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What customs are right for me? - Page 2

post #16 of 117
Thread Starter 

I am not ready to cross of the ES5's just yet. I'm not entirely sure whether or not I can be considered a bass-head per say, but I as long as the bass is good, clean, deep and doesn't interfere, there aren't really any reason for not liking it, in my head. To put things in to perspective, I can still enjoy my Grado SR60i which aren't bass heavy at all, but I can also enjoy my Westone 3 which doesn't lack bass to say the least. I do like the thought of the ES5's midrange, as it is described as some of the best. 

The fact that you have such a wide preference in music really interests me, as I do tend to listen to quite a lot of different music, and I'd hate spending that much money on a pair of customs and think, "Well, it does good with this genre, but with another one, it's sort of meh,".

 

In the ES5 thread someone painted the picture of ES5 owners sitting on their front porch with a glass of wine, looking in to the horizon. The JH owners were portrayed as long haired dudes that rocked out. Taking my primary music genre into consideration, I'm the latter, but when you look at my music preferences as a whole, I think I'm sort of a hybrid between the two.

 

davidcotton: I'm not exactly looking for more bass from my W3's, as they do have plenty in my opinion, but other than that, it is definitely a viable option that will be considered.

post #17 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielofDenmark View Post

I am not ready to cross of the ES5's just yet. I'm not entirely sure whether or not I can be considered a bass-head per say, but I as long as the bass is good, clean, deep and doesn't interfere, there aren't really any reason for not liking it, in my head. To put things in to perspective, I can still enjoy my Grado SR60i which aren't bass heavy at all, but I can also enjoy my Westone 3 which doesn't lack bass to say the least. I do like the thought of the ES5's midrange, as it is described as some of the best. 

The fact that you have such a wide preference in music really interests me, as I do tend to listen to quite a lot of different music, and I'd hate spending that much money on a pair of customs and think, "Well, it does good with this genre, but with another one, it's sort of meh,".

 

In the ES5 thread someone painted the picture of ES5 owners sitting on their front porch with a glass of wine, looking in to the horizon. The JH owners were portrayed as long haired dudes that rocked out. Taking my primary music genre into consideration, I'm the latter, but when you look at my music preferences as a whole, I think I'm sort of a hybrid between the two.

 

davidcotton: I'm not exactly looking for more bass from my W3's, as they do have plenty in my opinion, but other than that, it is definitely a viable option that will be considered.



That's the exact description of the ES5's bass. Clean, deep, detailed and smoothly integrates it self with the midrange and treble.

post #18 of 117
Thread Starter 

Hmm... This might get expensive!

 

I think I need to read some more reviews of the ES5's, and if possible get a pair for demo - although the latter is highly unlikely.

post #19 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielofDenmark View Post

I am not ready to cross of the ES5's just yet. I'm not entirely sure whether or not I can be considered a bass-head per say, but I as long as the bass is good, clean, deep and doesn't interfere, there aren't really any reason for not liking it, in my head. To put things in to perspective, I can still enjoy my Grado SR60i which aren't bass heavy at all, but I can also enjoy my Westone 3 which doesn't lack bass to say the least. I do like the thought of the ES5's midrange, as it is described as some of the best. 

The fact that you have such a wide preference in music really interests me, as I do tend to listen to quite a lot of different music, and I'd hate spending that much money on a pair of customs and think, "Well, it does good with this genre, but with another one, it's sort of meh,".

 

In the ES5 thread someone painted the picture of ES5 owners sitting on their front porch with a glass of wine, looking in to the horizon. The JH owners were portrayed as long haired dudes that rocked out. Taking my primary music genre into consideration, I'm the latter, but when you look at my music preferences as a whole, I think I'm sort of a hybrid between the two.

 

davidcotton: I'm not exactly looking for more bass from my W3's, as they do have plenty in my opinion, but other than that, it is definitely a viable option that will be considered.


Once again, the JH16 bass extends very far down, the bass is powerful, impactful, and clean. The texture on the bass is very real and similar to the texture you would get from a life-size subwoofer. It does not impede into the other frequencies.

