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post #226 of 607

Solude, Will you be writing up a comparative review to the W4S?

post #227 of 607

Nothing official.  I'm what you might call burnt out ;)  I feel the Metrum is better everywhere unless you want a more aggressive, read shouty compared to the Metrum.  Which is not something I would have thought of the W4S before.  But even though the Metrum is $1100 to the W4S its missing the ability to configure anything, no USB, no frills of any kind.  With the Peak its not too bad but on an amp with a stepped it would probably not go over too good.

 

The step 'up' from the DAC-2 to the Octave is about on par as the Octave fed from my onboard toslink to the AP2.  But for the comparison I ran both with the AP2.

 

My next DACs will likely be the PS PWD2 or the Schiit Statement and the matching amp.  The Mjolnir was freaking awesome for the price, an all out assault should best a lot of amps regardless of price.  I have not heard their DAC but that it won't have USB and my AP2 won't be collection dust is kind of nice.  This assumes I keep the AP2.  I've considered seeing if the entry products like the m2tech or MusicalFidelity would be as good.  I would assume XMOS products have better drivers of nothing else.

post #228 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Nothing official.  I'm what you might call burnt out ;)  I feel the Metrum is better everywhere unless you want a more aggressive, read shouty compared to the Metrum.  Which is not something I would have thought of the W4S before.  But even though the Metrum is $1100 to the W4S its missing the ability to configure anything, no USB, no frills of any kind.  With the Peak its not too bad but on an amp with a stepped it would probably not go over too good.

 

The step 'up' from the DAC-2 to the Octave is about on par as the Octave fed from my onboard toslink to the AP2.  But for the comparison I ran both with the AP2.

 

My next DACs will likely be the PS PWD2 or the Schiit Statement and the matching amp.  The Mjolnir was freaking awesome for the price, an all out assault should best a lot of amps regardless of price.  I have not heard their DAC but that it won't have USB and my AP2 won't be collection dust is kind of nice.  This assumes I keep the AP2.  I've considered seeing if the entry products like the m2tech or MusicalFidelity would be as good.  I would assume XMOS products have better drivers of nothing else.

Completely understandable. haha.

 

I think once you hit the PS PWD2, you'll stop. It's a very, very good DAC.

Statement stuff is interesting and NAD seems compelling enough.

 

Always enjoy your reviews. Sounds like the Octave is a good performer, it's just

too bad you won't be keeping it around long. wink_face.gif

post #229 of 607

Do I ever :D  When I put the DAC-2 for sale I went looking for my sales receipt and went 'Really, I've only had this since late march? Really? Esh, feels longer.'  At least it wasn't weeks or days like a lot of my other buys :p  The PWD2 is a hard cookie to buy though, prices are all over and most come with the bridge which is utterly useless to me.  The one that came up as an MkII and no bridge was sold in hours :(

post #230 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

With the Peak its not too bad but on an amp with a stepped it would probably not go over too good.

 

Hello Solude, I happen to be an owner of both Metrum Octave DAC and the Burson Soloist amp (which I believe you've used), and I wonder if these two gears are a good match. I use the Octave with Stello U3 (USB-to-S/PDIF converter like your AP2).

 

Why would you say that the Octave would not be so good when paired with an amp with a stepped? By stepped, are you talking about a stepped volume attenuator, like the Soloist is? Although I believe that Peak would still be superior to the Soloist given the price gap, is there a particular reason why this tube amp would be create better synergy with the Octave, than a solid state amp which uses a stepped volume attenutator? Your answer would be very much appreciated. 

post #231 of 607

Soloist is an exception because it has gain settings ;)  High gain, stepped and 2V input... rough life.

post #232 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Soloist is an exception because it has gain settings ;)  High gain, stepped and 2V input... rough life.

 

Exception, huh? Please excuse my ignorance, but I don't know much about how to compare specs between source components and amps to see whether they are a good match... Exactly what aspect of Metrum Octave makes it a relatively undesirable combination with amps with stepped volume attenuator in general? What do you mean by, "high gain, stepped and 2V input, rough life?"

