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Bit Perfect Streaming in W7 - How do I get it?

post #1 of 15
7/13/11 at 3:13am
Thread Starter 

I've just ordered my first standalone USB/DAC, an HRT and while trawling through various forums I have come the conclusion that I need a data flow to this device that is not adulterated in any way to get the best sound from my new purchase. Along the way terms such as kernel streaming, ASIO and WASAPI have come to the fore as a way of doing this. I have a paid version of Winamp and am currently running a Nuforce uDAC -2.

 

I've read threads that suggest that just having this DAC/amp plugged into my USB port will give me a straight flow of data from the HD without any mixing or other alterations to the sound but I'm still not sure.

 

So what do I do? Just plug it in when it arrives and know that this is the best I will hear or do I need to install plugins from the above mentioned? My OS is Win7 Home Premium.

 

Thanks for your input

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post #2 of 15
7/14/11 at 12:17am

foobar2000 + WASAPI works for me.

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post #3 of 15
7/14/11 at 5:30am

Since you already have a paid license of Winamp, you can just get a WASAPI output plugin and you'll be all set. There are a few available, so try and see what works best for you:

http://maiko.elementfx.com/

http://adionsoft.net/winampwasapi/

 

Just remember to have C++ 2008 libraries updated.

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post #4 of 15
7/15/11 at 3:44am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roller View Post

Since you already have a paid license of Winamp, you can just get a WASAPI output plugin and you'll be all set. There are a few available, so try and see what works best for you:

http://maiko.elementfx.com/

http://adionsoft.net/winampwasapi/

 

Just remember to have C++ 2008 libraries updated.

Thank you Roller. I've just installed WASAPI into Winamp and I think that I'm hearing (in fact I am sure) things from my music I've never heard before. This is so much more detailed and maybe my newly acquired (but previously enjoyed) HD580s have really started to sing. I used the Maiko version and the only thing I can't do is make it exclusively control the device. Should I bother?

 

Here is what the plugin is reporting

 

Input stream:
24 bit PCM encoding in 2.0 (Stereo) setup. 44100Hz rate
MAIKO buffer/latency: 0 samples (0 µs)

Output stream:
32 bit float PCM encoding in 2.0 (Stereo) setup. 44100Hz rate
Client buffer: 21168 samples (480000 µs)
Client latency: 11610 µs
Mixer scheduling period (latency): 10000 µs
Minimum device period (latency): 3000 µs

Shared mode renderer

Plugin latency reported to Winamp: 480 ms
Peak output loudness detected: -0.672196 db

 

Is there anything I should change? At the moment I'm running this with my uDAC2 as the preferred device. I only have this set to run in 2 channel 16bit 44.1KHz mode. Should I set the uDAC to 24/96 or won't this matter?

 

How do I check if I need to update the C++ 2008 libraries? If it's sounding good will I need to bother

 

Finally, if the HRT MSII is meant to sound even better than the uDAC maybe I am in for a real treat when it arrives.

 

 

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post #5 of 15
7/15/11 at 9:37am

You shouldn't worry about setting it to exclusive mode, as you can just disable system sounds, and you'll have sound as it if was on exclusive mode.

 

Also, if you only have 16/44.1 content, then you wouldn't have that much of necessity to change the output format to 24/96. Still, you could indeed set it to 24/96, and play some music to see if it changes the output format automatically. Also, another reason to have it above 16/44.1 is because there are plenty of 48KHz content out there, even if it's just 16bits.

 

About C++ libraries, you don't have to worry about them because things are already running. If they weren't, then you would need to install them, but that's not the case.

 

Glad that you're enjoying the sound your system has. Winamp isn't as used or talked about as other players, but it can perform very well nonetheless.

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post #6 of 15
7/15/11 at 3:16pm
Thread Starter 

Thanks very much for all your comments and suggestions. It has certainly opened up a new world of sound on my PC for me. I have a good HiFi system and now that I am forced to do a lot of listening via my PC at home and also much of the time with headphones I am really surprised at what this simple tweak has done.

 

My work laptop is XP pro and if I'm right you can't get Wasapi for that even if I installed my Winamp Pro on it? When My HRT Music Streamer II arrives I'll be taking my uDAC2 to work which I know will make a difference and I'll be using my Shure SRH840s there.

