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Sennheiser IE80's Impressions Thread - Page 309

post #4621 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacman46 View Post


no I think that the senns are great..they are fast becoming my favorite iem..and in a hury too..I like my heirs too specially when I'm listening to music for all the detail..for rockn roll the senns imo blow them away..don't get me wrong I do like the heirs alot they are just different..and speaking of detail I was surprised just how much detail they have and while keeping that nice hard hitting bottem end..can't wait for them to get up over 200 hours on them to see how they sound then..not really sure why anyone would bash any headphone / iem..I think it comes down to personal taste..maybe this person wasn't getting a proper seal...which is not that easy with these or he didn't let them burn in..either way I think he's wrong as I'm no bass head and like I said these are fastly becoming my favorite iem...the heirs have a really nice almost ballenced sound..I say almost cause there is a dip around the 4k mark that you really don't notice till you compare them to something a little more ballenced like the er4s or with the eq bump up the 4k a couple notches then you notice..but other then that they sound great..they to me are more of a treble iem with really tight fast bass..not a bass head iem by no means..they are very clear and very detailed yet they are a little on the dark side of things..the senns have great hard hitting fast bass nice smooth highs and the mids are ok too.. A little pushed back I think but that's part of the signature..when I got the senns I noticed rite away just how wide the soundstage is its quit amazing..where as the heirs are more in your face with a more narrow soundstage...they both are different in there signatures and you'll like one or the other or if your like me you'll like both for different things..when I want to listen to detail I listen to my heirs..when I want to lay back and just listen and enjoy the music without being critical about it I listen to my senns.. I'm not really that good at explaining this stuff but I hope that helps..like I said I'm loving these headphones juat wish I had of bought them sooner they are fantastic.. smily_headphones1.gif

No this person used to sing praises about how fantastic the IE80 was...until he got his Heir. I was a bit baffled at the sudden change of heart but I guess horses for courses really. Anyway I am glad you appreciate both the Heir and the Senn for what they really are and not any other questionable reasons.smily_headphones1.gif

post #4622 of 5731
I don't bash anyone's taste or Headphones..they are all different and it really depends what one likes..I think maybe he is just a band wagon jumper..lol whatever he has new is the best lol who knows..do you know how long rough these need to burn in.? I read like 200 hours.. I think they sounded good rite out of the box so if they get even better that's a bonus lol..
post #4623 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3nenbgumi View Post

No this person used to sing praises about how fantastic the IE80 was...until he got his Heir. I was a bit baffled at the sudden change of heart but I guess horses for courses really. Anyway I am glad you appreciate both the Heir and the Senn for what they really are and not any other questionable reasons.smily_headphones1.gif

People always do that, he probably sold away his IE80 after getting his heir.

Nobody wants to face that what they have bought was something inferior.

 

But my guess is that brain burn did a impression to him.

We all know the senns are quite detailed, just that it's laid back.

 

So if you're going from the heirs to the IE80s, you'll definately feel details lacking.

 

Anyone who likes the ie80s likes it very much, those who hate it, hates it very much also.

How willing is one open to brain burn will give the different impressions.

post #4624 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3nenbgumi View Post

No this person used to sing praises about how fantastic the IE80 was...until he got his Heir. I was a bit baffled at the sudden change of heart but I guess horses for courses really. Anyway I am glad you appreciate both the Heir and the Senn for what they really are and not any other questionable reasons.smily_headphones1.gif


lol I think I know who you are referring to. Someone who also comes from Hawaii ;).

 

FWIW the IE80 are a very good pair of IEMs but many won't like the overbearing mid bass hump. With time and getting accustomed to other IEMs it made it all that much more apparent. Although the tape mod and pure silver cable really fixed that issue for me. But at that point the IEMs I had just made the discrepancies in sound too vast where I lost all interest in the IE80. It's still a great IEM and is quite versatile with the ability to mod them without resorting to actual software EQ. The IE8 got me started in this whole journey and they'll always have a special place for me :).

post #4625 of 5731
I personally think some people analyze Sorry for my spelling lol. Analyze headphones / earphones too much..like with graphs and sorts.. I've been on this journey for just over a year now and Like everyone else looking for that perfect iem for me!!!. I have some really nice sounding earphones that I've bought but to just listen to my music and enjoy them I came across these..and u think my journey has at least stoopedfor the time being..next step would be maybe customs..buy with customs come lots of different problems..anyways I think anyone who enjoys rockn roll New and old should most deffently try these out..I really don't think you will be disappointed..smily_headphones1.gif
post #4626 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee730 View Post


lol I think I know who you are referring to. Someone who also comes from Hawaii ;).

