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What causes this (amp related)? - Page 12  

post #166 of 178
I assume that since this problem only showed up on the K701, it wasn't picked up by the Schitt design/test team in the first place. While the were aware of the DC offset at turn off, it doesn't seem to be as drastic on other headphones.
post #167 of 178

Its still got roughly the same problem with any dynamic headphone, its just more dramatic with the 701's clearly visible dome.

 

Its not like they don't have 701s there or something either.  They're great with the Valhalla but they never plugged them into the Asgard?

post #168 of 178

130335777151.gif

This is what I thought of when the driver did that....the horror*click, is .gif*

post #169 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickronin View Post

While it is nice that Schiit is updating their products with the appropriate safety relays and offering a retrofit for existing amps, there's still a question that needs to be asked.

 

How or why did it get put into production with out it in the first place?

If you'll read back in this thread, you'll see that there are other amps by other manufacturers that are made also without protection, because doing so provides potentially better sound and higher reliability.  I'm not going to have either one of my amps upgraded because I would rather have the best possible sound and the best possible reliability for my dollar.  That's my personal choice.
 

 

post #170 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwkarth View Post



If you'll read back in this thread, you'll see that there are other amps by other manufacturers that are made also without protection, because doing so provides potentially better sound and higher reliability.  I'm not going to have either one of my amps upgraded because I would rather have the best possible sound and the best possible reliability for my dollar.  That's my personal choice.
 

 

So I presume from your statement that you're also then going to have all of the volume controls and selector switches removed from your audio equipment as well? After all, those components are of a far bigger potential detriment than a signal relay.

 

Additionally, it's also worth noting that many other "unprotected" amps exhibit no meaningful shutdown transients. For example, I have personally measured the amp I'm listening to right now and it consistently has shutdown transients in the single-digit-millivolt range that take 5-7ms to die out. If you design the circuit to be relatively stable during shutdown, then experimentally verify on the prototypes, and then verify again on a production sample, it's a reasonable thing to leave out. Unfortunately, in this case, we have an amp which two production example of are exhibiting high amplitude, long duration transients that are well in excess of the hazardous level as specified by AKG. 

post #171 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post

So I presume from your statement that you're also then going to have all of the volume controls and selector switches removed from your audio equipment as well? After all, those components are of a far bigger potential detriment than a signal relay.

 

Additionally, it's also worth noting that many other "unprotected" amps exhibit no meaningful shutdown transients. For example, I have personally measured the amp I'm listening to right now and it consistently has shutdown transients in the single-digit-millivolt range that take 5-7ms to die out. If you design the circuit to be relatively stable during shutdown, then experimentally verify on the prototypes, and then verify again on a production sample, it's a reasonable thing to leave out. Unfortunately, in this case, we have an amp which two production example of are exhibiting high amplitude, long duration transients that are well in excess of the hazardous level as specified by AKG. 

Perhaps you're being presumptuous.

 

Well, it's nice that you now have a choie between best possible sound and reliability or completely thought free operation.  I've made my choice and now you can make yours.  Time to move on.
 

 

post #172 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwkarth View Post



Well, it's nice that you now have a choie between best possible sound and reliability or completely thought free operation.  I've made my choice and now you can make yours.  Time to move on.
 

 

Your choice just happens to be wrong or at least logically inconsistent. The list of things you aren't doing (well, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you're sane and not OCD) that have a bigger sonic impact than a single signal relay is just nearly endless. You're spazzing over a leak in a window while you've left every door open. While it's also fine for you to decide you don't care, it's not so good for you to be trying to give other people the impression that this isn't a big deal and something they need to correct on their own systems.
 

 

post #173 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post

Your choice just happens to be wrong or at least logically inconsistent. The list of things you aren't doing (well, I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you're sane and not OCD) that have a bigger sonic impact than a single signal relay is just nearly endless. You're spazzing over a leak in a window while you've left every door open. While it's also fine for you to decide you don't care, it's not so good for you to be trying to give other people the impression that this isn't a big deal and something they need to correct on their own systems.

Your opinion is of no consequence to me.  I would suggest you take your argument elsewhere.
 

 

post #174 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwkarth View Post

If you'll read back in this thread, you'll see that there are other amps by other manufacturers that are made also without protection, because doing so provides potentially better sound and higher reliability.  I'm not going to have either one of my amps upgraded because I would rather have the best possible sound and the best possible reliability for my dollar.  That's my personal choice.

 

So?  If they have as serious of an on/off thump/transient/whatever as the Asgard then I'll ask the same question about them too.

post #175 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickronin View Post

So?  If they have as serious of an on/off thump/transient/whatever as the Asgard then I'll ask the same question about them too.

Go right ahead.
 

 

post #176 of 178

That guy is a known troublemaker. He seems to be making it a full-time job to discredit other companies and designers but the most amusing thing is when confronted about his credentials, he fails to answer every single time. 

 

http://www.amb.org/forum/mini3-portable-headphone-amplifier-f16/somebody-isnt-happy-t1094.html

 

 

 

 

 

post #177 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by K3cT View Post

That guy is a known troublemaker. He seems to be making it a full-time job to discredit other companies and designers but the most amusing thing is when confronted about his credentials, he fails to answer every single time. 

 

http://www.amb.org/forum/mini3-portable-headphone-amplifier-f16/somebody-isnt-happy-t1094.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well...this is just a guy who publish thorough reviews of devices. Sometimes he likes them and sometimes he does not.

 

But everytime any single claim is backed by data. I fail to see what the problem is (Unless you happen to make money out of the devices that he review im which case i'd love to see no trace of anything bad that he measured).

 

In my view this is not a troublemaker. He is just guy with some background and the right to differ i guess.

 

And even if he fail to show his credentials i don't often see his measurements refuted in anyway with hard data. Just bashing on his attitude.

 

Actually i think that guys like him are a great assett for the community because he challenges designers and manufacturers thus they'd likely should raise the level of the game instead of relying just on marketing. In other words he can get to places where average joes like me can not and makes us less vulnerable to marketing.

 

I think that some designers attitude towards critics is not encouraging for customers. I'd like to see some other attitude like we'll fare better next time thanks for the input. But our current device is quite good as it is (Backing it with the strong hard data regarding the design. No device is bad at everything). Getting defensive by attacking the critic is quite sad in my view.

 

Just my 0.02

 


 

 


Edited by elfary - 7/21/11 at 2:06am
post #178 of 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by elfary View Post

Well...this is just a guy who publish thorough reviews of devices. Sometimes he likes them and sometimes he does not.

 

But everytime any single claim is backed by data. I fail to see what the problem is (Unless you happen to make money out of the devices that he review im which case i'd love to see no trace of anything bad that he measured).

 

In my view this is not a troublemaker. He is just guy with some background and the right to differ i guess.

 

And even if he fail to show his credentials i don't often see his measurements refuted in anyway with hard data. Just bashing on his attitude.

 

Actually i think that guys like him are a great assett for the community because he challenges designers and manufacturers thus they'd likely should raise the level of the game instead of relying just on marketing. In other words he can get to places where average joes like me can not and makes us less vulnerable to marketing.

I'm going to close this thread since productive discussion seems to have ended.  Keep in mind that there was only one person besides the OP who bothered to make any measurements and post them and it wasn't the guy to whom you refer.  Schiit Audio has stepped up and offered to modify or refund any outstanding Asgards.  What more could anyone ask?
 

 

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