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I truly believe these are one of the best Classical Music headphones I've ever heard - Page 13

post #181 of 273

No sorry not a reply to Claritas. But as a quick aside why not use Sennheiser HD800. All my music form early Baroque including organ to modern piano sound good to me.

 

What I actually wanted to report or ask a question about is that I have just been listening to my latest of about 8 recordings of Bach's Solo Violin sonatas and partitas by Christian Tetzlaff and noticed that the sound although from a single solo instrument moves from left to right and from front to back in unpredictable ways. Is this because the performer is moving about? I don't think I would notice such a movement if I were actually listening in a concert hall probably because I would be much further away which would neutralize small movements. It's a little irritating now that I have noticed it and listen out for it. Hmm. I am going to have to listen to all my recordings of this work to see if it is similar. At least a pianist cannot shove the piano around. :)

post #182 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Claritas View Post
 

This thread has several highlights, so thank you all very much. I have some new spins on older questions:

 

How good is DT660 for listening to baroque organ and to solo piano regardless of period?

 

How do they compare to the others you think are good for those and other keyboard instruments?

 

I'd say they are quite good.  I don't specifically listen to Baroque organ, but I do listen to a bit of solo piano.  The only thing you might miss is a sense of weight.  The DT660s tend towards being sparklier and lighter than other headphones.  But that is why they excel at classical in general.  No muddiness or boosted lower frequencies that could get in the way.  I don't overly analyze the sound I get and am not as well versed in assigning audiophile terms.  I just know when I like a sound.  Nothing beats an HD800 for me, but the DT660 does a remarkable job.  I have a mint pair for sale at a really good price if you are interested.  If they haven't sold by then, I can also bring them to the Chicago mini meet in a month which I believe you have said you might attend.

post #183 of 273
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LargoCantabile View Post
 

No sorry not a reply to Claritas. But as a quick aside why not use Sennheiser HD800. All my music form early Baroque including organ to modern piano sound good to me.

 

What I actually wanted to report or ask a question about is that I have just been listening to my latest of about 8 recordings of Bach's Solo Violin sonatas and partitas by Christian Tetzlaff and noticed that the sound although from a single solo instrument moves from left to right and from front to back in unpredictable ways. Is this because the performer is moving about? I don't think I would notice such a movement if I were actually listening in a concert hall probably because I would be much further away which would neutralize small movements. It's a little irritating now that I have noticed it and listen out for it. Hmm. I am going to have to listen to all my recordings of this work to see if it is similar. At least a pianist cannot shove the piano around. :)

It shouldn't shift sides unless a few things are happening (and it should never shift dramatically):

 

1) the performer may be moving and/or swaying and this slight movement could be magnified in a recording

 

2) it would be hard to imagine that the microphones used were badly matched, but if it was recorded with different microphones certain frequencies could be picked up in different channels (very hard to imagine this happening to a degree that is audible to ear)

 

3) certain objects in the room have sympathetic resonances that increase certain frequencies on different sides of the room

 

4) your ear / and or your transducer are not entirely balanced in their frequency response and you are able to focus on the channel imbalance because the instrument is monophonic.  don't be alarmed here as human hearing and transducers are never completely balanced left/right

 

 

It is likely that the issue is a combo of 1 and 4,

post #184 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by FraGGleR View Post
 

 

I'd say they are quite good.  I don't specifically listen to Baroque organ, but I do listen to a bit of solo piano.  The only thing you might miss is a sense of weight.  The DT660s tend towards being sparklier and lighter than other headphones.  But that is why they excel at classical in general.  No muddiness or boosted lower frequencies that could get in the way.  I don't overly analyze the sound I get and am not as well versed in assigning audiophile terms.  I just know when I like a sound.  Nothing beats an HD800 for me, but the DT660 does a remarkable job.  I have a mint pair for sale at a really good price if you are interested.  If they haven't sold by then, I can also bring them to the Chicago mini meet in a month which I believe you have said you might attend.