 

FWIW the IE80 are a very good pair of IEMs but many won't like the overbearing mid bass hump. With time and getting accustomed to other IEMs it made it all that much more apparent. Although the tape mod and pure silver cable really fixed that issue for me. But at that point the IEMs I had just made the discrepancies in sound too vast where I lost all interest in the IE80. It's still a great IEM and is quite versatile with the ability to mod them without resorting to actual software EQ. The IE8 got me started in this whole journey and they'll always have a special place for me :).

You know what I'm talking about wink.gif. And yeah, I would not blame you for leaving the IE80 for the 1plus2. Seriously, IE80 on steroids? I'd jump at it when finance allowed (not atm, but hopefully eventually).

The IE80 was also an eye-opener for me to this IEM path and I do not intend to leave them anytime soon. I have a list of stuff I might get in the future, but the IE80 is not going anywhere for the foreseeable future.

post #4627 of 5731

I would definitely agree that coming from a mid-forward IEM that stressed details, jumping right back to the IE8/80 takes a few minutes - but I have some recordings I love to listen to with my Sennheisers - I listed to "The Yes Album" or "American Idiot" and am seduced by the rumble of the bass notes - Chris Squire sounds great on the IE8 (I just had to rhyme there) It takes a few songs for the head to adjust - but they do eventually. I'm keeping mine - for the hell of it.

post #4628 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3nenbgumi View Post

You know what I'm talking about wink.gif. And yeah, I would not blame you for leaving the IE80 for the 1plus2. Seriously, IE80 on steroids? I'd jump at it when finance allowed (not atm, but hopefully eventually).

The IE80 was also an eye-opener for me to this IEM path and I do not intend to leave them anytime soon. I have a list of stuff I might get in the future, but the IE80 is not going anywhere for the foreseeable future.


I had the Sennhesiers for about 2 years if I remember correctly. I went through 3 pairs :P starting with the IE8 and ended with the IE80. It must have been good for me to go back to them 2 times :).

post #4629 of 5731
Hi Lee, I've seen a couple of your post on the jh13pro thread. Assuming you have them, can you give me an impression between the jh13 vs 1+2? The waiting time on my ciems is so long and the chance getting a refit is just... With these reason, im looking at the 1+2 with great interest.

Please school me sensei. biggrin.gif
post #4630 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimtuth View Post

Hi Lee, I've seen a couple of your post on the jh13pro thread. Assuming you have them, can you give me an impression between the jh13 vs 1+2? The waiting time on my ciems is so long and the chance getting a refit is just... With these reason, im looking at the 1+2 with great interest.

Please school me sensei. biggrin.gif


lol sadly I haven't heard the JH13. I suggest you have a looksee at Tupacs impressions on them. He prefers the 1Plus2 by a a pretty good margin and he owns several pairs of Custom IEMs. Goodvibes likes his JH13s overall though in comparison. But I think you'll find more have posted that they preferred the 1Plus2 over the JH products including JH16. I thought the JH13 Pro was their Universal Fit or I guess I got that one wrong :P. Do they have a specific name for their universal model of the 13? I thought the name for the custom was JH13 FP.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/623514/tralucent-audio-1plus2-iem-appreciation-impressions-thread/2610

post #2619 of 2781

1+2 vs SE5 vs NT6 vs JH13:

 

Sorry about my bad English, I might have to use the same word again and again. And everything I say here will just be my opinion and my own experience only (from UK).biggrin.gif

 

Source:

Desktop: Anedio D2

Portable: Ak120 + portaphile 627

 

1+2: Before I describe how 1+2 sounds, I would like to address about the tips issues. I have been doing the tip rolling since I got them. I tried about 20 pairs of different tips (and will keep on trying more). I won’t be surprised if people say 1+2 sounds bright, or not detailed enough. Because from my experience, tips play a huge part in presenting the 1+2 sound. I am sure people have mentioned this in the earlier thread too. Tips can change 1+2 from sounding very bright, harsh to neutral to very dull and dark. People hear different things and have different ear shapes, so they will use different choice for tips. Therefore this makes it very hard to speak on the signature of 1+2. I find ortofon ones make the sound very bright and comply foam ones make the highs roll off a lot with recessed mid. Luckily, I was able to find my sweet point for it which is “small sized comply T500 with 1/4 of tip ends being cut off”. This will gives me the most linear frequency response to my ears with just enough space and treble without going bright. The mid sits right in the middle and the bass is super deep and punchy. So all my comparisons below will be done using this tip. IMO 1+2 is more suitable to more experienced and patient audiophiles that know about what sound they want. For those who don’t know or don’t want to know about the tip rolling, there is a good chance that you may love it very much or hate it very much. 

