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Colorfly CK4 first review - Page 16

post #226 of 249

I tried to break the file down but the computer was being odd and wouldn't do it, I didn't mean to leave the card as NTFS. I just needed to move a big file to a new hard drive.

 

But having it formatted to FAT32 hasn't helped still plays up, so I usually just stick my most listened to albums on the player.

 

I like sandisk memory cards so can't be bothered in buying a new one to try.

 

But don't get me wrong, I love this player.

post #227 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiman View Post

I tried to break the file down but the computer was being odd and wouldn't do it, I didn't mean to leave the card as NTFS. I just needed to move a big file to a new hard drive.

 

But having it formatted to FAT32 hasn't helped still plays up, so I usually just stick my most listened to albums on the player.

 

I like sandisk memory cards so can't be bothered in buying a new one to try.

 

But don't get me wrong, I love this player.


Hmm did you use Winrar to break the file down? Maybe try give that a shot. Maybe even run the program as administrator...

post #228 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAFA View Post

 

Well maybe this is just some kind of psychological anchoring effect, but I felt the same, yet with different music. I got mine second hand from some guy on ebay, however he had some music preloaded. I listened mine from the sd card. Every time I listened to his music, I thought "wow this sound is awesome" and when I listened to mine from the SD, I asked myself to what crappy music (recent pop r'n'b) am I listening.

 

While programming around my STM32 board, also to play music (still in the beginning stages), I know during playback small chunks of music are played.... I assume that the cluster size of the SD-Card must be the same as the one in the CK4.

 

CK4+ = 4096 Bytes

 

"Ugly" sounding Class 4 SDcard (32GB) = 16 kiloBytes

 

"Good" sounding Class 2 SDcard (8GB) = 4096 Bytes

 

BUUUUUUT, I will have to listen again tonight, to evaluate this again, because I am not yet confident in this. goodvibes could be right, that it could be a SD-hardware implementation issue. My bet is on the Software, but like I said not yet 100% confident.

 

H20, please reformat (slow mode) your SD to 4096Bytes and try again, so we can confirm my thesis and live on happily :D

 

I've been listening for a little while actively trying to find a difference, but I don't hear one. I suspect a bandwidth issue, because with 32kb clusters my card sounds fine. It's a UHS1 card, ie. class 10 on speed. The same type of card in my android device benchmarks at read speeds between 300Mb/s and 500Mb/s. I suspect changing to 4096B is putting your cards read speeds up in this particular device. Or you guys have unluckily picked up a defective device?

post #229 of 249

I have now changed to 4096 just to see if there's any change, after everyone else has gone to bed in the house (minimum outside noise) I will sit and try again to find any differences.


 

But for those of you suffering from this, have you tried aligning the memory access? Here

http://www.thriveforums.org/forum/toshiba-thrive-general-discussions/15040-sd-card-issues-problems-solutions.html


 

Should improve speeds, might help a bit.


Edited by yblad - 6/6/13 at 1:44pm
post #230 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by yblad View Post

I've been listening for a little while actively trying to find a difference, but I don't hear one. I suspect a bandwidth issue, because with 32kb clusters my card sounds fine. It's a UHS1 card, ie. class 10 on speed. The same type of card in my android device benchmarks at read speeds between 300Mb/s and 500Mb/s. I suspect changing to 4096B is putting your cards read speeds up in this particular device. Or you guys have unluckily picked up a defective device?

My CK4 is currently in need of a new battery, however last I checked it still sounded slightly different from the internal / external memory. Very hard to explain, anything you have read me mention in these pages is what happens, if you don't hear it though that's great, my unit could be defective, but one needs to take in the small, small tiny difference I was hearing, as I said I really believe some people won't pick up on it.

