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I truly believe these are one of the best Classical Music headphones I've ever heard - Page 17

post #241 of 255

Just recently repurchased my DT 660s. Here is to hoping they don't break again.

post #242 of 255

I've seen the DT860 go for under £50 used, decent condition. Are they similar to the DT660 except open?

post #243 of 255

guys, do you think that dt860 is actually a perfect refinement of dt660?

i heard that it is even better than dt660...

post #244 of 255

Here's a review on the both of them from another forum in 2004. Looks like DT860 is a bit better:

 

DT660 (close-back design)
Circumaural cans are generally more comfortable and duly so with both DT660/860 but material of black pads are not as lush and smooth as those silver ones on DT770-990 series. If this matters to you, I believe the pads are interchangeable.

DT660 offers good isolation as close-design should and the first noticeable aural aspect which is very different from most Beyer cans is the mid range. Vocals are very full, forward and lush. Those who complains about recessed mids should look here. In fact, it reminds me of Senn HD600 (jaded memory though). So involving is this characteristic that I just kept inserting different discs with vocals and listen intently, totally disregarding the rest of the aural spectrum. Until such a time I reached satisfaction, I began to ponder those who are used to DT880/990 will deem it as bright sounding. I disagree however.

Next under the microscope is bass quality for quantity is never an issue with close-back design. Do we have the overpowering (to me, that is) sort exhibited by DT770 or the deep and tight nature that of DT150 (my favourite monitor cans)? I'm glad to say DT660 is in the middle of the road. I always felt claustrophobic with DT770 owing to the overwhelming boom in my head but never so with DT660. It may not have the bass quality of DT150 but in no way is it bass shy or inferior. In fact, it sounds very similar to DT831 but a few rungs higher in bounce and punch. There's a flaw (in my opinion) and that is extension when compared to DT880 for I often felt air movement but unable to hear anything on very low bass notes eg. organ rolls.

Finally, the highs are sweeter that DT150 and simply brush DT770 aside. It may not have the extension to that of DT880/990 but in some ways, upper mid range to treble is quite similar to DT831. Once again, some will say treble brightness is evident but I feel differently albeit sensitive to bright sound. I reckon the main difference is the full bodied mids that changed the equation of similarity between DT660 and DT831.

Referring to my claustophobic experience with DT770, DT660 never exhibited this trait and in fact, it never sent out a constant reminder I was listening to close-back cans except for the increased isolation. Soundstaging wise, I didn't expect it to pan wide and duly so but to a degree that is not worth quibbling. However, I was astonished by the projection of soundstaging depth. So much so I have to remove the cans and peer for any angling of the drivers to create such an effect. It's almost akin to listening with some amount of crossfeed.

DT860 (open-back design)
There's is a slight loss of bass thickness and volume with this pair but in return, I heard much better bass definition and extension over DT660. Although the end result is still nowhere near to DT150 (definition) and DT880 (extension), proximity to these benchmarks is significantly reduced. Nonetheless, the same bouncy bass of DT660 is still evident and adds up to a more enjoyable bass performance over DT831/931. 

What is deemed neutral on DT150 and recessed on DT880 is full bodied, up close and personal where mid range is concerned on DT860. I'm convinced Beyer is trying to achieve a different sound with the new Premium Line and targets the mid range which is constantly being challenged by Sennheiser and AKG. It's so different compared to all the Beyer cans in my arsenal that I'm most captivated by this sonic trait. After successfully tearing myself away from this "light", I travelled to the other end of the tunnel where the upper-mid to treble range resides.

DT860 betters its closed counterpart for the same improvement in definition and extension in the lows is also evident in the highs. As a result, airiness is significantly greater than DT660 and possibly the same as DT931. The latter excels in piano presentation and I observed the same prowess but with more articulation and ambience surrounding each note when the ivory key strikes while cymbals sheen is more sparkling. Now I understand why DT860 costs a premium price over DT660. 

In which case, I expected wider soundstaging from open-back DT860 but I was surprised it isn't so. It's slightly wider than DT660 but never what I've experienced with DT880/990 when the width can span more than 180 degrees. I felt that soundstaging width of DT860 is about 140 degrees and before you jeer, focus on the amazing depth it projects. So deep it sounds to me that once again, I thought there's a crossfeed circuitry in the link. Play "Buena Vista Social Club" and you can share the same perception as I did. Hey, some may say there's contradiction when I mentioned vocals are forward but soundstaging depth is deep. Allow me to explain myself, on most well recorded cds with jazz vocals I've tried, the voices are very close and involving; almost smelling the singer's breath. At the same time, layering behind the singer where the musicians play on their respective instruments are easily pin pointed and differentiated in 3D depth. If I have to peg the forte of DT660/860 in a nutshell, I would pick mid range and soundstaging depth.