 

Sound: 1+2 with the right tips sounds super neutral to me from the top to the bottom. It has a very accurate sound to me. The bass can go very deep with amazing texture and very natural decay. The mids have great density and layering. It doesn’t sound forward or recessed to my ears. The treble, again super flat with great clarity and smoothness. Making the sound very transparent and airy without going to the edge in any part of the treble spectrum. The combination of low, mid and high create one of the largest spaces I have ever heard in earphones. It really manages to generate an outer hand soundstage rather the in head sound. It fooled me so many times on certain songs making me think the sound is actually really from outside. There are just not many words I can use to talk about the characters of the sound because it’s just so realistic and neutral, and truly doesn’t have any color. I am very impressed that this small universal IEM can produce a very BIG sound like speakers.

 

JH13: I wanted to burn in the JH13 for some more time since I just got it today and only running for like 7 hours. But JH13 has such a typical JH audio sound that I find myself confident enough to describe the sound. So any further change will be too subtle to change my opinion on its overall sound. The new FP jh13 is really something. It has its typical JH forward presentation with great clarity and smoothness. I have been having my JH16 for almost 2 years so I am very familiar to it, the new JH13 sound like a bass light version of my JH16, but better in almost every way. The bass on the new JH13 is very tight and fast with great decay and punch. The new jh13 has almost the same amount of sub-bass as JH16, which rumbles a lot! Some might like it some might find it messed up some bass light songs. The new jh13 has less mid/upper bass presentation, that makes the mids sound more neutral and forward than JH16. With that said, JH’s products still don’t present vocals very forward. It has a more pronounced upper mid/lower treble (4-10k Hz), so the instruments are thrown at you directly with all the details. This will give the presentation a very large width of soundstage, but somewhat lacking depth. JH13 does a better job in this area by adding more depth into the soundstage making the vocals less sibilant. Although JH13 has a better treble extension than JH16, the treble still rolls off quicker than it should have (about 12k, it starts to roll off).

 

Hidition NT6: This has been the benchmark of studio mixing type reference IEM for me. The spectrum is flat all the way, except a small hump at 11k, which takes the presentation to the brighter side to some extent. Although, it has such a liquid and smooth sound, some will find it bright period. I will not talk about it too much here. If you want to read about it you can go to average joe’s NT6 review.

 

SE 5 way: The best earphone I have ever heard and that still remains true till now. It’s just incredible in every way. It’s very dependent on different songs, so it really show you what the artists intended to do. The bass capacity is insane, no matter how much bass is required in the song, it will delivery. It has the resolution of the top class full sized headphones. Every time I put on any earphone after SE5, I will notice the resolution difference right away. Se5’s treble extends forever that I feel like I can even hear 19k with it. The whole presentation is just natural, musical and liquid like. It presents details in one of the cleanest and clearest ways. It feels like all the detail is delivered on a black and clean background while other earphones will need to lift brightness in order to do that. Anyways, again go to average joe’s SE5 review for more information.

 

1+2 vs JH13: Both sound super in their own ways. You will be impressed easily by either of them. They are both very dynamic with good speeds. The bass is equally tight and deep. 1+2 has more bass presence, so it punches a bit harder. The sub bass decay of 1+2 is faster than JH13. The mid region of 1+2 is more linear than JH13. JH13’s vocal is a bit recessed but the edge of vocal is more forward (if you know what I mean here). Also the vocals on JH13 have a bit more sibilance than the ones on 1+2. The soundstage of 1+2 is larger than Jh13’s. The depth is about the same. The detail is presented in different ways between the two. JH13 throws the detail directly in your face with great clarity. 1+2 has more transparent and airy presentation. Instrument detail is presented with great clarity but not as forward as JH13. JH13 has a unique tuning. It uses its rolled off upper treble to balanced out the forwarded lower treble, leading to a forward sounding, but with certain liquidity and smoothness. So although the presentation is forward, I still wouldn’t call JH13 bright (I will rather call it sibilant on vocals). 1+2 isn’t as forward, but has better treble extension, so it’s more linear and neutral. Both sound very smooth when well driven. For me, JH13 will be more suitable to today’s pop, electronic type of music, where as 1+2 is more capable of doing more genres.

 

With various tips, 1+2 can sound either worse than jh13, or better than JH13 IMO.

 

1+2 vs NT6: When I first put on the 1+2 with the stock tips, I find it sound almost identical to NT6. They share so many similarities. But when I switched to my “best” tips, 1+2’s treble becomes more neutral in terms of clarity, decay and brightness.