 

For the second bolded part, that is exactly what I thought before deciding on the JH16 over the ES5. On some really bass heavy tracks, the JH16 just spits out the bass like it's shrugging its shoulders--"no problem" they say, and it sounds effortless. Even though I have not heard the ES5, from what I've read, I do think that they would portray the bass just as effortlessly, albeit without the rawness and impact that the JH16 portrays in its bass. Recently I listened to a very bass heavy Jazz track (check it out here - though the quality is not top notch because of YouTube, you get a sense of the song) and the JH16 simply did the bass better than my full-size speakers in my living room (albeit, they are not that high-end, but I was astounded to find that the JH16's bass on this track was spot on while keeping the midrange beautifully realistic (the texture of the guy's voice in the song is crystal clear and strikingly real with the JH16's) and highs in balance with the mids and bass (not ear piercing highs). Many people believe the JH16 has a V shaped sound signature, but I disagree. I think the JH16's sound signature is a bit harder to summarize than simply "V", and far different from a "V" because it is quite neutral. The punchiness of the JH16's bass leads some to believe it has a "V" signature but it is more of the personality of the IEM to be punchy and impactful while maintaining a very neutral sound signature.

 

I told my friend this before, if I could summarize the JH16's sound signature with one word it would be: effortless. And that's what I wanted from my customs, an IEM that just stood back and let the music do its thing. At night when I am listening to my JH16's, I forget that I even have something in my ears because it truly sounds like there are high-end speakers in front of me.

 

For the last bolded part, I feel that one big perk with the JH16's is its ability to be so versatile. When I put on some piano concertos or wonderful Jazz, I do feel like I am sitting on my front porch with a glass of wine. When I play some modern J-Pop or some mainstream music, I feel like I am there in the music, in a club or live setting. The JH16 is both sophisticated and fun to listen to, which I feel suits my expectations perfectly.


Edited by SolidVictory - 6/26/11 at 1:13pm
post #20 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidVictory View Post




Once again, the JH16 bass extends very far down, the bass is powerful, impactful, and clean. The texture on the bass is very real and similar to the texture you would get from a life-size subwoofer. It does not impede into the other frequencies.

 

For the second bolded part, that is exactly what I thought before deciding on the JH16 over the ES5. On some really bass heavy tracks, the JH16 just spits out the bass like it's shrugging its shoulders--"no problem" they say, and it sounds effortless. Even though I have not heard the ES5, from what I've read, I do think that they would portray the bass just as effortlessly, albeit without the rawness and impact that the JH16 portrays in its bass. Recently I listened to a very bass heavy Jazz track (check it out here - though the quality is not top notch because of YouTube, you get a sense of the song) and the JH16 simply did the bass better than my full-size speakers in my living room (albeit, they are not that high-end, but I was astounded to find that the JH16's bass on this track was spot on while keeping the midrange beautifully realistic (the texture of the guy's voice in the song is crystal clear and strikingly real with the JH16's) and highs in balance with the mids and bass (not ear piercing highs). Many people believe the JH16 has a V shaped sound signature, but I disagree. I think the JH16's sound signature is a bit harder to summarize than simply "V", and far different from a "V" because it is quite neutral. The punchiness of the JH16's bass leads some to believe it has a "V" signature but it is more of the personality of the IEM to be punchy and impactful while maintaining a very neutral sound signature.

 

I told my friend this before, if I could summarize the JH16's sound signature with one word it would be: effortless. And that's what I wanted from my customs, an IEM that just stood back and let the music do its thing. At night when I am listening to my JH16's, I forget that I even have something in my ears because it truly sounds like there are high-end speakers in front of me.

 

For the last bolded part, I feel that one big perk with the JH16's is its ability to be so versatile. When I put on some piano concertos or wonderful Jazz, I do feel like I am sitting on my front porch with a glass of wine. When I play some modern J-Pop or some mainstream music, I feel like I am there in the music, in a club or live setting. The JH16 is both sophisticated and fun to listen to, which I feel suits my expectations perfectly.

I would love to hear the JH16 Pro. I'm pretty sure I would be amazed by it's powerful bass presentation. Nice summary of the JH16's. I'm not sure if you've read the review of the Westone ES5's by TechPowerUp, but they compared the JH16 to the ES5. Here's what they said in terms of bass presentation:

 

" Even though the ES5s only have one bass driver they are far from bass light. In comparison to the Westone 4s they have around the same amount, but the ES5s have the upper hand when it comes to low end extension and control. The bass is equally dominant in terms of volume, but the better definition of the ES5s makes you notice it more especially on tracks with an intricate bass line. Compared to the JH16|PROs the ES5s bass is less powerful and does not have quite the same slam. Bass quality wise it is a toss-up between the two, the Jerry Harvey Audio in-ears have slightly more thump, but definition wise the ES5 wins. "

 

So basically, if bass quantity is your main priority go for the JH16 Pro. If bass quality is your main priority go for the Westone ES5.