 

http://www.sgheadphones.net/index.php?showtopic=2147

post #245 of 255


Yeah, but see, I bought 660's because they are closed.

post #246 of 255
I tried the 660 a few times at an old hifi spot in Boston. Almost bought it on the spot. Great balance, I love my 770s but if I ever wanted a more neutral closed can, I'd buy the DT660 without thinking. It's what the senn HD280 wishes it was.
post #247 of 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilly87 View Post

I tried the 660 a few times at an old hifi spot in Boston. Almost bought it on the spot. Great balance, I love my 770s but if I ever wanted a more neutral closed can, I'd buy the DT660 without thinking. It's what the senn HD280 wishes it was.

 

Do you think the 660 would be better (or even or worse) for classical than the T90? 

post #248 of 255
If these headphones are exceptionally good for classical music, can we also say the same to its brother dt860? Are they EXCEPTIONALLY good too?
If not why? After reading reviews i didnt read any major differences( only that it has more bass)
If yes, why no one who is writing online is fan of this headphones while big crowd adores dt660?
Any suggestions?
I dont have answers to these questions smily_headphones1.gif)
post #249 of 255

Me neither. If someone drops a pile of money on my head, I'll buy the DT 440 and DT 860 and do a review of all three comparing them.

post #250 of 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by bach1992 View Post

If these headphones are exceptionally good for classical music, can we also say the same to its brother dt860? Are they EXCEPTIONALLY good too?
If not why? After reading reviews i didnt read any major differences( only that it has more bass)
If yes, why no one who is writing online is fan of this headphones while big crowd adores dt660?
Any suggestions?
I dont have answers to these questions smily_headphones1.gif)

I managed to find David Mahler's review on the DT860. Surprisingly he finds them warm and with more bass than the DT660. For that reason he prefers the DT660 for classical:

 

Quote:

THE iPOD HAS MET IT’S MATCH

Looking for great sound and comfort out of your iPod? The DT860 are just what the doctor ordered. At its price, the DT860 is one of the best sounding headphones on the market for use directly out of a portable player.

THE FIT AND FINISH

The DT860 are remarkably comfortable. Like other full-size Beyerdynamic headphones, these come with plush velour cups that do not heat up much and contour very comfortably to the head. The headphones are open back so do not expect that you will be using these while in transit or at the office without the sound leaking to the others around you. At a 32 Ohm impedance rating and a high sensitivity, these headphones play loud directly out of an iPod. The one sided cable is good for lying in bed and relaxing on the porch. The headphones also have a 90 degree swiveling ear cup feature, for easy storage and wearing when not in use. I would have preferred if the headphones swiveled so that if you are wearing them on your neck, the ear cups would rest on your collar bone rather than face outward leaving the metal back to sit against your collar bone. Lastly, the headphones come with a very nice carrying case, featuring a leather-like vinyl exterior and a plush open-cell foam interior.

ALL ABOUT THE SOUND…

In a nutshell: Punchy, warm and exciting! The DT860s are a perfect choice for rocking out with your iPod. The bass is full, impactful and makes your rock really rock and your hip hop really pound. These are highly enjoyable sounding headphones with a colored sound suited for a listener looking for that extra bass but not at the expense of the total sound picture. Unlike a lot of other headphones, the DT860 have big bass, but are clear and defined and do not sound murky or muffled. For classical music I prefer the DT660s which are the closed-back cousin of the DT860 but have much less bass impact. Listening to some good ole P-Funk I was struck by the impact the DT860s have particularly in the mid bass region. For this reason, I think many users will fall under the headphone’s spell, particularly since the midrange and treble remain uncompromised by the fully-bloomed bass. I listened to Wynton Marsalis’s amazing rendition of “Cherokee” on his Standard Time album and found the headphone was able to articulate the fast pace movement of the percussion with depth and punch without sounding blurred or muddy. Every hit had snap, but also weight.

One of my favorite test tracks is Metallica’s “ “Enter Sandman.” The dynamic build at the beginning of this song and the exquisitely recorded and mixed drum track allow me to hear how the headphones render cymbal transients and articulate numerous percussive elements simultaneously. Out of my iPod, the DT860 handled the percussive elements with greater attack and intensity than most others I’ve tried. I was heartily impressed! Lastly, I listened to New York State of Mind by Nas to see if the headphones would shine with hip-hop. I like my hip-hop old school, and I think the original pressing of Illmatic is a well mixed/mastered CD. For me, these headphones excelled with rap music even over some other pricier alternatives which are aimed at the hip-hop audience. Some hip-hop listeners will prefer even more sub-bass emphasis than the DT860s have to offer, but for my money, the DT860s are top hip-hop choice at its price point.

