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post #421 of 726

I just came back from London meet up and the Invicta dealer there told me that Invicta 2 should be out pretty soon but no exact date. However, current Invicta has now stop production. The new Invicta 2 suppose to have 2 set of dac, 1 for each channel or something. Cost is £4500! That is £1000 more than previous version!


Edited by SleepyOne - 4/27/13 at 10:48am
post #422 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkie37 View Post

Yesterday I called Resonessence with a question about using the Invicta with my AP1 with PP and received a call back from Martin. He suggested that I wait a few weeks as they are coming out with a new model and it might suit my needs even more than the standard Invicta.
 

I had tried the AP2 (without Purepower) with the invicta a while back and actually preferred the invicta's internal usb conversion as I find the ap2 with invicta a bit too treble happy.

post #423 of 726
Thread Starter 

I've got an update which I confirmed with Mark Mallinson as something I can officially talk about. Much of the info already posted has been (mostly) accurate so this is a bit of a rehash and re-organization of that info along with some new stuff.

 

1) The current Invicta is out of stock and will be phased out come mid-May. I'm not sure if the current version will have more stock prior to that or not. Moving forward, Resonessence is taking a fork in the road with Invicta splitting into two models:

 

2)First is the previously mentioned Invicta Mirus which is a dedicated DAC only (no headphone section). While losing the headphone section with the ES9016 chip, Mirus features dual ES9018 chips dedicated entirely to the line-out. They run in parallel so it's essentially 8 DACs per channel, or something I call Octa-mono mode (I just made that up!) rather than quad-mono like the original Invicta. 

 

3)The second variation is yet to be named (Invicta 2? Invicta part deux? I dunno...) but it stays more in line with the original, only this time the ES9016 on the headphone section is replaced by an ES9018. So it still gets dual ES9018 chips but in a different configuration than the Mirus. 

 

Both models will have some other upgrades and tweaks such as sample rate indicators for 352.8kHz and 384kHz. Both are priced at $4,995. 

 

4)Next comes the Concero which will remain in the lineup and as far as I know will keep the same $599 price. It can't handle DSD due to limitations of the ES9023 chip used, but it can now handle sample rates up to 384kHz over USB (which would be DXD files).

 

5)Next they have the Concero HD which uses a different (32-bit) Sabre chip and can in fact do DSD. The better chip should mean better SQ so it's not just adding DSD to the existing model. They are shooting for a $799 price if all goes according to plan. This is due in June.

 

6)Lastly is the Concero HP which I believe we saw a picture of earlier. It uses the same Concero chassis as the other models, and the same 32-bit Sabre chip (DSD capable) as the Concero HD, but has a built in headphone amp. The HP model is USB only, while the HD (and the original) have USB plus the coaxial SPDIF input. Pricing is also tentatively set at $799 and this should also ship around June. 

 

So there you have it - Resonessence seems to be branching out to higher territory with the Invicta line, while keeping the "low" end covered with the original Concero and filling out the middle to some degree with the new Concero variations. They have some other ideas kicking around but for now this is all that's really set in stone. Oh and by the way - the Concero HD and HP have one more interesting aspect that I can't talk about yet... soon though. 


Edited by project86 - 4/27/13 at 1:29pm
post #424 of 726
I will try the new version with AP1 and PP, when I can afford it. I hope that I love the Invicta by itself! Then I can sell my AP 1 with PP, to help finance the new Invicta!
post #425 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post

I've got an update which I confirmed with Mark Mallinson as something I can officially talk about. Much of the info already posted has been (mostly) accurate so this is a bit of a rehash and re-organization of that info along with some new stuff.

 

1) The current Invicta is out of stock and will be phased out come mid-May. I'm not sure if the current version will have more stock prior to that or not. Moving forward, Resonessence is taking a fork in the road with Invicta splitting into two models:

 

2)First is the previously mentioned Invicta Mirus which is a dedicated DAC only (no headphone section). While losing the headphone section with the ES9016 chip, Mirus features dual ES9018 chips dedicated entirely to the line-out. They run in parallel so it's essentially 8 DACs per channel, or something I call Octa-mono mode (I just made that up!) rather than quad-mono like the original Invicta. 

