New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Waah, my VSonic GR07 broke! - Page 3

post #31 of 45

Well I sure hope I'll like the gr07 more than my M2s!

To me the M2s are too warm and bassy, I expect the gr07 to be a lot more clear, detailled and neutral (fingers crossed!).

 

post #32 of 45
Thread Starter 

True, the equalization to fix this is pretty radical, but once fixed, the best qualities of M2 drivers show. And those are: more detail, better timbre, slightly better bottom end extension.

So M2, as good as they are out of the box (which is reasonably for the price), can be made a lot better unlike GR07, which can be only made a bit better...

For what it's worth, GR07 has slightly better soundstaging, but the rest is slightly inferior. I'll take more detail and extension over soundstaging.

 

Note this is about equalized IEMs. Non-equalized GR07 is by far more neutral. (Only sibilance as opposed to general darkness, slightly recessed mids and bass boost.)

 

Oh, and I have no fit issues with M2, despite small ear canal. GR07 has a bit more fiddly fit - has to be just the right depth (hard!) and perfect seal (easy) to work its best.


Edited by AstralStorm - 6/28/11 at 1:03am
post #33 of 45

i think you have gone mad with grief over your broken GR07 =D

post #34 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by AstralStorm View Post

Here follows a longer Brainwavz M2 recap:

Let's say that they're the intimate venue version of Sennheiser IE7 - those had the Sennheiser far soundstage instead. Narrower and closer.

 

They go down low enough to make v1 Atrios work for their money. GR07 can't compete on this front, funny enough.

The boominess is the bass boost which I've underestimated quite a bit in preliminary eq. It can be removed, which Improves soundstaging and texturing (all around, not just lows!) quite a bit.

 

W/o eq Brainwavz M2 sound like your typical boombox. Fun but wrong.

Equalized, they can actually compete with IEMs three times+ more expensive and actually do that better than the VSonics GR07...

Perhaps this is how the GR07 have been born? (Add troll face for VSonic's owner if applicable.)

 

In fact, equalized M2 are smoother and yet actually slightly better at microdetail at both ends of frequency range - extension is very close on high end, better at bottom end.

 

Latest EQ (yet to be simplified):

Brainwavz-M2.png

 

I should try to snatch a listen of newest brighter MG7 Atrio perhaps... It'd be funny to consider these a direct upgrade on GR07.

 

--

TL;DR summary:

I think that equalized Brainwavz M2 actually are better than equalized VSonic GR07. Shocking, isn't it?

I blame the slightly smaller driver and lack of venting in VSonics.



Vsonics has a slightly larger driver and is vented. The amount of EQ that you use on everthing is rather disturbing to me. I haven't heard either phone but I think there may be a fly in your ointment. Just a check and see thing as I said, I haven't heard either of those and can't directly comment. It just seems off that 2 IEMs that are so well regarded would be so far off neutral other than the extra bass of the M2 which was designed in.

 

post #35 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by goodvibes View Post





Vsonics has a slightly larger driver and is vented. The amount of EQ that you use on everthing is rather disturbing to me. I haven't heard either phone but I think there may be a fly in your ointment. Just a check and see thing as I said, I haven't heard either of those and can't directly comment. It just seems off that 2 IEMs that are so well regarded would be so far off neutral other than the extra bass of the M2 which was designed in.



The methodology for EQ which I believe AstralStorm uses is biased to the particular hearing of the one making the EQ curve. To put it bluntly, what sounds good to him will probably not sound good to you, but neither are wrong, for yourselves.

Now, some can hear the artifacts introduced by heavy EQ, and perhaps AstralStorm's radical EQ of this 'phone introduces less than that of the GR07, explaining why he hears improved characteristics with this new one.

It's impossible to know what's happening in his ears, but his qualifiers of "slightly" make be believe that nobody is missing anything by enjoying the GR07.
post #36 of 45

I am not against EQ myself if it is done right. The problem with 'the right EQ' often limits the listener to one particular setup and ends up no good for people like me, who own multiple setup and like to mix things around. Instead of trying so hard to make an imperfect headphone sounds good, I choose to appreciate the difference in sonic experience brought by these imperfections.

post #37 of 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post

I am not against EQ myself if it is done right. The problem with 'the right EQ' often limits the listener to one particular setup and ends up no good for people like me, who own multiple setup and like to mix things around. Instead of trying so hard to make an imperfect headphone sounds good, I choose to appreciate the difference in sonic experience brought by these imperfections.