 

Also, I normally have my Soloist at low gain setting, because my Fostex TH900 headphones are highly sensitive (unlike orthos like Audez'e or Hifiman), and because I get a cleaner sound with wider soundstage at lower gain setting (Even Headfonia agrees with this http://www.headfonia.com/headfonia-tips-keep-your-amps-at-low-gain/). Are you saying that it would still be better if I were to use it in high gain setting, even if it's overkill for my TH900?

post #233 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Do I ever :D  When I put the DAC-2 for sale I went looking for my sales receipt and went 'Really, I've only had this since late march? Really? Esh, feels longer.'  At least it wasn't weeks or days like a lot of my other buys :p  The PWD2 is a hard cookie to buy though, prices are all over and most come with the bridge which is utterly useless to me.  The one that came up as an MkII and no bridge was sold in hours :(

I agree the bridge is useless, but I guess it's a cool feature. Does this mean you're on the lookout for one? I just got the Schiit Gungnir, as I'm holding out for the statement and

don't feel it's going to be released this year. The PWD2 has wowed me every time I've heard it (about 5 separate occasions), but I haven't had the chance to take one home for an audition.

 

Although honestly your steps seem sideways if not downwards.(more-ly based on pricing, but also expectation) Meaning W4SDac-2 -> Octave -> PW. Seems like you need a middle ground, 

like perhaps the NAD or Calyx. Anyways, looking forward to impressions on a PW. We have similar taste: I.e. non hyperbole: i.e. Liquid Fire sucking for the price, etc.

post #234 of 607

No no.  Although high gain does mean lower negative feedback.

 

Here is what I meant.  The W4S has a variable output function so you can dial in the output level to your amp.  In my case, the Peak has a pretty high gain at 23dB so I dropped the W4S output to 1V so I have more sweep room.

 

At 2V, 9 o'clock is loud, 11 o'clock is unbearable and thats with the LCD-3.

 

If the Peak used a stepped attenuator, I'd only have 1-3 usable steps, which would suck.  This is where the W4S features are nice, where the Metrum is stuck at 2V.

post #235 of 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

No no.  Although high gain does mean lower negative feedback.

 

Here is what I meant.  The W4S has a variable output function so you can dial in the output level to your amp.  In my case, the Peak has a pretty high gain at 23dB so I dropped the W4S output to 1V so I have more sweep room.

 

At 2V, 9 o'clock is loud, 11 o'clock is unbearable and thats with the LCD-3.

 

If the Peak used a stepped attenuator, I'd only have 1-3 usable steps, which would suck.  This is where the W4S features are nice, where the Metrum is stuck at 2V.

 

Oh, so you're saying, Octave's output is fixed at 2V, so having a stepped attenuator would give me less freedom of precise volume control. Then again, the Soloist has multiple gain settings, so I can compensate for Metrum's lack of variable output function by taking advantage of the gain settings. Theory-wise, I would have a  better precise volume control at low gain setting, right?

 

Also, could you explain what "lower negative feedback" means?

post #236 of 607

Now you got it.

 

Feedback is a means of sending the output back to the input in a loop, ie feedback.  The higher the feedback, the lower the gain.  So the more output you send back to the input, the less power you get.  Which is why in part that no negative feedback designs are typically high gain.

post #237 of 607

Liking the positive reviews of the Octave over the WFS DAC-2. Curra scared me a few pages back saying the Octave is a little too hot for the 009 setup - but later said it to be invalid. 

 

Is there a general consensus of the Octave synergy with the 009? I won't be replacing my DAC until long after my Stax rig is complete. Needs to be a very solid pairing. 

 

Also, I keep seeing reports of the Octave being a tad bass-shy at times. Is that generally accepted? 

post #238 of 607

The Octave is tonally balanced and has good attack but people tend to prefer dark sources or amps with the 009.  Its not what you would call a plays nice DAC though.  It benefits from a good feed where others have more advanced receivers that are less finicky about input to deliver output.

 

That's code for feed it crap spdif and get meh analog output.  But I have the LCD-3 so its pretty hard to be completely bass shy or bright ;)

post #239 of 607

The DAC-2 would probably be a better match since its darker overall while also punchier.  That said, those that prefer the 007MkI tend to say the 009 is already too punchy so you are probably best off betting the amp and can, then decide where to go from where you are.

post #240 of 607

I want to buy this product (new or used) but can't find any other place than the factory, is there any?

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