NT6 has a slightly more liquid lower treble, but as I said, its peak at 11k just make it too clear for my taste that I will have to take a rest after long period of listening. They both have very large soundstage, 1+2 has about +10% width and -10% depth.  Both have great controlled bass with 1+2 having a bit more presence. The mids are sitting at very similar positions. They are just sounding more similar than different.

 

1+2 vs SE5: With the best tips, 1+2 can certainly perform at the level of SE5. Technically I still think SE5 is superior due to its complexity of 5 ways crossover system. But 1+2 really keeps it up to the maximum extent. They both have incredibly bass extension. They both have the ability to create earthquake like 20hz full note. SE5 has a bit more mid/upper bass presence than 1+2. So 1+2’s bass decays a little bit faster while SE5 has a layer more of “body” to the whole sound signature. SE5’s is more mid forward than 1+2 giving SE5 fuller, denser vocals. The treble is very different between the two. Compared to se5, 1+2 has more forward treble with instantly better clarity while SE5 has more linear and extended treble that can provide the same level of clarity in another way. So as a result, 1+2 will present detail with combination of brightness and clarity where as SE5 will present detail with its extreme neutrality and resolution. The detail level is slightly higher on SE5 due to its more extended treble. The soundstages are about the same sizes for 1+2 and SE5 on poorly mixed tracks. But when it comes to well mastered songs, 1+2 surpass the soundstage width of SE5 without losing much depth. They both require large amount of healthy power to shine IMO, with SE5 being more power hungry.

 

These two IMO complement each other very well just like HD800 and LCD 3. 1+2 is neutral, se5 is natural, you try to tell the difference I am trying to express here. Both well balanced. I wouldn’t call SE5 dark and wouldn’t call 1+2 bright, but 1+2 is brighter than SE5. They can basically cover every genre of music you want to listen. For pop, hip hop and vocals I will pick SE5 first, and for classical and jazz, 1+2 will be the first (although they are both good on all genres).

 

Overall sound score (for me only):

 

SE 5 WAY: 98

NT6: 93

1+2: 86-96 (with good tips rolling)

JH13: 88

(JH16: 80)

 

Thanks for reading~


Edited by tupac0306 - 5/31/13 at 5:23pm
post #4631 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee730 View Post


lol sadly I haven't heard the JH13. I suggest you have a looksee at Tupacs impressions on them. He prefers the 1Plus2 by a a pretty good margin and he owns several pairs of Custom IEMs. Goodvibes likes his JH13s overall though in comparison. But I think you'll find more have posted that they preferred the 1Plus2 over the JH products including JH16. I thought the JH13 Pro was their Universal Fit or I guess I got that one wrong :P. Do they have a specific name for their universal model of the 13? I thought the name for the custom was JH13 FP.


http://www.head-fi.org/t/623514/tralucent-audio-1plus2-iem-appreciation-impressions-thread/2610

post #2619 of 2781
2 weeks, 1 day ago



  • 100x100px-LS-54a60d4c_Tupac-1024x768-tupac-shakur-25745752-1024-768.jpeg

  • 1,282 Posts. Joined 5/2011



1+2 vs SE5 vs NT6 vs JH13:

Sorry about my bad English, I might have to use the same word again and again. And everything I say here will just be my opinion and my own experience only (from UK).biggrin.gif


Source:
Desktop: Anedio D2
Portable: Ak120 + portaphile 627

1+2: Before I describe how 1+2 sounds, I would like to address about the tips issues. I have been doing the tip rolling since I got them. I tried about 20 pairs of different tips (and will keep on trying more). I won’t be surprised if people say 1+2 sounds bright, or not detailed enough. Because from my experience, tips play a huge part in presenting the 1+2 sound. I am sure people have mentioned this in the earlier thread too. Tips can change 1+2 from sounding very bright, harsh to neutral to very dull and dark. People hear different things and have different ear shapes, so they will use different choice for tips. Therefore this makes it very hard to speak on the signature of 1+2. I find ortofon ones make the sound very bright and comply foam ones make the highs roll off a lot with recessed mid. Luckily, I was able to find my sweet point for it which is “small sized comply T500 with 1/4 of tip ends being cut off”. This will gives me the most linear frequency response to my ears with just enough space and treble without going bright. The mid sits right in the middle and the bass is super deep and punchy. So all my comparisons below will be done using this tip. IMO 1+2 is more suitable to more experienced and patient audiophiles that know about what sound they want. For those who don’t know or don’t want to know about the tip rolling, there is a good chance that you may love it very much or hate it very much. 