FWIW, I've taken to using slight EQ to flatten out that ear canal resonance which seems to happen with all IEMs around 7-8kHz. It's a very narrow cut, usually around -3dB or so. The precise frequency and magnitude varies from 'phone to 'phone, presumably due to differing insertion depths and possibly tip shape, material. The 'phones still keep their inherent qualities, but lose that slight AM radio type colouring. If anything, it helps to better bring out the individual character of my 'phones.
post #38 of 45

Sounds like a good time to try a Etymotic Research ER4... largely sound the same except GR07s being warmer and having a more textured bass but the ER4s have better extension and more accuracy. Both scale very well with amping.

post #39 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post

I am not against EQ myself if it is done right. The problem with 'the right EQ' often limits the listener to one particular setup and ends up no good for people like me, who own multiple setup and like to mix things around. Instead of trying so hard to make an imperfect headphone sounds good, I choose to appreciate the difference in sonic experience brought by these imperfections.

 

Well, I've tried to find one that needs zilch EQ to my ears. As of now, no such ideal is present, however GR07 are quite close other than the sibilance.

Funnily enough, using max. magnitude as the metric, M2 need less eq. Taking area total, GR07 wins.

(I don't count the bandwidth "widening" shelves in either case, they're completely optional.)

BTW, all important equalization on M2 is within 3 dB - which is pretty impressive "flatness".

 

M2 are completely unsuitable for monitoring without eq (dark and boomy), GR07 are very workable.
 

About eq limiting you to the single setup - the solution is deceptively simple - build your own portable eq. Deceptively simple, since making enough parametrics requires quite a bit of ingenuity to save space. (5x parametric+2 shelf should be enough for most every kind of adjustment) Not to mention the price of such a device will rival a single pair of high end IEMs.

Might be just as cheap to make and/or buy a portable digital effect box. (can be as simple as 2x mono-to-stereo convolver, just with great AD/DA)

 

About EQ artifacts: I used GR07 without eq for some time due to having setup issues... right before it failed. This detail difference is not due to EQ artifacts.

I bet it's a few small differences that add up to a better whole in my opinion. The most important one is the longer decay - far better reverberation where it should be present and none where it should not be. (Unlike funny Sleek's SA6 presentation where it added "reverb" to everything except the lacking bass.)

 

---

However, search for the IEMs that need no eq and have no fault (to my ears) continues. GR07 is not the end, but a nice step forward.

I suspect that j-phonics would be excellent, except the high end extension (16k tops? bad.) and perhaps armature-style low end timbre and decay...

Heck, Westones 4 didn't satisfy me timbre-wise. (Plus the bass is actually not linear to me, but smoothly rolls off below 40 Hz. The fit was as perfect as they come.)

 

Frequency response can be corrected - timbre (dynamics win) and detail (BAs win) cannot be corrected anywhere near as easily.

Soundstaging can sometimes be changed by deeper or shallower fit, but this depends on the exact design of the IEM.

---

 

TL;DR: Which one would be the best upgrade of these? Comments please.

- Monster Turbines Pro Gold (Might be possible to snatch a listen if I try real hard; ugly, will need a paint job)

- Futuresonics Atrio v2 (w/ MG7) (I'd have to set up a credit card just for these...)

- Radius HP-TWF21 (DDM2)

- Hifiman RE272

Off the list due to "sparklies" are:

- Panasonic RP-HJE900 (I've caught a listen of these)

 

Funny, nobody makes BA + dynamic dual driver IEMs yet. Could be a killer combination if tuned right.

post #40 of 45
Thread Starter 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yggdrassilious View Post

Sounds like a good time to try a Etymotic Research ER4... largely sound the same except GR07s being warmer and having a more textured bass but the ER4s have better extension and more accuracy. Both scale very well with amping.


Are you serious? Etys are seriously bass-light... Far lighter than GR07 and not as well extended to the bottom. The top is nigh peerless though, but the detailing is almost too aggressive.

post #41 of 45
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryBaconGod View Post

FWIW, I've taken to using slight EQ to flatten out that ear canal resonance which seems to happen with all IEMs around 7-8kHz. It's a very narrow cut, usually around -3dB or so. The precise frequency and magnitude varies from 'phone to 'phone, presumably due to differing insertion depths and possibly tip shape, material. The 'phones still keep their inherent qualities, but lose that slight AM radio type colouring. If anything, it helps to better bring out the individual character of my 'phones.


Precisely, this is the main similarity in all my equalization curves, except around 6kHz. GR07 needs even more cut there than the others I've equalized.

Another similarity is a 10kHz boost. Guess we have non-standard ear canals.

post #42 of 45

So whatever happened to that broken pair of Gr07s??

Did vsonic/lendmeurears fix them?? (if so, how much?)

you fixed them?? got them replaced?? or bought a new pair??

post #43 of 45
Thread Starter 

They got replaced for just the cost of mail and time. Not too expensive.

post #44 of 45

Man, had my GR-07 for 1 year and 1 month, and now the right bud went dead like yours... wtf?!   *sadpanda*...

post #45 of 45

I know this thread is old....but, I got my GR07 BE 3 months ago and now the right driver is dead...I'm very disappointed. These weren't cheap for me and I doubt the eBay seller can help me...

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav: