 pads i've heard. DJ100 still has fuller mids, more low bass presence and maybe less treble. K712 is similar to the modded Q701 but is a little warmer sounding. Not much difference. K712 has more forward low mids then the modded Q701 and DJ100 with M50 pads. Vocals on the DJ100 are accurate and true to the recording IMO. Maybe perhaps a little more forward female vocals. On a transparent setup it actually sounds neutral to me, perhaps very very  slightly emphasized bass.

 

It seems the DJ100 also hates interference and noise. If you get any then the DJ100 could sound a little worse. With portable amps and players this is no problem.

 

BTW my DJ100 needs the same level of volume on my amp as the Q701 and K712. About 11 o clock. Probably a tiny bit less.

 

I also notice more hiss/noise etc on the DJ100 that's inside the recording. I almost never get that on the K712 or Q701. I think that's an open vs closed thing though perhaps.

 

It's amusing hearing all sorts of annoying peaks in my recordings. You can switch to the HD-650 or Q701 and they're just as bad with the same setup.

 

This Micro Stack is pretty amazing. So sad that it's discontinued. I haven't heard anything better yet for my Q701, DJ100 or HD-650. Not even the O2 or Asgard 2.

 

EDIT:

 

Another interesting thing I found is that with the T90 the Modi is a better match for it than the Headroom Micro DAC. Sounded smoother due to being less revealing. It's the first time I heard any sort of warmth coming from the Modi and it took the T90 to hear it! Well I also think this applies to the DJ100 too. The DJ100 is a tad more musical on the Modi due to being less ultra revealing and a little warmer (barely audible). Modi has a tiny amount of warmth perhaps but most people won't hear it unless it's on maybe a T90 or maybe a DT-880 or a KRK.


Edited by tdockweiler - 10/26/13 at 1:14pm
post #1973 of 2250
post #1974 of 2250
Thread Starter 

I tried these last night with the Fiio E17 from a docked Ipod Touch 2G. I had M50 pads installed and for some reason the bass was really sloppy/bloated. Any ideas why?

You might think i'm nuts but the E17 doesn't seem like it's enough for them. It seems to require the same amount of volume on my amps as the Q701. I then tried the Q701 from it and it was a bit thin and not it's usual self. HD-650 was somehow amazing with the same setup.

 

Here I am making the DJ100 look extremely power hungry and yet the HD-650 sounds great with just an E17!!

 

Maybe something in that above setup was wrong and bloated the bass. Very bizarre. I don't think so because the HD-650 sounded perfect.

 

Based on memory the E17 connected as a DAC/Amp from my PC sounded a bit better. Maybe it gets more power from USB or something. Not sure how that works.

 

I should try my Headroom Total Airhead because I think that drives it a little better.

post #1975 of 2250
Thread Starter 

I made the swap and tried the M50 pads on the DJ100 instead of my Tony Bennett. I think there must be some slight differences.

 

The DJ100 with M50 pads sounds a little warmer and fuller in the mids than the TB with the M50 pads. TB might have a a little more treble presence.

I wonder how they did this?

 

I listened to the DJ100 with M50 pads for nearly 5 hours yesterday. Loved every minute of it and didn't want to sleep!

 

It was with the docked Ipod Touch 2G to Total Airhead. Supposedly the Airhead may have some bass roll off but it's totally inaudible for me. I think it must be with only IEMs.

I find it sounds better than the E17 and is even more neutral. The soundstage is much more open/spacious sounding.

 

With the same setup it even did very well with my HD-650 and Q701. The Airhead even drives my K400!! And some say the Airhead is "weak". Nope...

 

The thing I noticed with this setup is that bright/harsh/sibilant tracks were no problem. The DJ100 with M50 pads is kind of forgiving of them with this setup.

On my main desktop setup this isn't the case as much.

 

I haven't listened to my Ipod Touch 2G in a long time but it's pretty good.

 

BTW the E17 sounds perhaps a little fuller in the mids than the Airhead but more closed in etc.

 

I could seriously give up my entire headphone collection and not feel like i'm missing a thing. Actually with the modded Q701 I feel like i'm missing something compared to the DJ100 with M50 pads.

 

Wonder if the DJ200 sounds different than the DJ100 or is a clone of the TB?


Edited by tdockweiler - 11/2/13 at 11:00am
post #1976 of 2250
The 100 and 200 sound different to me with 100 being warmer. I don't know for sure but I think the 200 and TB are the same internally. Once I get my 100's back from my nephew,I will post photos of both headphone with cups that have taken apart.
post #1977 of 2250
Thread Starter 

If you're a real nerd like me you can use the DJ100 to troubleshoot audio equipment problems. No i'm not kidding.

