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Open-Back Mod for Denon D2000/5000/7000 - FR Measurements Available! - Updated 11-1-2011 - Page 3

post #31 of 328
Thread Starter 

Well, to drill the holes, I started by figuring out where the rough center was on the cups. So, on the inside of the cups, I drew straight lines connecting the four screw pegs, which crossed each other at the center point of the cups. From there, I drilled a small hole. To do this, you need to find a way to keep the cups stationary while still having space below so that you can drill through them. 

 

Next, I used a drill bit piece similar to this. The differences is that the serrated circular part made a full circle, and the serrations themselves were smaller and less pronounced (there were more teeth on the bit). It also wasn't 3", haha. I don't know the exact size I used, and I'm not even sure if it was technically a forstner bit. For this, I laid the cups on a wooden work bench (something that is meant to get beat up) with the logo facing up. I then held the cups in place while I slowly bored out a hole in the cups with that drill bit. Yes, I used my hands to hold them in place...probably not the best idea, but I still have my hands!

 

Edit: I guess the drill bit piece is technically called a hole saw of sorts.

 

After that, I used a high grit sand paper to smooth off rough parts that were left over, taking care to not scratch the cups themselves in a visible way (which I did anyway...oops). 

 

That's it! I only had access to the tools because I was staying with my parents before school started back up. I'm no expert at all with tools, so I'd imagine most people would be able to do this assuming they have the tools needed.

 

Can I ask, lee730, if you also have the earpads resting on the frame of the headphones while you have the cups off? I can't tell by your post. I personally did not like the sound of them being open if the earpads were locked in like normal. It sounded way too muddy and slow, IMO.

 

I think it would be interesting to see if there are any earpads that could be used in place of the stock ones that could still be locked in place and yet not muddy up the sound.


Edited by hans030390 - 9/19/11 at 11:12pm
post #32 of 328


No I didn't take the cups off. It doesn't seem to muddy up to sound to me though? Strange. Could this be due to my source as well? I'm using my Fiio E9 amp with a DACport LX as the DAC. Maybe I should try and loosen the ear cups and then give them a listen again. Either way it seems to have improved with the cups off. With the cups on the sound stage gets smaller, vocals, highs and mids don't have as much air to them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

Well, to drill the holes, I started by figuring out where the rough center was on the cups. So, on the inside of the cups, I drew straight lines connecting the four screw pegs, which crossed each other at the center point of the cups. From there, I drilled a small hole. To do this, you need to find a way to keep the cups stationary while still having space below so that you can drill through them. 

 

Next, I used a drill bit piece similar to this. The differences is that the serrated circular part made a full circle, and the serrations themselves were smaller and less pronounced (there were more teeth on the bit). It also wasn't 3", haha. I don't know the exact size I used, and I'm not even sure if it was technically a forstner bit. For this, I laid the cups on a wooden work bench (something that is meant to get beat up) with the logo facing up. I then held the cups in place while I slowly bored out a hole in the cups with that drill bit. Yes, I used my hands to hold them in place...probably not the best idea, but I still have my hands!

 

After that, I used a high grit sand paper to smooth off rough parts that were left over, taking care to not scratch the cups themselves in a visible way (which I did anyway...oops). 

 

That's it! I only had access to the tools because I was staying with my parents before school started back up. I'm no expert at all with tools, so I'd imagine most people would be able to do this assuming they have the tools needed.

 

Can I ask, lee730, if you also have the earpads resting on the frame of the headphones while you have the cups off? I can't tell by your post. I personally did not like the sound of them being open if the earpads were locked in like normal. It sounded way too muddy and slow, IMO.

 

I think it would be interesting to see if there are any earpads that could be used in place of the stock ones that could still be locked in place and yet not muddy up the sound.



 

post #33 of 328

I loosened the cups and I notice there's quite a bit more treble this way. Kinda makes them a bit fatiguing this way. Still sounds good though.