Sound: 1+2 with the right tips sounds super neutral to me from the top to the bottom. It has a very accurate sound to me. The bass can go very deep with amazing texture and very natural decay. The mids have great density and layering. It doesn’t sound forward or recessed to my ears. The treble, again super flat with great clarity and smoothness. Making the sound very transparent and airy without going to the edge in any part of the treble spectrum. The combination of low, mid and high create one of the largest spaces I have ever heard in earphones. It really manages to generate an outer hand soundstage rather the in head sound. It fooled me so many times on certain songs making me think the sound is actually really from outside. There are just not many words I can use to talk about the characters of the sound because it’s just so realistic and neutral, and truly doesn’t have any color. I am very impressed that this small universal IEM can produce a very BIG sound like speakers.

JH13: I wanted to burn in the JH13 for some more time since I just got it today and only running for like 7 hours. But JH13 has such a typical JH audio sound that I find myself confident enough to describe the sound. So any further change will be too subtle to change my opinion on its overall sound. The new FP jh13 is really something. It has its typical JH forward presentation with great clarity and smoothness. I have been having my JH16 for almost 2 years so I am very familiar to it, the new JH13 sound like a bass light version of my JH16, but better in almost every way. The bass on the new JH13 is very tight and fast with great decay and punch. The new jh13 has almost the same amount of sub-bass as JH16, which rumbles a lot! Some might like it some might find it messed up some bass light songs. The new jh13 has less mid/upper bass presentation, that makes the mids sound more neutral and forward than JH16. With that said, JH’s products still don’t present vocals very forward. It has a more pronounced upper mid/lower treble (4-10k Hz), so the instruments are thrown at you directly with all the details. This will give the presentation a very large width of soundstage, but somewhat lacking depth. JH13 does a better job in this area by adding more depth into the soundstage making the vocals less sibilant. Although JH13 has a better treble extension than JH16, the treble still rolls off quicker than it should have (about 12k, it starts to roll off).

Hidition NT6: This has been the benchmark of studio mixing type reference IEM for me. The spectrum is flat all the way, except a small hump at 11k, which takes the presentation to the brighter side to some extent. Although, it has such a liquid and smooth sound, some will find it bright period. I will not talk about it too much here. If you want to read about it you can go to average joe’s NT6 review.

SE 5 way: The best earphone I have ever heard and that still remains true till now. It’s just incredible in every way. It’s very dependent on different songs, so it really show you what the artists intended to do. The bass capacity is insane, no matter how much bass is required in the song, it will delivery. It has the resolution of the top class full sized headphones. Every time I put on any earphone after SE5, I will notice the resolution difference right away. Se5’s treble extends forever that I feel like I can even hear 19k with it. The whole presentation is just natural, musical and liquid like. It presents details in one of the cleanest and clearest ways. It feels like all the detail is delivered on a black and clean background while other earphones will need to lift brightness in order to do that. Anyways, again go to average joe’s SE5 review for more information.

1+2 vs JH13: Both sound super in their own ways. You will be impressed easily by either of them. They are both very dynamic with good speeds. The bass is equally tight and deep. 1+2 has more bass presence, so it punches a bit harder. The sub bass decay of 1+2 is faster than JH13. The mid region of 1+2 is more linear than JH13. JH13’s vocal is a bit recessed but the edge of vocal is more forward (if you know what I mean here). Also the vocals on JH13 have a bit more sibilance than the ones on 1+2. The soundstage of 1+2 is larger than Jh13’s. The depth is about the same. The detail is presented in different ways between the two. JH13 throws the detail directly in your face with great clarity. 1+2 has more transparent and airy presentation. Instrument detail is presented with great clarity but not as forward as JH13. JH13 has a unique tuning. It uses its rolled off upper treble to balanced out the forwarded lower treble, leading to a forward sounding, but with certain liquidity and smoothness. So although the presentation is forward, I still wouldn’t call JH13 bright (I will rather call it sibilant on vocals). 1+2 isn’t as forward, but has better treble extension, so it’s more linear and neutral. Both sound very smooth when well driven. For me, JH13 will be more suitable to today’s pop, electronic type of music, where as 1+2 is more capable of doing more genres.


With various tips, 1+2 can sound either worse than jh13, or better than JH13 IMO.

1+2 vs NT6: When I first put on the 1+2 with the stock tips, I find it sound almost identical to NT6. They share so many similarities. But when I switched to my “best” tips, 1+2’s treble becomes more neutral in terms of clarity, decay and brightness.

NT6 has a slightly more liquid lower treble, but as I said, its peak at 11k just make it too clear for my taste that I will have to take a rest after long period of listening. They both have very large soundstage, 1+2 has about +10% width and -10% depth.  Both have great controlled bass with 1+2 having a bit more presence. The mids are sitting at very similar positions. They are just sounding more similar than different.