 

 


 

 


Edited by Tronz - 6/26/11 at 8:21pm
post #21 of 117


Thanks for sharing this song with me, it sounds awesome with my Westone ES5. I can recommend this song to everyone who likes listening to a tight, deep and powerful bass. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidVictory View Post




Once again, the JH16 bass extends very far down, the bass is powerful, impactful, and clean. The texture on the bass is very real and similar to the texture you would get from a life-size subwoofer. It does not impede into the other frequencies.

 

For the second bolded part, that is exactly what I thought before deciding on the JH16 over the ES5. On some really bass heavy tracks, the JH16 just spits out the bass like it's shrugging its shoulders--"no problem" they say, and it sounds effortless. Even though I have not heard the ES5, from what I've read, I do think that they would portray the bass just as effortlessly, albeit without the rawness and impact that the JH16 portrays in its bass. Recently I listened to a very bass heavy Jazz track (check it out here - though the quality is not top notch because of YouTube, you get a sense of the song) and the JH16 simply did the bass better than my full-size speakers in my living room (albeit, they are not that high-end, but I was astounded to find that the JH16's bass on this track was spot on while keeping the midrange beautifully realistic (the texture of the guy's voice in the song is crystal clear and strikingly real with the JH16's) and highs in balance with the mids and bass (not ear piercing highs). Many people believe the JH16 has a V shaped sound signature, but I disagree. I think the JH16's sound signature is a bit harder to summarize than simply "V", and far different from a "V" because it is quite neutral. The punchiness of the JH16's bass leads some to believe it has a "V" signature but it is more of the personality of the IEM to be punchy and impactful while maintaining a very neutral sound signature.

 

I told my friend this before, if I could summarize the JH16's sound signature with one word it would be: effortless. And that's what I wanted from my customs, an IEM that just stood back and let the music do its thing. At night when I am listening to my JH16's, I forget that I even have something in my ears because it truly sounds like there are high-end speakers in front of me.

 

For the last bolded part, I feel that one big perk with the JH16's is its ability to be so versatile. When I put on some piano concertos or wonderful Jazz, I do feel like I am sitting on my front porch with a glass of wine. When I play some modern J-Pop or some mainstream music, I feel like I am there in the music, in a club or live setting. The JH16 is both sophisticated and fun to listen to, which I feel suits my expectations perfectly.



 

post #22 of 117
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tronz View Post



I would love to hear the JH16 Pro. I'm pretty sure I would be amazed by it's powerful bass presentation. Nice summary of the JH16's. I'm not sure if you've read the review of the Westone ES5's by TechPowerUp, but they compared the JH16 to the ES5. Here's what they said in terms of bass presentation:

 

" Even though the ES5s only have one bass driver they are far from bass light. In comparison to the Westone 4s they have around the same amount, but the ES5s have the upper hand when it comes to low end extension and control. The bass is equally dominant in terms of volume, but the better definition of the ES5s makes you notice it more especially on tracks with an intricate bass line. Compared to the JH16|PROs the ES5s bass is less powerful and does not have quite the same slam. Bass quality wise it is a toss-up between the two, the Jerry Harvey Audio in-ears have slightly more thump, but definition wise the ES5 wins. "

 

So basically, if bass quantity is your main priority go for the JH16 Pro. If bass quality is your main priority go for the Westone ES5.

 

 


 

 


I did read that review, and he is actually the guy I mentioned when I talked about a guy who has both ES5 and JH16 ;-)

 

At the moment I think there's a small advantage towards the Westone's, but it is quite a lot of money for me, so I'll have to get some more reading done. 