In the end I still use CK4 from the microsd with line out and I'm happy, I don't use the internal memory anymore because I also find the external memory although less dynamic, I hear it having more air in the presentation. It's a crazy crazy problem I've never been able to solve, but to me it's not placebo, it's not my mind playing tricks, I think I can hear a difference.
post #231 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by H20Fidelity View Post


My CK4 is currently in need of a new battery, however last I checked it still sounded slightly different from the internal / external memory. Very hard to explain, anything you have read me mention in these pages is what happens, if you don't hear it though that's great, my unit could be defective, but one needs to take in the small, small tiny difference I was hearing, as I said I really believe some people won't pick up on it.

In the end I still use CK4 from the microsd with line out and I'm happy, I don't use the internal memory anymore because I also find the external memory although less dynamic, I hear it having more air in the presentation. It's a crazy crazy problem I've never been able to solve, but to me it's not placebo, it's not my mind playing tricks, I think I can hear a difference.

I'm not suggesting it is a placebo or anything, and you have had more time with the device than I have. I've only had a day with it with an sd card inside it. But so far I can't hear the difference. I'm normally pretty good at picking up small differences, there have been a couple of occasions where I've heard something just a little off and after investigated found my sound drivers had gotten damaged. I just don't hear it. I just suspect that there may be something different between our set ups, whether that be in the sd card itself or in the ck4.


 

Or it could just be that I need to spend more time with it. Do you find the change to be less or more so when running from the headphone out? I haven’t amped it yet, could be that if it's a small difference it's being brought forward by a decent amp.

 

EDIT: The fact that I haven't had all that long to get used to the sound signature yet may be stopping me hearing it. If it was on my old DAP I could pick up the most tiny change in the tracks I’ve spent years hearing on the device. I can't say I'm certain I have the same level of acuity with something this new to me.


Edited by yblad - 6/6/13 at 5:10pm
post #232 of 249
What you want to do is load the same file/song onto the internal and external memory, (preferably something with strong vocal presence) because that's where it's easier detectable, then switch between them listening just to the intro, say the first 10 - 15 seconds from the headphone out at a decent volume. Listen for the vocals, I find the internal memory sounds more dynamic and there's slightly more detail, you will hear deeper into the singers vocal notes, I did this in a dead silent room laying down, the amount of times I went back and forth almost drove me crazy. tongue.gif

When you amp the line out though the problem is much less obvious to me, in the end I just forgot about it as the majority of storage space wins, even stranger after a month or two when I'd switch back to play the crazy game I enjoy the external memory as it feels more airy and less congested. Maybe I just convinced myself that was the case? I don't know, we can't narrow out the possible cause my unit being a lemon either.

It's a strange one, that consumed many hours of my listening time. smily_headphones1.gif
Edited by H20Fidelity - 6/6/13 at 5:14pm
post #233 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by H20Fidelity View Post

What you want to do is load the same file/song onto the internal and external memory, (preferably something with strong vocal presence) because that's where it's easier detectable, then switch between them listening just to the intro, say the first 10 - 15 seconds from the headphone out at a decent volume. Listen for the vocals, I find the internal memory sounds more dynamic and there's slightly more detail, you will hear deeper into the singers vocal notes, I did this in a dead silent room laying down, the amount of times I went back and forth almost drove me crazy. tongue.gif

When you amp the line out though the problem is much less obvious to me, in the end I just forgot about it as the majority of storage space wins, even stranger after a month or two when I'd switch back to play the crazy game I enjoy the external memory as it feels more airy and less congested. Maybe I just convinced myself that was the case? I don't know, we can't narrow out the possible cause my unit being a lemon either.

It's a strange one, that consumed many hours of my listening time. smily_headphones1.gif

 

I did the switching over on the same file, BUT I haven't yet had a shot to do this in the dead of night when i can really focus and there is no other sound leaking in. I was going to tonight, but a migraine decided to come along instead. For now I'm keeping my flac/wav files on the internal and my back collection of older files on the external just in case.