1+2 vs SE5: With the best tips, 1+2 can certainly perform at the level of SE5. Technically I still think SE5 is superior due to its complexity of 5 ways crossover system. But 1+2 really keeps it up to the maximum extent. They both have incredibly bass extension. They both have the ability to create earthquake like 20hz full note. SE5 has a bit more mid/upper bass presence than 1+2. So 1+2’s bass decays a little bit faster while SE5 has a layer more of “body” to the whole sound signature. SE5’s is more mid forward than 1+2 giving SE5 fuller, denser vocals. The treble is very different between the two. Compared to se5, 1+2 has more forward treble with instantly better clarity while SE5 has more linear and extended treble that can provide the same level of clarity in another way. So as a result, 1+2 will present detail with combination of brightness and clarity where as SE5 will present detail with its extreme neutrality and resolution. The detail level is slightly higher on SE5 due to its more extended treble. The soundstages are about the same sizes for 1+2 and SE5 on poorly mixed tracks. But when it comes to well mastered songs, 1+2 surpass the soundstage width of SE5 without losing much depth. They both require large amount of healthy power to shine IMO, with SE5 being more power hungry.


These two IMO complement each other very well just like HD800 and LCD 3. 1+2 is neutral, se5 is natural, you try to tell the difference I am trying to express here. Both well balanced. I wouldn’t call SE5 dark and wouldn’t call 1+2 bright, but 1+2 is brighter than SE5. They can basically cover every genre of music you want to listen. For pop, hip hop and vocals I will pick SE5 first, and for classical and jazz, 1+2 will be the first (although they are both good on all genres).

Overall sound score (for me only):

SE 5 WAY: 98
NT6: 93
1+2: 86-96 (with good tips rolling)

JH13: 88
(JH16: 80)

Thanks for reading~

Edited by tupac0306 - 5/31/13 at 5:23pm

Thanks Lee. Insightful as always. My sweetspot in an iem is soundstage, imaging, clarity and how it present the mids/vocals. Seems like the 1+2 outperforms the jh13 on these category... Eversince i got my IE80s, i started to despise universals, due to the tip issue; hence, i avoided 334s and plus2.

Thanks for the feedback. Might get a pair since universals have a good resale value; in the occasion where i run into the "tip" dilemma.

On another note, got any news about the studio V refresh?
post #4632 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee730 View Post


lol sadly I haven't heard the JH13. I suggest you have a looksee at Tupacs impressions on them. He prefers the 1Plus2 by a a pretty good margin and he owns several pairs of Custom IEMs. Goodvibes likes his JH13s overall though in comparison. But I think you'll find more have posted that they preferred the 1Plus2 over the JH products including JH16. I thought the JH13 Pro was their Universal Fit or I guess I got that one wrong :P. Do they have a specific name for their universal model of the 13? I thought the name for the custom was JH13 FP.


http://www.head-fi.org/t/623514/tralucent-audio-1plus2-iem-appreciation-impressions-thread/2610

post #2619 of 2781
2 weeks, 1 day ago



  • 100x100px-LS-54a60d4c_Tupac-1024x768-tupac-shakur-25745752-1024-768.jpeg

  • 1,282 Posts. Joined 5/2011



1+2 vs SE5 vs NT6 vs JH13:

Sorry about my bad English, I might have to use the same word again and again. And everything I say here will just be my opinion and my own experience only (from UK).biggrin.gif


Source:
Desktop: Anedio D2
Portable: Ak120 + portaphile 627

1+2: Before I describe how 1+2 sounds, I would like to address about the tips issues. I have been doing the tip rolling since I got them. I tried about 20 pairs of different tips (and will keep on trying more). I won’t be surprised if people say 1+2 sounds bright, or not detailed enough. Because from my experience, tips play a huge part in presenting the 1+2 sound. I am sure people have mentioned this in the earlier thread too. Tips can change 1+2 from sounding very bright, harsh to neutral to very dull and dark. People hear different things and have different ear shapes, so they will use different choice for tips. Therefore this makes it very hard to speak on the signature of 1+2. I find ortofon ones make the sound very bright and comply foam ones make the highs roll off a lot with recessed mid. Luckily, I was able to find my sweet point for it which is “small sized comply T500 with 1/4 of tip ends being cut off”. This will gives me the most linear frequency response to my ears with just enough space and treble without going bright. The mid sits right in the middle and the bass is super deep and punchy. So all my comparisons below will be done using this tip. IMO 1+2 is more suitable to more experienced and patient audiophiles that know about what sound they want. For those who don’t know or don’t want to know about the tip rolling, there is a good chance that you may love it very much or hate it very much. 