Edit: You have a point. I think its the bass that seems to cause this issue. The bass is quite stronger with the cups sealed in place, almost a fart kinda bass lol. Thanks, they do sound a bit better now.


Edited by lee730 - 9/18/11 at 11:53am
post #34 of 328
Thread Starter 

I'm a bit confused...what exactly have you tried doing so far with your headphones? lol

post #35 of 328

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiiancerveza View Post

Are those tostones in that pic?!?!


Why yes they are.  I was cooking for some friends and made skirt steak with chimichurri, mexican street corn, and tostones.  Not a very focused menu, but fun as hell to cook and eat.

 

I think I prefer tostones made by other people, but mine weren't bad.  The techniques are simple enough to make something impressive with a modicum of effort.

 

post #36 of 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

I'm a bit confused...what exactly have you tried doing so far with your headphones? lol


I've taken off the cups which yielded the biggest improvement. I also tried what you said and removed the  ear pads so that they aren't secure on the drivers. That also helps with the bass but it also causes sibilance with some songs. The bass is stronger when the  ear pads are firmly attached to the drivers.

 

post #37 of 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

I've compared my D2000 to the HD555 before. I was actually surprised at how similar they sounded, though my ears may not have been as good then as they are now. The HD555 sounded thinner and less exciting at the time, but I'd probably appreciate it more now if I have another chance with it. I'd imagine the HD555 will have tighter, less elevated bass in comparison. The mids on the HD555 probably won't sound as good as the HD598. Soundstage likely to be smaller by at least a bit.


 



Are you talking about the modded D2000 or stock D2000 here? I've had the HD555 (foam removed) for a few months now and just picked up a pair of D2000. To me, there is a huge difference between the stock D2000 and the HD555/595.

Also, would doing this mod negate the need to perform any part of the markl mods? I like how the D2000 sounds with slower, bass-light music, but find the bass slightly overwhelming for a lot of other things. I'm considering doing this mod to my stock cups, and picking up a spare set of D5000 or D7000 cups for when I want a closed headphone.


Edited by thrillhaus - 9/19/11 at 2:42am
post #38 of 328
Thread Starter 

Quote:

Originally Posted by lee730 View Post

I've taken off the cups which yielded the biggest improvement. I also tried what you said and removed the  ear pads so that they aren't secure on the drivers. That also helps with the bass but it also causes sibilance with some songs. The bass is stronger when the  ear pads are firmly attached to the drivers.

 


Ok, gotcha. Yeah, they can get a little bright and aggressive with the earpads resting on the frame of the headphones, but I just thought they sounded worse than stock with the cups off and the earpads secured. But, hey, personal preference!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillhaus View Post

Are you talking about the modded D2000 or stock D2000 here? I've had the HD555 (foam removed) for a few months now and just picked up a pair of D2000. To me, there is a huge difference between the stock D2000 and the HD555/595.


Also, would doing this mod negate the need to perform any part of the markl mods? I like how the D2000 sounds with slower, bass-light music, but find the bass slightly overwhelming for a lot of other things. I'm considering doing this mod to my stock cups, and picking up a spare set of D5000 or D7000 cups for when I want a closed headphone.


Stock D2000 compared with foam removal + soundstage modded HD555. I'm not saying I couldn't hear a difference. I'm just saying the difference wasn't as big as I was expecting. They had many similar qualities, but the D2000 was noticeably different in more "full" sounding songs. 

 

I'm not sure if the headphones would benefit from any of the Markl mods in combination with this one. I'm thinking about dampening my cups with acoustic foam (not Dynamat) to see if that changes anything. I'm thinking that since the Markl mods help tighten the bass, doing them with the open mod MIGHT make it too anemic, bright, and aggressive. I can't say for sure, though. I'm still planning on experimenting with my mod.

 

I would recommend just trying the open mod in the reversible way I've mentioned to see if you like it. I know the Markl mods are technically reversible, but Dynamat tends to leave a mess...