 

3)The second variation is yet to be named (Invicta 2? Invicta part deux? I dunno...) but it stays more in line with the original, only this time the ES9016 on the headphone section is replaced by an ES9018. So it still gets dual ES9018 chips but in a different configuration than the Mirus. 

 

Both models will have some other upgrades and tweaks such as sample rate indicators for 352.8kHz and 384kHz. Both are priced at $4,995. 

 

4)Next comes the Concero which will remain in the lineup and as far as I know will keep the same $599 price. It can't handle DSD due to limitations of the ES9023 chip used, but it can now handle sample rates up to 384kHz over USB (which would be DXD files).

 

5)Next they have the Concero HD which uses a different (32-bit) Sabre chip and can in fact do DSD. The better chip should mean better SQ so it's not just adding DSD to the existing model. They are shooting for a $799 price if all goes according to plan. This is due in June.

 

6)Lastly is the Concero HP which I believe we saw a picture of earlier. It uses the same Concero chassis as the other models, and the same 32-bit Sabre chip (DSD capable) as the Concero HD, but has a built in headphone amp. The HP model is USB only, while the HD (and the original) have USB plus the coaxial SPDIF input. Pricing is also tentatively set at $799 and this should also ship around June. 

 

So there you have it - Resonessence seems to be branching out to higher territory with the Invicta line, while keeping the "low" end covered with the original Concero and filling out the middle to some degree with the new Concero variations. They have some other ideas kicking around but for now this is all that's really set in stone. Oh and by the way - the Concero HD and HP have one more interesting aspect that I can't talk about yet... soon though. 

This is welcome news from Resonessence and demonstrates their continuing commitment to producing the best sounding DACs available.  However as a longstanding and extremely satisfied owner of the current Invicta (and speaking on behalf of other Invicta owners as well), I hope that Resonessence will continue to provide regular firmware and/or software updates to the original Invicta to help protect our units from the curse of obsolescence.   An opportunity to update the Invicta's hardware would also be welcome as well, especially if this is determined to provide a significant improvement in SQ or overall functionality.

post #426 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post

Both models will have some other upgrades and tweaks such as sample rate indicators for 352.8kHz and 384kHz. Both are priced at $4,995. 

 

Thanks for the summary. Interesting that they're persisting with the sample rate indication LEDs. Wouldn't it be easier to implement, more practical and flexible to simply indicate it on the OLED panel ?

 

EDIT : also, is the Invicta equipped with a function to invert polarity ?


Edited by MayaTlab - 4/28/13 at 3:03am
post #427 of 726

Ok I got DSD64 over USB working with foobar. I just had to play around with the foobar settings a bit, when all the necessary drivers and components were installed.

post #428 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by twsmith View Post

This is welcome news from Resonessence and demonstrates their continuing commitment to producing the best sounding DACs available.  However as a longstanding and extremely satisfied owner of the current Invicta (and speaking on behalf of other Invicta owners as well), I hope that Resonessence will continue to provide regular firmware and/or software updates to the original Invicta to help protect our units from the curse of obsolescence.   An opportunity to update the Invicta's hardware would also be welcome as well, especially if this is determined to provide a significant improvement in SQ or overall functionality.

 +1 or perhaps +1000 on this regarding both the possible upgrade and particularly the firmware updates. I love the Invicta as it is now, but don't want to feel like I was one of the proof of concept guys for their business plan and then get left in the lurch. 

post #429 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post

I've got an update which I confirmed with Mark Mallinson as something I can officially talk about. Much of the info already posted has been (mostly) accurate so this is a bit of a rehash and re-organization of that info along with some new stuff.

