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REVIEW: Ray Samuels Audio Dark Star solid state headphone amplifier - Page 16

post #226 of 372

There is always a limit. Even the class-A Krells, Mark Levinsons and Classes of the past will switch.

 

Just to add, eventually the transistor or opamp will melt from heat from the current passing through it. You can't dissipate heat fast enough. Just short their output.


Edited by wuwhere - 2/5/12 at 8:55pm
post #227 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWuss View Post


 

So, between the Cavalli Liquid Fire and the RSA Dark Star...

So far in my experience, the LF is the best amp for the HD800.  It is just flat out amazing.

But, for the HE-6, i found that i was turning the volume knob up to 3 o'clock.  so, almost enough power, but not quite...

 


cheers!

the wuss

 

<snip>

Are you using the low imp port (2) on your LF for your HE6's?

I have found that using the high imp port (1) on the LF gives me all the power I could use for my HE6's, but that is the max that the LF can handle. If I go direct from my Oppo to the LF, I really can't go much over 11 O'clock for 2Ch CD's without causing ear fatigue. Meaning that I loose my ability to hear the fine details and everything seems to get gummed up.

I don't think that this phenomenon is being caused by the LF being under powered using the HE6. I have been playing with a Stax combo SRM-727 (450V output) and a pair of SR-009's, what I am finding is that yes I can go to a little higher volume level with the Stax combo without ear fatigue. imo that is only because the SR-009's have a little less air presser than the HE6's have.

 

post #228 of 372

Quote:


Originally Posted by wuwhere View Post

There is always a limit. Even the class-A Krells, Mark Levinsons and Classes of the past will switch.

 

Just to add, eventually the transistor or opamp will melt from heat from the current passing through it. You can't dissipate heat fast enough. Just short their output.

 

Very true statement. I don't think anyone is arguing this. My post was addressing that the designer of the amp does not know what class A operation means, not commenting on whether or not the amp needs to operate in class A for its entire output capability (which may be less than you think wink.gif)

post #229 of 372


Thanks and congratulations!  The best I have so far with HD800 is a WA22 with either TS7236/RCA 6F8G(VT99)/596 or TS7236/TS 6F8G(vt99)/596.  Rigth now I am driving my HE6 from the speaker out of a fatman itube (a dared mp5 clone) with GE 5751 using WA22 as a pre-amp with GEC 6AS7G/TS 6F8G(vt99)/EML 5U4G.  To my ears, HE6 has astonishing detail and great soundstage.  The GEC does a great job in smoothen the high of HE6 while keeping all the details intact.  I enjoy both the HD800 and the HE6 very much.  I hope I can hear a LF or a Dark Star in the near future.   
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWuss View Post



i will certainly try...

first, the Peak/Volcano is not my choice for either of those headphones.  it is a splendid amp, but it leans a bit toward the cool side of neutral. 

and, as you may know, neither the HD800 nor the HE-6 mate well with a cool sounding amp.

i prefer the Peak with warmer cans like the Ultrasone, Denon, HD650, and the lot...

 

So, between the Cavalli Liquid Fire and the RSA Dark Star...

So far in my experience, the LF is the best amp for the HD800.  It is just flat out amazing.

But, for the HE-6, i found that i was turning the volume knob up to 3 o'clock.  so, almost enough power, but not quite...

 

So, i bought the Dark Star for the HE-6. 

And it works as advertized.  it is (in my humble opinion) the only headphone amp that truly kicks the HE-6's butt.

 

So, depending on which headphone you are working with, the HD800 with Liquid Fire, or the HE-6 with Dark Star, you'd have two world class rigs.

 

But, I must say - They are more alike than they are different, to be honest.

With either rig, i experience a large soundstage, smooth highs, tons of detail, tight bass, clarity, articulation...

 

i'm very very pleased with my rigs at the moment.  the hobby has come together, that's for sure...