Sound: 1+2 with the right tips sounds super neutral to me from the top to the bottom. It has a very accurate sound to me. The bass can go very deep with amazing texture and very natural decay. The mids have great density and layering. It doesn’t sound forward or recessed to my ears. The treble, again super flat with great clarity and smoothness. Making the sound very transparent and airy without going to the edge in any part of the treble spectrum. The combination of low, mid and high create one of the largest spaces I have ever heard in earphones. It really manages to generate an outer hand soundstage rather the in head sound. It fooled me so many times on certain songs making me think the sound is actually really from outside. There are just not many words I can use to talk about the characters of the sound because it’s just so realistic and neutral, and truly doesn’t have any color. I am very impressed that this small universal IEM can produce a very BIG sound like speakers.

JH13: I wanted to burn in the JH13 for some more time since I just got it today and only running for like 7 hours. But JH13 has such a typical JH audio sound that I find myself confident enough to describe the sound. So any further change will be too subtle to change my opinion on its overall sound. The new FP jh13 is really something. It has its typical JH forward presentation with great clarity and smoothness. I have been having my JH16 for almost 2 years so I am very familiar to it, the new JH13 sound like a bass light version of my JH16, but better in almost every way. The bass on the new JH13 is very tight and fast with great decay and punch. The new jh13 has almost the same amount of sub-bass as JH16, which rumbles a lot! Some might like it some might find it messed up some bass light songs. The new jh13 has less mid/upper bass presentation, that makes the mids sound more neutral and forward than JH16. With that said, JH’s products still don’t present vocals very forward. It has a more pronounced upper mid/lower treble (4-10k Hz), so the instruments are thrown at you directly with all the details. This will give the presentation a very large width of soundstage, but somewhat lacking depth. JH13 does a better job in this area by adding more depth into the soundstage making the vocals less sibilant. Although JH13 has a better treble extension than JH16, the treble still rolls off quicker than it should have (about 12k, it starts to roll off).

Hidition NT6: This has been the benchmark of studio mixing type reference IEM for me. The spectrum is flat all the way, except a small hump at 11k, which takes the presentation to the brighter side to some extent. Although, it has such a liquid and smooth sound, some will find it bright period. I will not talk about it too much here. If you want to read about it you can go to average joe’s NT6 review.

SE 5 way: The best earphone I have ever heard and that still remains true till now. It’s just incredible in every way. It’s very dependent on different songs, so it really show you what the artists intended to do. The bass capacity is insane, no matter how much bass is required in the song, it will delivery. It has the resolution of the top class full sized headphones. Every time I put on any earphone after SE5, I will notice the resolution difference right away. Se5’s treble extends forever that I feel like I can even hear 19k with it. The whole presentation is just natural, musical and liquid like. It presents details in one of the cleanest and clearest ways. It feels like all the detail is delivered on a black and clean background while other earphones will need to lift brightness in order to do that. Anyways, again go to average joe’s SE5 review for more information.

1+2 vs JH13: Both sound super in their own ways. You will be impressed easily by either of them. They are both very dynamic with good speeds. The bass is equally tight and deep. 1+2 has more bass presence, so it punches a bit harder. The sub bass decay of 1+2 is faster than JH13. The mid region of 1+2 is more linear than JH13. JH13’s vocal is a bit recessed but the edge of vocal is more forward (if you know what I mean here). Also the vocals on JH13 have a bit more sibilance than the ones on 1+2. The soundstage of 1+2 is larger than Jh13’s. The depth is about the same. The detail is presented in different ways between the two. JH13 throws the detail directly in your face with great clarity. 1+2 has more transparent and airy presentation. Instrument detail is presented with great clarity but not as forward as JH13. JH13 has a unique tuning. It uses its rolled off upper treble to balanced out the forwarded lower treble, leading to a forward sounding, but with certain liquidity and smoothness. So although the presentation is forward, I still wouldn’t call JH13 bright (I will rather call it sibilant on vocals). 1+2 isn’t as forward, but has better treble extension, so it’s more linear and neutral. Both sound very smooth when well driven. For me, JH13 will be more suitable to today’s pop, electronic type of music, where as 1+2 is more capable of doing more genres.


With various tips, 1+2 can sound either worse than jh13, or better than JH13 IMO.

1+2 vs NT6: When I first put on the 1+2 with the stock tips, I find it sound almost identical to NT6. They share so many similarities. But when I switched to my “best” tips, 1+2’s treble becomes more neutral in terms of clarity, decay and brightness.

NT6 has a slightly more liquid lower treble, but as I said, its peak at 11k just make it too clear for my taste that I will have to take a rest after long period of listening. They both have very large soundstage, 1+2 has about +10% width and -10% depth.  Both have great controlled bass with 1+2 having a bit more presence. The mids are sitting at very similar positions. They are just sounding more similar than different.