 

*impatiently awaits further information about the new 1964 Ears model*

 

post #23 of 117

Have you considered the Future Sonics MG6Pros? I think they'd be just what you're looking for, and a bit less expensive at $837 US than some of your other options. That price includes some custom musician ear plugs as well. Don't ask me why the package deal is cheaper than buying just the ear monitors; I've got no clue. etysmile.gif

 

About bass: Personally, I don't think the bass that characterizes a live rock performance is what I'd call neutral. If anything, it's crazy in your face, and it'll make your chest thump. That's the first thing I noticed with the MG6s. They sound live, and even though I know there's no way they could be pounding my chest, something (perhaps past experiences that sounded similar?) makes it seem so. And that's just with the medium-sized low frequency vents; there are also large vents for even more bass. And if you're concerned that that might be too much for you, just notch it down to the small-sized vents, or even the fully closed adapters for a downright well-behaved bass response. Oh, and no matter the vent size, expect bass that is exceptionally clear and deep; there's absolutely nothing muddy about the MG6s, and they go way down. I'd love to hear from someone who's got both the ES5s and the MG6s to comment and compare the two, but I don't think anyone on Head-Fi has both. I can't imagine the ES5s go any deeper.

 

Briefly, the mids and highs are everything I expected from a high end custom: balanced, incredibly detailed, and never fatiguing. Further, I don't know if I'll ever have a full grasp of just what timbre means, but I know that as a drummer the presentation of snares, toms, and cymbals (and of course bass) is fantastic here. Again, think live drums and you'll get the idea.

 

Just one more custom IEM to think about. :) 


Edited by SmilingPolitely - 6/27/11 at 6:12pm
post #24 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmilingPolitely View Post

Have you considered the Future Sonics MG6Pros? I think they'd be just what you're looking for, and a bit less expensive at $837 US than some of your other options. That price includes some custom musician ear plugs as well. Don't ask me why the package deal is cheaper than buying just the ear monitors; I've got no clue. etysmile.gif

 

About bass: Personally, I don't think the bass that characterizes a live rock performance is what I'd call neutral. If anything, it's crazy in your face, and it'll make your chest thump. That's the first thing I noticed with the MG6s. They sound live, and even though I know there's no way they could be pounding my chest, something (perhaps past experiences that sounded similar?) makes it seem so. And that's just with the medium-sized low frequency vents; there are also large vents for even more bass. And if you're concerned that that might be too much for you, just notch it down to the small-sized vents, or even the fully closed adapters for a downright well-behaved bass response. Oh, and no matter the vent size, expect bass that is exceptionally clear and deep; there's absolutely nothing muddy about the MG6s, and they go way down. I'd love to hear from someone who's got both the ES5s and the MG6s to comment and compare the two, but I don't think anyone on Head-Fi has both. I can't imagine the ES5s go any deeper.

 

Briefly, the mids and highs are everything I expected from a high end custom: balanced, incredibly detailed, and never fatiguing. Further, I don't know if I'll ever have a full grasp of just what timbre means, but I know that as a drummer the presentation of snares, toms, and cymbals (and of course bass) is fantastic here. Again, think live drums and you'll get the idea.

 

Just one more custom IEM to think about. :) 


 

Future Sonics MG6Pros bass extends all the way down to 18hz while the Westone ES5's bass extends all the way down to 8hz. This is all meaningless because most music doesn't have any energy down there and we don't know how sensitive each earphone is down there in the sub-bass levels ( 80hz down ). But, from a technological and specification standpoint, the Westone ES5's goes deeper then the MG6.

 

Timbre means how true to life the sound is.

post #25 of 117

I wanted to add my $0.02 on my experience with custom IEM bass.

 

There is not only bass depth, but also speed and note sustainment.  In my experience BAs and dynamics do things differently, including with custom IEMs.  I have had experience with two dynamic driver custom IEMs, the TS842 and EP-10 Plus, both hybrids.  I will hear 2 more in the near future, a dynamic driver custom very similar in design to the mg6pro, but with a 14mm driver, and the hybrid Merlin.

 

The TS842 has more bass rumble than everything else in the price range, although the Kozee X3 isn't too far off.  Going up in price, the TS842 still has a more sustained note than the rest, but barely more than the SE 5-way, although compared with the SE 5-way, Starkey SA-43, and LS8 the bass seems a little loose and slow.  

 

The EP-10 Plus without EQ isn't as good as the TS842, but with EQ it has much more deep bass rumble with nearly the tightness as the TS842.