 

Thanks for the informed opinion. I *am* looking forward to the meet. It'll be pleasant to meet people who understand why someone might own more than one pair of headphones.

post #185 of 273

Thanks David. It is ever so slight and not frequency related I think. Your reply reassured me I wasn't going mad and made a great deal of sense. I was just amazed that I had never listened so attentively before to register this.

post #186 of 273

I finally bought a pair of these after a long search for the best closed(isolating) cans, with need for an amp being a big price/convenience factor.

 

I did get a chance before buying to try a couple of pairs, and compare them directly to some akg's, other beyer's and KRK-8400 and shure 840.  I was also able to compare the latter two directly to several others (without the 660's at the time).

 

The models to beat:

Before I got to try the DT660's my favorites were the KRK's and Shures. I love the detail, imaging, and separation on the KRKs as well as the well represented highs, but somehow they often sound a little thin and distant in the mids, and most of all they are incapable delivering loud bass, and if you try to force them to they sound very boxy/distorted with poor impact.  The bass issue is hard to ignore for me. I noticed the distant mids most  when comparing to something like the Shures that somehow just have a really cohesive full sound that is instantly immersive and hard not to smile about in spite of (or even related to) very poor/compressed imaging. The Shure seems to have a better impact all the way up through the lower mids and this could be related too.   I just thought I couldn't be very happy with the shortcomings of either of these phones, so I was still searching, and after David's praise, went searching for the DT-660's.

 

Sound:

The DT-660's seemed to me to have sort of 90% of everything from both the competitors rolled into one.  They aren't bass tilted but the bass quality is solid (not boxy) and stays that way for loud bass. Unlike the KRK's, they are very capable of delivering strong impactful bass and sub-bass. They just don't do it when the source, or your equalizer, doesn't ask for it.  The imaging is quite impressive, certainly far better than the Shures, and they have most of that overall full, powerful upfront engagement of the Shures that somehow leave the KRK's just a bit flat footed. Probably much of this is again due to bass capability. There's certainly nothing missing in the highs either where they pull out detail impressively, very balanced sound to me. Finally, as has been said, these are great without an amp, which is probably related to the fact there is really more than plenty of volume to spare from any portable source. While I haven't tried the DT660's with an amp yet, I'm already loving the sound quality without one. That's a great simplification and big value/dollar factor.

 

Other closed cans:

I did also try MDR-1's and the similar sounding Momentum's, but with a strong preference for the Momentums for me. Both had a sound that was way too warm. The Momentums are great headphones with undeniable sound quality. I'd love to own a pair, but for my primary enjoyment I just can't live with losing the highs under that big fluffy warm blanket, no matter how cold it is outside. Maybe some EQ would make those perfect as well as amazing. Going lower end, I tried CAL's for a minute.  Great initial sound signature, but as I see it they are toy compared to these other headphones. There could be a case for them for someone vs the KRK's. Of course I also tried other Beyer's. I had tried the DT770's (a couple of varieties) head to head with the KRK's and Shures. I was really impressed with their ability to deliver bass impact, helping me realize what the KRK's couldn't possibly do, but the bass tilt was decidedly too much for me, although far less pounding than m-50's. I also tried a few AKG's, don't remember which ones.  All I remember about that was that none pulled out details, as well as the DT660's.

 

Break-in:

After buying a pair of DT-660's my initial reaction was that they were slightly tight sounding, boxed in, and holding back something compared to what I'd heard in the store.  For the first usages I used different, probably worse, source hardware though(un-amped in all cases), so it's possible that's a cause, but I did go ahead and burn them in for 100 hours(with programmed breaks) on pink noise. I do believe that this made a real change. I don't believe in cable voodoo for a minute, but I think these headphones may really "open up" with some burn in.