1+2 vs SE5: With the best tips, 1+2 can certainly perform at the level of SE5. Technically I still think SE5 is superior due to its complexity of 5 ways crossover system. But 1+2 really keeps it up to the maximum extent. They both have incredibly bass extension. They both have the ability to create earthquake like 20hz full note. SE5 has a bit more mid/upper bass presence than 1+2. So 1+2’s bass decays a little bit faster while SE5 has a layer more of “body” to the whole sound signature. SE5’s is more mid forward than 1+2 giving SE5 fuller, denser vocals. The treble is very different between the two. Compared to se5, 1+2 has more forward treble with instantly better clarity while SE5 has more linear and extended treble that can provide the same level of clarity in another way. So as a result, 1+2 will present detail with combination of brightness and clarity where as SE5 will present detail with its extreme neutrality and resolution. The detail level is slightly higher on SE5 due to its more extended treble. The soundstages are about the same sizes for 1+2 and SE5 on poorly mixed tracks. But when it comes to well mastered songs, 1+2 surpass the soundstage width of SE5 without losing much depth. They both require large amount of healthy power to shine IMO, with SE5 being more power hungry.


These two IMO complement each other very well just like HD800 and LCD 3. 1+2 is neutral, se5 is natural, you try to tell the difference I am trying to express here. Both well balanced. I wouldn’t call SE5 dark and wouldn’t call 1+2 bright, but 1+2 is brighter than SE5. They can basically cover every genre of music you want to listen. For pop, hip hop and vocals I will pick SE5 first, and for classical and jazz, 1+2 will be the first (although they are both good on all genres).

Overall sound score (for me only):

SE 5 WAY: 98
NT6: 93
1+2: 86-96 (with good tips rolling)

JH13: 88
(JH16: 80)

Thanks for reading~

Edited by tupac0306 - 5/31/13 at 5:23pm

Thanks Lee. Insightful as always. My sweetspots in an iem are its soundstage, imaging, clarity and how it present the mids/vocals. Seems like the 1+2 outperforms the jh13 on these category... Eversince i got my IE80s, i started to despise universals, due to the tip issue; hence, i avoided the 334s and plus2.

Thanks for the feedback. Might get a pair since universals have a good resale value; in the occasion where i run into the "tip" dilemma.

On another note, got any news about the studio V refresh?
Edited by Grimtuth - 6/16/13 at 5:45am
post #4633 of 5731

The 3rd ANV is available again to my knowledge as some other headfiers have told me they recently placed their orders for them. So I suggest you contact Jack if interested.

 

Regarding tips, it's worth buying a crap load of tips and finding the ones that will do your IEMs justice. While it can be a PITA initially it will be worth it in the long run. As you mentioned universals retain higher resale value than their Custom counterparts and they are less likely to present fit issues like customs do.
 

post #4634 of 5731
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimtuth View Post

Thanks Lee. Insightful as always. My sweetspots in an iem are its soundstage, imaging, clarity and how it present the mids/vocals. Seems like the 1+2 outperforms the jh13 on these category... Eversince i got my IE80s, i started to despise universals, due to the tip issue; hence, i avoided the 334s and plus2.

Thanks for the feedback. Might get a pair since universals have a good resale value; in the occasion where i run into the "tip" dilemma.

On another note, got any news about the studio V refresh?

 

you can forget jh13 from what you say. they do some stuff like no others, but vocals isn't one of them. compared to ie80 the jh13's mediums are more leveled ofc but don't shine in any way. and I often find myself thinking that some voices lack in realism .all things considered idd, jh13 are still very nice and outperform a lot of iems. but there is something going on in the mids I'm just not good enough to know what it is.

about imaging and soundstage, I've got the old version and the freq phase one seems to give a bigger soundstage. just trust tupac on this, I usually agree with a lot of what he says.

 

lee got me curious about the 1+2 for some times now but I can't get to believe in mixing different kind of drivers, I can't help but imagine the mess at the crossover point with the differences in speed/damping/phase between the dynamic driver and the BAs. I guess that makes me a driver nazi ;)

post #4635 of 5731

Guys, the tip issues with ie80 are driving me crazy. I had several universal iems before but never had any tip issues with any of them. I cannot believe how Sennheiser did such a poor job with tip's design.  AUVIO tips are not bad but they seem to push back the mids and collapse the soundstage. I compared them to stock silicon tips and the difference in soundstage width and mids forwardness was significant. I ordered the JVC tips but I'm worried they will not sound as good as the stock tips as well. Any other tip recommendations will be greatly appreciated.

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