LAST WORD

Beyerdynamic offers a monster of a headphone in the DT860. For one, it’s one of the loudest full size headphones I’ve tried out of an iPod. It sounds great with almost anything you throw at it. If you are looking to pair a full size headphone to plug into your portable player and isolation is not a paramount concern, the DT860 should be at the top of your list.

FULL SIZE FOR PORTABLE USE RATING CHART

Sound Quality 9
Comfort 9
Design & Features 8
Value 9.5
post #251 of 255

Depends on the source and where you'll be listening. T90s are more detailed for sure, bigger soundstage, better extension on both ends, but I'd say the DT660 is like a baby version of the T90 mixed with the DT880: lively, too bright for sensitive ears, a nice firm bass punch without overwhelming (more than 880 but less than T90, and not as deep as either), and mids that are neither forward nor recessed with just a pleasant hint of warmth without being lush. The 660's midrange is less cold than the 880, which makes it better for casual listening IMO, and although the soundstage doesn't match the open models, it's damn good for a closed can; not quite as wide as the DT770, but more natural/less artificial (the midbass bloom on the 770s enhances their soundstage artificially IMO) and the positioning is better. It would be a great closed can for gaming.

 

All of the beyer cans are good for classical IMO. If your source/amp is portable or cost less than $200-$300 combined, you're probably safer with the DT660 than the T90.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Head1 View Post
 

 

Do you think the 660 would be better (or even or worse) for classical than the T90? 

post #252 of 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilly87 View Post
 

Depends on the source and where you'll be listening. T90s are more detailed for sure, bigger soundstage, better extension on both ends, but I'd say the DT660 is like a baby version of the T90 mixed with the DT880: lively, too bright for sensitive ears, a nice firm bass punch without overwhelming (more than 880 but less than T90, and not as deep as either), and mids that are neither forward nor recessed with just a pleasant hint of warmth without being lush. The 660's midrange is less cold than the 880, which makes it better for casual listening IMO, and although the soundstage doesn't match the open models, it's damn good for a closed can; not quite as wide as the DT770, but more natural/less artificial (the midbass bloom on the 770s enhances their soundstage artificially IMO) and the positioning is better. It would be a great closed can for gaming.

 

All of the beyer cans are good for classical IMO. If your source/amp is portable or cost less than $200-$300 combined, you're probably safer with the DT660 than the T90.

 

 

Interesting appraisal.  I found the 660 to have a bit of genuine sub-bass whereas the 880 did not.

post #253 of 255

Which 880 and what source? The 880 is famous for having fantastic extension with really linear bass. I think the 660 is great in subbass too, but I'm wondering if you might just be hearing a little extra meat around 60-100 hz more than anything:

 

http://cdn.head-fi.org/5/57/1000x500px-LL-57a86bd1_Stereoplay-Headphone-Curves.JPG

 

Closed headphones also create a bit more resonance so you "feel" the bass more; it's not really bass from the music, but it is "more bass".

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbophead View Post
 

Interesting appraisal.  I found the 660 to have a bit of genuine sub-bass whereas the 880 did not.


Edited by Gilly87 - Yesterday at 11:38 am
post #254 of 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilly87 View Post
 

Which 880 and what source? The 880 is famous for having fantastic extension with really linear bass. I think the 660 is great in subbass too, but I'm wondering if you might just be hearing a little extra meat around 60-100 hz more than anything:

 

http://cdn.head-fi.org/5/57/1000x500px-LL-57a86bd1_Stereoplay-Headphone-Curves.JPG

 

Closed headphones also create a bit more resonance so you "feel" the bass more; it's not really bass from the music, but it is "more bass".

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbophead View Post
 

Interesting appraisal.  I found the 660 to have a bit of genuine sub-bass whereas the 880 did not.


I think most closed headphones will exhibit more sub-bass than open ones.  I ran both with a Woo WA6, 880/600 and 660 with the impedance switch thrown appropriately.  880 is a nice can for sure but I needed a closed can for some occasions.  Not sure I understand your explanation of bass from a closed can.  An orchestral bass drum is either felt or it's not, real or imagined.  Regarding curves, I trust my ears.

post #255 of 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Head1 View Post
 

I managed to find David Mahler's review on the DT860. Surprisingly he finds them warm and with more bass than the DT660. For that reason he prefers the DT660 for classical:

 

Thanks.

 

too bad i purchased hip-hop dynamics for classical music :d...i am still waiting them though :)

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