 

Who knows with these things, even if it is a placebo effect I don't think it really matters. It effects your real perception either way, and that still changes your listening experience. After I've had a shot at spending a few hours with it in the dark and quiet I'll report back.

post #234 of 249

Guys, did we ever get a solution for the clicking on tracks at 172kHz and 192kHz? Or was that one of colorfly's broken "we'll make a new firmware, honest" promises?

post #235 of 249

Ok so I've opened a dialogue with colorfly about the 192kHz issue. So far they have completely evasive and basically said "The product is aimed at China, go away" and "But it sounds fine at 44.1kHz therefore we don't have to fix it" and "but it costs less than the c4" as if any of those justify them lying to us about the specification. Desperately grasping at straws to avoid answering the simple question "Will you provide the promised firmware update to bring the product to specification and give your customers what they paid for?".


 

I expect this to be a long and arduous exchange of emails. I will let you all know when I finally manage to pin down a proper answer from them.

post #236 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by H20Fidelity View Post


Need to be amped though IMO. wink.gif

And if you get one don't update the firmware, it messes up the battery meter slighty and won't show full after a charge instead 3/4, I can't revert back either.

 

 

Only just read this, I thought it was just me and was going crazy thinking the darn thing wasn't charging right. It goes up to full every now and then, but not for long. In your experience does it actually damage battery life at all or just the battery status reading? I know you said you were going to try and swap the battery because you thought it was going down fast.


Edited by yblad - 6/17/13 at 1:42pm
post #237 of 249
I think it just effects the meter, not the performance. Just a faulty reading.
post #238 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by yblad View Post

Ok so I've opened a dialogue with colorfly about the 192kHz issue. So far they have completely evasive and basically said "The product is aimed at China, go away" and "But it sounds fine at 44.1kHz therefore we don't have to fix it" and "but it costs less than the c4" as if any of those justify them lying to us about the specification. Desperately grasping at straws to avoid answering the simple question "Will you provide the promised firmware update to bring the product to specification and give your customers what they paid for?".


 

I expect this to be a long and arduous exchange of emails. I will let you all know when I finally manage to pin down a proper answer from them.

Afraid this is useless. After my CK4 got bricked one day I learned much about the stuff inside.

Though the CS4398 DAC can handle up to 24bit/192kHz the master chip can't.

Colorfly are smart guys wink_face.gif you can see they use their master chip remarked to MASTER. What is the chip actually? It is Rockchip RK2729 in LQFP176 package.

The Master provides decoding and processing for I2C input of the CS4398. According to the datasheet from Rockchip -

http://wenku.baidu.com/view/8c345c6925c52cc58bd6be4f

the RK2729 can go as far as 16bit/96kHz. 


Edited by Kistenev - 8/19/13 at 1:06pm
post #239 of 249
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kistenev View Post

Afraid this is useless. After my CK4 got bricked one day I learned much about the stuff inside.

Though the CS4398 DAC can handle up to 24bit/192kHz the master chip can't.

Colorfly are smart guys wink_face.gif you can see they use their master chip remarked to MASTER. What is the chip actually? It is Rockchip RK2729 in LQFP176 package.

The Master provides decoding and processing for I2C input of the CS4398. According to the datasheet from Rockchip -

http://wenku.baidu.com/view/8c345c6925c52cc58bd6be4f

the RK2729 can go as far as 16bit/96kHz. 

That'll explain why they outright refuse to deal with the issue then. I ended up having a rather interesting argument with one of the most senior people in the company, in which he accused all of us who aren't in China who own a ck4 of having stolen from the company. Lesson learnt, Colorfly wilfully lie to their customers and couldn't care less about us if they tried. The player even has emblazoned on it's casing that it handles 24bit/192kHz


 

It's such a shame because I love this player. It's still one of my favourite devices. But knowing that money went to them makes me feel a little sick.


 

Thanks for the information. There must be something a little different going on though because the ck4 can handle 24bit/96kHz fine.

post #240 of 249

It has now been confirmed by a supplier that the Colorfly CK4 is indeed playing 24/192 WAV-files (not flac) but that the 24/192 is downsampled to 16/98 due to the Rockchip RK2729. So the output from CK4 is never 24 bits, but maximum 16. This is difficult to see in the published tech specs.

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