I got a new soundcard yesterday with an optical output to use with my new Headroom Micro DAC.

 

Last night I was loving the DJ100 with my bedroom system and it sounded perfect. I switched to my main setup and it sounded worse! Yet it's probably 3x more expensive.

With all my other headphones it sounded perfect and no change at all.

 

I guess you could say that the DJ100 sounded more congested with everything and more closed in than last night. It randomly would sound ear piercing in the treble too, which made it even more bizarre.

A lack of sound clarity and not sounding smooth at all.

 

So I spent awhile trying to figure out what was going on and then out of nowhere I tried to switch from Optical to USB on my Micro DAC. Bingo!

 

Apparently my soundcard's optical output is a piece of junk or it's a bad cable. Maybe it's some type of electrical noise/distortion getting through and crapping up the sound.

I even tried connecting my amp/DAC straight to the wall and into a UPS Backup and two surge protectors.

 

I now have that crystal clear sound and the good soundstage like I heard last night. Totally smooth now with well controlled bass.

 

When you use a MOV based surge protector on your amp you can hear it crapping up the sound of the DJ100. No joke. It's very hard to notice with most music and it messes with the bass a bit.

It's not there on the Q701, HD-598, HD-650 or anything else. I bet I could hear it on the T90. I use a non MOV based surge protector for the DJ100 and my amp. The power supplies for my DAC/Amp also have good filtering too.

 

So I guess the Xonor DG has a worthless optical output that degrades audio or just a bad cable or something. The optical cable I was using doesn't have any shielding but I don't think it's really required. Or maybe it is?

 

Pretty funny you can hear all this electrical junk getting through to the DJ100. I live in a fairly new apartment too. Not audible on anything else.

 

BTW my DJ100 with M50 pads actually has always sounded clearer than even my HD-650 and Q701. Comparable to maybe the KRK KNS-8400. Maybe it's due to being closed or something. Who knows.

 

EDIT:

 

This Headroom Micro Stack (+ Astryodyne PS on both) is really amazing with the DJ100. I can't hear much difference between the Micro DAC and my Modi when using my other headphones, but did a bit with the T90 I tried. On the DJ100 the difference is much greater. Right now on the Buena Vista Social Club it sounds like a way fuller sounding modded Q701 that's less airy/distant. Strangely the soundstage with the Micro DAC/amp is actually better (not larger, but with better imaging). Imaging is just so dang impressive. It's too bad that the Micro Stack is like $500 and worth every penny though. Even for the DJ100 :D. Headroom stuff is way underrated.

 

If you want the DJ100 with M50 pads to sound like an open headphone and fool your brain try this Micro Stack!

 

The Ipod Touch docked to Total Airhead is good too, but not as revealing/detailed/spacious sounding. I believe that uses a BurrBrown op-amp.

 

To my ears the DJ100 sounds pretty flat/neutral, but yet very fun to listen to and addicting. It's mids are very full sounding and none of my gear is dark/warm etc. It seems to be forgiving of harsh peaks/sibilance IN recordings. I can't complain about that! Whoever designed the DJ100 hears like I do I guess.


Edited by tdockweiler - 11/2/13 at 8:34pm
post #1978 of 2250

Hey so I was trying to mod my DJ 100's and I accidentally unhooked a tiny wire (man these wires are thin). 

 

I stole this pic from a mod post. It's the tiny green one with the other two in the black casing. I assume it's the ground wire? What is it going to do if it stays unhooked and is there a way to fix it without soldering cause I don't got a soldering iron. I kind of have it taped on that general area where all the others are soldered. Is that enough?

 

Thanks for any help.

 

post #1979 of 2250

Here's some more pads that fit these headphones. They are cheap. Anyone who wants to test them out?

 

http://www.razerzone.com/store/razer-ear-cushion

post #1980 of 2250

Is it possible to 'lock' the headphones in stereo mode? (i.e removing the functionality of the stereo/mono switch) because my switch is broken and stuck somewhere between stereo and mono which sounds a little strange. 

 

Is there also a step by step on how to mod them to fit a detachable cable? (sorry if ive missed it)

 

And does anyone have a recommendation for male and female connectors for the mod? (I'd also want to turn the cable into a 3.5mm to 3.5mm)

 

Thanks all :)

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