 

cheers!

the wuss



 

post #230 of 372

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Edited by Radio_head - 2/5/12 at 10:38pm
post #231 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcg27 View Post

Quote:

 

Very true statement. I don't think anyone is arguing this. My post was addressing that the designer of the amp does not know what class A operation means, not commenting on whether or not the amp needs to operate in class A for its entire output capability (which may be less than you think wink.gif)


Yes that is surprising that Ray would say this amp is class A.

 

Radio-Head

Oh my, I never saw that one before. Maybe Ray is still pissed about blowing up his HE6's at the RMAF using his DS.

Anyway I agree with you.

I thought that the blow-up of the check was really a nice touch of class. rolleyes.gif


Edited by sillysally - 2/5/12 at 9:39pm
post #232 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuwhere View Post

There is always a limit. Even the class-A Krells, Mark Levinsons and Classes of the past will switch.

 

Just to add, eventually the transistor or opamp will melt from heat from the current passing through it. You can't dissipate heat fast enough. Just short their output.


Which Krells of the past would switch? KSA 80, KSA 150, KSA 250?      Are you talking about them switching from Class A to Class AB?    

 

post #233 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorAnt View Post


Which Krells of the past would switch? KSA 80, KSA 150, KSA 250?      Are you talking about them switching from Class A to Class AB?    

 



I had a pair of KMA-160Bs powering my Apogee Scintillas, 4 Ohm load but they drop lower than that at certain frequencies. The KMA-160Bs are the KSA-80Bs strapped to monos.

When do they switch to B? Hard to tell since I can't perceive it.

 

But from a theoretical discussion, no amp can maintain class A at their limit.

post #234 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuwhere View Post



I had a pair of KMA-160Bs powering my Apogee Scintillas, 4 Ohm load but they drop lower than that at certain frequencies. The KMA-160Bs are the KSA-80Bs strapped to monos.

When do they switch to B? Hard to tell since I can't perceive it.

 

But from a theoretical discussion, no amp can maintain class A at their limit.


I've had KSA 80. KMA 160's  KSA 150, KSA 250.  They were full on class A amps.  This is the first I've ever heard that they went into Class AB or B at any time.   Are you saying that at some point during their operation they move into class AB or B from class A?  

 

post #235 of 372

Quote:

Originally Posted by sillysally View Post


Yes that is surprising that Ray would say this amp is class A.


He did not say that. Read the quotation again as it is very carefully worded. He says that the DS is "running in" Class A. He says that it "will not switch or cross to class B due to it's capability". He then defends the validity of Class AB as a good compromise for amplifiers. (On this last point, it is not a direct concession that the DS is Class AB but the implication seems to be there.) He does not however say that the DS is Class A topology.

 


Edited by cooperpwc - 2/6/12 at 12:22am
post #236 of 372
Quote:
Originally Posted by WarriorAnt View Post


I've had KSA 80. KMA 160's  KSA 150, KSA 250.  They were full on class A amps.  This is the first I've ever heard that they went into Class AB or B at any time.   Are you saying that at some point during their operation they move into class AB or B from class A?  

 



If you are asserting that Krell class A amps are class A up to their limit, they probably are. No discussion, my bad.

post #237 of 372

I'm just curious about the information on how the amps operate.  Curious about at what point during the operation of the amps do they fall out of class A?    There was a mod on the later Krells, the KSA 150 and the 250 where if you sent the amps back to Krell they would mod them to standby in class AB until class A was required.  They made that mod because the amps ran way too hot and used way too much electricity just running idle in class A all the time.  I never had mine modded.   So I'm curious as to what the limit of their operation was without that mod and when or if it occurs during their operation.  You're statement made it seem as if you knew something about that.

post #238 of 372

You have to know how transistor works. And how signals are amplified by transistors. And why they have big heat sinks for heat dissipation. Class A amps are not that hard to design, there are cook book online explaining how to make them.

post #239 of 372

Warrior, you do know how transistor works right? After all you know a lot about class-A amps?

post #240 of 372

Actually I do know something about class A amps I just don't think the limit your talking about is significant or that it happens long enough to say the amps are dropping out of class A action.  I mean its just theoretical right.  Whats the time duration?  Is it long enough to say the amps are really not in Class A or working in Class A?

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