 

post #39 of 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post

Stock D2000 compared with foam removal + soundstage modded HD555. I'm not saying I couldn't hear a difference. I'm just saying the difference wasn't as big as I was expecting. They had many similar qualities, but the D2000 was noticeably different in more "full" sounding songs. 

 

I'm not sure if the headphones would benefit from any of the Markl mods in combination with this one. I'm thinking about dampening my cups with acoustic foam (not Dynamat) to see if that changes anything. I'm thinking that since the Markl mods help tighten the bass, doing them with the open mod MIGHT make it too anemic, bright, and aggressive. I can't say for sure, though. I'm still planning on experimenting with my mod.

 

I would recommend just trying the open mod in the reversible way I've mentioned to see if you like it. I know the Markl mods are technically reversible, but Dynamat tends to leave a mess...

 


I guess in terms of detail and soundstage it's not as big of a difference, which is a good thing given that I was expecting a smaller soundstage with the closed design. But the frequency response, and the tendency for the bass in the D2000 to be less tight than the HD555/595 is definitely something noticeable on fast tracks. On the flip side, the Denons also do a much better job of making you feel ambient reverberations on slower material.

 

post #40 of 328
Thread Starter 

Yeah, they do have a pretty good soundstage for a closed pair of headphones. The soundstage becomes huge when open though!

post #41 of 328

Interesting, I'm tempted to buy some wooden cups just to try this out.

post #42 of 328

Hans, have you compared this mod to the markl mod?

post #43 of 328
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by anetode View Post

Interesting, I'm tempted to buy some wooden cups just to try this out.


You don't need to buy any cups to try this out! Just take off your current cups and rest the earpads on the frame of the headphones (use the plastic pegs to lift if off the frame rather than placing them in the locking holes). Use your head to keep them in place while you listen. smily_headphones1.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillhaus View Post

Hans, have you compared this mod to the markl mod?


I have not, though I'd love to hear a pair of Markl modded D2000s to compare. I figured I would try this because it is absolutely free to try and 100% reversible. I found the results so favorable compared to my modded HD598 that I saw no need to do the Markl mod. I spent no more than $4 for this mod (just on velcro), as the hole saw I used was already available to me while visiting my family.

If anyone has a Markl modded D2000 they'd be willing to loan me, I'd more more than happy to write up a comparison.

I'm also considering loaning out my modded D2000s once I further refine the mod and have a 2nd pair of headphones on hand while they're out (waiting on some T50RPs).
post #44 of 328


Oh I forgot to note hans. I also turned down the midbass on my Denon 5000s which seemed to be the weakness with them. So when I did that mod with the cups being off it was also with eq on the midbass hump. That may be why I enjoyed the sound and you didn't. But I figured by performing the markle mode it would naturally tone down the mid bass and tighten the sub bass as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hans030390 View Post



You don't need to buy any cups to try this out! Just take off your current cups and rest the earpads on the frame of the headphones (use the plastic pegs to lift if off the frame rather than placing them in the locking holes). Use your head to keep them in place while you listen. smily_headphones1.gif



I have not, though I'd love to hear a pair of Markl modded D2000s to compare. I figured I would try this because it is absolutely free to try and 100% reversible. I found the results so favorable compared to my modded HD598 that I saw no need to do the Markl mod. I spent no more than $4 for this mod (just on velcro), as the hole saw I used was already available to me while visiting my family.

If anyone has a Markl modded D2000 they'd be willing to loan me, I'd more more than happy to write up a comparison.

I'm also considering loaning out my modded D2000s once I further refine the mod and have a 2nd pair of headphones on hand while they're out (waiting on some T50RPs).


 

post #45 of 328
Thread Starter 

Ah, yes, that probably would have something to do with it. I'd be interesting in seeing what effects the Markl mods have in combination with the headphones being open, but I'm afraid it might not mix well given that both mods seem to aim for the same thing in many ways.

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Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › Open-Back Mod for Denon D2000/5000/7000 - FR Measurements Available! - Updated 11-1-2011