 

Bottom line is there are many great options out there and more than likely many would make you very happy, but if you can figure out which one is best for your preferences, you will be very satisfied!

post #26 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tronz View Post




 

Future Sonics MG6Pros bass extends all the way down to 18hz while the Westone ES5's bass extends all the way down to 8hz. This is all meaningless because most music doesn't have any energy down there and we don't know how sensitive each earphone is down there in the sub-bass levels ( 80hz down ). But, from a technological and specification standpoint, the Westone ES5's goes deeper then the MG6.

 

Timbre means how true to life the sound is.


To me, timbre is better defined by all the various qualities of sound excluding frequency response. It allows you to differentiate different instruments. So for instance, if you have a violin and a cello play the exact same note, you'd be able to tell the two apart. Moreover, if timbre is good  you'd be able to hear said instrument by itself and immediately identify it without comparison. IEMs and headphones handle timbre to varying degrees of proficiency, though at the pricepoints top tier customs sell for, I'd hope they get it very close.

 

Off topic, but timbre is one of the two headphone attributes which I think are too often ignored around here. The other is a headphone's ability to portray dynamic range.

 

post #27 of 117
Thread Starter 

I'm not too sure about that Future Sonics model, but I'll look a bit more into it. The price looks good though! :-)

 

About this quote: "I don't think the bass that characterizes a live rock performance is what I'd call neutral." I can only agree, but what I want is a balanced sound signature, not a neutral one, if that makes sense - meaning I want something that does everything, wihtout being bass, treble and midrange-light nor focused. 

post #28 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielofDenmark View Post

I'm not too sure about that Future Sonics model, but I'll look a bit more into it. The price looks good though! :-)

 

About this quote: "I don't think the bass that characterizes a live rock performance is what I'd call neutral." I can only agree, but what I want is a balanced sound signature, not a neutral one, if that makes sense - meaning I want something that does everything, wihtout being bass, treble and midrange-light nor focused. 


You described the Westone ES5 once again.

post #29 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tronz View Post

Future Sonics MG6Pros bass extends all the way down to 18hz while the Westone ES5's bass extends all the way down to 8hz. This is all meaningless because most music doesn't have any energy down there and we don't know how sensitive each earphone is down there in the sub-bass levels ( 80hz down ). But, from a technological and specification standpoint, the Westone ES5's goes deeper then the MG6.


Of course. You and I both know that frequency response ratings really don't mean all that much. My old FX33s were rated for response all the way down to 5hz, if I recall correctly. They obviously don't hold a candle to my MG6s, and I'd assume the same for the ES5s.

But I was talking about how deep they sound and feel. As a dynamic, I'd wager that the MG6s have a bit of an edge on the ES5s, at least when it comes to bass. It's a shame that there isn't even one comparison between the two, but I'm guessing most of us don't have $2000+ to spend on multiple sets of customs, eh?


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielofDenmark View Post

I'm not too sure about that Future Sonics model, but I'll look a bit more into it. The price looks good though! :-)

 

About this quote: "I don't think the bass that characterizes a live rock performance is what I'd call neutral." I can only agree, but what I want is a balanced sound signature, not a neutral one, if that makes sense - meaning I want something that does everything, wihtout being bass, treble and midrange-light nor focused. 


Yeah, I hear you.

 

The MG6s fit that bill too. They are, in my humble opinion, impeccably balanced with the mid-sized vents -- and you've got room to tweak them to your preference if you feel otherwise.

post #30 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmilingPolitely View Post




Of course. You and I both know that frequency response ratings really don't mean all that much. My old FX33s were rated for response all the way down to 5hz, if I recall correctly. They obviously don't hold a candle to my MG6s, and I'd assume the same for the ES5s.

But I was talking about how deep they sound and feel. As a dynamic, I'd wager that the MG6s have a bit of an edge on the ES5s, at least when it comes to bass. It's a shame that there isn't even one comparison between the two, but I'm guessing most of us don't have $2000+ to spend on multiple sets of customs, eh?


 


Yeah, I hear you.

 

The MG6s fit that bill too. They are, in my humble opinion, impeccably balanced with the mid-sized vents -- and you've got room to tweak them to your preference if you feel otherwise.



I'm pretty sure the MG6 has more bass quantity than the ES5's but in terms of bass quality I doubt it competes with the ES5.

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