 

Comfort:

I find the velour hotter than fake leather and this is uncomfortable if you're tying to save on the AC bill in the summer. The KRK's were without question the most comfortable, being very light and cool. The Shure's weigh more than the DT660's but felt a little lighter because the headband distributed and controlled weight a little 
better(I actually like the Shure headband). My new DT660's have been better than the store demos though. The ear cups are bigger around than needed and seal well on me without fuss. The ear cups are not deep and my ears touch ever so slightly, but unlike the Shures it's not painful or fatiguing, or even noticable after a few minutes.

 

Isolation:

As for isolation, I think they are best of the bunch and I find them very enjoyable on airplanes.  I'll just add then when even a little sound is produced, they seem to isolate better than they really do, probably because of clear imaging.

 

Final Thoughts:

So, I'm new to good headphones. I've compared side by side many closed phones now up to about $400 range, mostly lower though. To me they all had clear, non-subtle differences, and these seem to be the real all-around-er's. I don't mean that in terms of suiting everyone (or every genre I suppose) but in terms of doing everything really well and nothing exaggerated.  With my experience I cannot dispute the claim of this thread.


Edited by BiggerHead - 10/16/13 at 10:40pm
post #187 of 273

Wish I had a chance to try these and the DT 250 back when I was hunting for a closed can >.> 

post #188 of 273

@Claritas, for what it's worth, I had a solo piano piece as one of my main auditioning selections, and I ended up choosing the DT660's.  That also happens to be one of the pieces I was auditioning when it became clear to me that the CAL's are not on the same level as the rest.  I might have to listen again to shures to decide between the two if that was the only music I cared about.  The staging and imaging of the DT660's is probably not very important for a piano solo nor is the deep bass extension,  and I remember the shure's really pleasing me for piano with a rich voice and weight.

post #189 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mshenay View Post
 

Wish I had a chance to try these and the DT 250 back when I was hunting for a closed can >.> 


Has anyone actually compared the DT 660 with the DT 250, in particular for classical music? (There is a thread from 2005, http://www.head-fi.org/t/124188/beyerdynamic-dt-250-or-dt-660, but none of the posters actually had both headphones.) 

 

My new DT 250-250 arrived on Saturday, and the first CD (actually, SACD) I listened to with them was the Beethoven Violin Concerto in D with Jascha Heifetz and the Boston Symphony Orchestra directed by Charles Munch (RCA "Living Stereo").  It sounded great, but I admit that I did not try to listen critically and evaluate the headphones; I just enjoyed the music.

post #190 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcoGV View Post
 

Has anyone actually compared the DT 660 with the DT 250, in particular for classical music?

 

I'd be very curious about this as well. I've been listening to a lot of classical with the DT250-250 and been very impressed, although I still am slightly curious about DT660... not that I think it would be enough of an upgrade to double dip, but just to learn more about the different headphones strengths/weaknesses.

 

DT250 is the best closed headphone I have ever heard with classical, but my experience with high-end closed headphones has been limited.

post #191 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggerHead View Post
 

@Claritas, for what it's worth, I had a solo piano piece as one of my main auditioning selections, and I ended up choosing the DT660's.  That also happens to be one of the pieces I was auditioning when it became clear to me that the CAL's are not on the same level as the rest.  I might have to listen again to shures to decide between the two if that was the only music I cared about.  The staging and imaging of the DT660's is probably not very important for a piano solo nor is the deep bass extension,  and I remember the shure's really pleasing me for piano with a rich voice and weight.

 

Thanks. That helps, because I have heard the Shures (which I like).

post #192 of 273

what about dt 660 vs hd800 for classical music?

post #193 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by atistatic View Post

what about dt 660 vs hd800 for classical music?

I find the HD800 to be many times better. DT660 is great if you need something that isolates and is easy to drive. It does better than a lot of cans but not the HD800.
post #194 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by atistatic View Post
 

what about dt 660 vs hd800 for classical music?

well I give him props for askin lol, 

post #195 of 273
Quote:
Originally Posted by FraGGleR View Post

I find the HD800 to be many times better.

+1. I have both, and enjoy the DT 660's very much, but IMO the HD800 is the best I've heard for Classical. The DT 660's are not in the same league.
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