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post #7 of 15
7/15/11 at 3:21pm

Indeed. It doesn't take that much effort to improve the PC listening experience. And don't look down on the PC as a listening medium, as it can be a very high quality playback device, as long as you set it all up properly.

 

And you're right, XP doesn't support WASAPI, that's a Vista/7 exclusive feature. The best way to run audio in a similar way is through ASIO, but that requires either manufacturer drivers with ASIO support or third party ASIO wrappers.

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post #8 of 15
7/15/11 at 3:40pm

On XP Kernel Streaming is great but, sadly it doesn't always work (e.g. on my laptop I can't get it to work with the 2 USB soundcards I got).

On my desktop it works flawlessly though (Xonar DS). 

Otherwise ASIO or ASIO4ALL may do the trick. 

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post #9 of 15
7/15/11 at 4:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalston View Post

On XP Kernel Streaming is great but, sadly it doesn't always work (e.g. on my laptop I can't get it to work with the 2 USB soundcards I got).

On my desktop it works flawlessly though (Xonar DS). 

Otherwise ASIO or ASIO4ALL may do the trick. 



Lol, how could I have forgotten Kernel Streaming confused.gif But you're right, Kernel Streaming has its fair share of issues, which is why I still say ASIO is a better option, but both should be tried as one might yield better results than the other.

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post #10 of 15
7/16/11 at 8:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roller View Post

You shouldn't worry about setting it to exclusive mode, as you can just disable system sounds, and you'll have sound as it if was on exclusive mode.


I'm pretty sure this is incorrect. Exclusive mode doesn't just "mute" system sounds, it bypasses the windows mixer entirely. Shared mode does not. It's the windows mixer that wrecks the sound quality.

 

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post #11 of 15
7/16/11 at 9:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveBSC View Post




I'm pretty sure this is incorrect. Exclusive mode doesn't just "mute" system sounds, it bypasses the windows mixer entirely. Shared mode does not. It's the windows mixer that wrecks the sound quality.

 


 

Actually, if there is no user created sound events on shared mode, sound will come out as clean as on exclusive mode.

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post #12 of 15
7/16/11 at 10:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roller View Post

Actually, if there is no user created sound events on shared mode, sound will come out as clean as on exclusive mode.


Hmm. Regardless, I don't see the point in leaving it in shared mode, when exclusive does the work for you. I would not want to be listening while working, and be assaulted in the middle of a song by some flash ad on a website.

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post #13 of 15
7/16/11 at 10:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveBSC View Post




Hmm. Regardless, I don't see the point in leaving it in shared mode, when exclusive does the work for you. I would not want to be listening while working, and be assaulted in the middle of a song by some flash ad on a website.



:) I understand where you're going with that. The thing is that there are many people who want to have the same output as WASAPI on exclusive mode, and be able to have other sounds available if need be. Not to mention that apps other than the one using WASAPI output often need to be restarted, which is inconvenient. And considering that apps have individual volume/mute controls, that flash ad issue could be worked around, not to mention NoScript, AdBlock, etc.


Edited by Roller - 7/16/11 at 10:36am
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post #14 of 15
7/17/11 at 1:50pm
Thread Starter 

I can't get exclusive mode to work for me anyway. I'm using the Maiko plugin - maybe the Adion plugin will do it.

 

No matter at the moment anyway. I'm off out west for 9 days with about 100 Year 6 students for their Australian Outback experience - not much chance of getting to listen to anything in those circumstances! When I get back my HRT MSII and the Fiio E9 will both have arrived and I'll report back on this thread. Many thanks to everyone so far for their help and advice.

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post #15 of 15
7/18/11 at 2:47am
Thread Starter 

OK, the HRT has arrived and there is a major problem which I am hoping someone can solve. When I boot up I always disconnect my uDAC because if I don't I get a static ticking sound through my phones which makes listening pointless. The HRT does the same but even if I boot up with it disconnected I still get the sound and despite using all the USB ports on my PC it won't go away.

 

The ticking sound doesn't happen until the music starts to play and I have no idea what is causing it. I removed all the other USB devices and it makes no difference. Does anyhone have a solution. This doesn't happen on my laptop!

 

All advice appreciated.

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