1) The current Invicta is out of stock and will be phased out come mid-May. I'm not sure if the current version will have more stock prior to that or not. Moving forward, Resonessence is taking a fork in the road with Invicta splitting into two models:

2)First is the previously mentioned Invicta Mirus which is a dedicated DAC only (no headphone section). While losing the headphone section with the ES9016 chip, Mirus features dual ES9018 chips dedicated entirely to the line-out. They run in parallel so it's essentially 8 DACs per channel, or something I call Octa-mono mode (I just made that up!) rather than quad-mono like the original Invicta. 

3)The second variation is yet to be named (Invicta 2? Invicta part deux? I dunno...) but it stays more in line with the original, only this time the ES9016 on the headphone section is replaced by an ES9018. So it still gets dual ES9018 chips but in a different configuration than the Mirus. 

Both models will have some other upgrades and tweaks such as sample rate indicators for 352.8kHz and 384kHz. Both are priced at $4,995. 

4)Next comes the Concero which will remain in the lineup and as far as I know will keep the same $599 price. It can't handle DSD due to limitations of the ES9023 chip used, but it can now handle sample rates up to 384kHz over USB (which would be DXD files).

5)Next they have the Concero HD which uses a different (32-bit) Sabre chip and can in fact do DSD. The better chip should mean better SQ so it's not just adding DSD to the existing model. They are shooting for a $799 price if all goes according to plan. This is due in June.

6)Lastly is the Concero HP which I believe we saw a picture of earlier. It uses the same Concero chassis as the other models, and the same 32-bit Sabre chip (DSD capable) as the Concero HD, but has a built in headphone amp. The HP model is USB only, while the HD (and the original) have USB plus the coaxial SPDIF input. Pricing is also tentatively set at $799 and this should also ship around June. 


So there you have it - Resonessence seems to be branching out to higher territory with the Invicta line, while keeping the "low" end covered with the original Concero and filling out the middle to some degree with the new Concero variations. They have some other ideas kicking around but for now this is all that's really set in stone. Oh and by the way - the Concero HD and HP have one more interesting aspect that I can't talk about yet... soon though. 
Thank you for getting clarification from Mark. I apologize to Mark, if he was the one that I spoke to, it would be easy to get Mark/Martin mixed up : )

For those who also own an AP1 or AP2, I got this response from Philip when I asked if I could playback DSD on the Invicta, through an AP1;

Yes, dsd is supported as DoP. In fact this is transparent to the AP. Dsd64 comes out as 176.4khz pcm.

Cheers
Philip

BTW, I too hope they keep updating firmware and features of all models. It is part of what impressed me so much with Resonessence.

Don
post #430 of 726
Thread Starter 

I can't say for sure what the future holds for the original Invicta. But considering 1) Resonessence made their name with the first unit, and 2) the vast majority of their customers (at this point) are Invicta owners, and 3) their track record with updates, I'd say it's fairly likely that they will continue updating Invicta for a long time. Granted they have already added everything I can think of so far that I might want.... but it's a simple process for them to add more thanks to their programming platform. 

 

From chatting with Mark, it seems like the new models will have more processing power, either through a different FPGA or some other hardware. But it will build on the original model. So most updates that work for the new models should work for the original, until they pass a certain threshold where it becomes "too much" for the original hardware. Don't ask me for a practical application of this because I don't have one.... it's just theory at this point. 

 

Personally I'm excited about the Concero HP (all in one high quality DAC and HP amp price comfortably below $1k? Yes please) as well as the Invicta Mirus. As nice as the integrated amp is in the original Invicta, and probably even better in the new model, I still believe most users of a high end DAC will want a stand alone amp as well. So the Mirus seems like the all-out performance option. 

post #431 of 726

An update that may be important for the existing INVICTA, depending on the evolution of the music market, would be for the USB input to support PCM up to 24 or 32/384 and DSD128.

 

I also think the new model line-up will make a lot of sense, although they will still have an hole to cover between the Conceros and the new Invicta, around $/€/£2000...

post #432 of 726
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFWannabe View Post

 

I also think the new model line-up will make a lot of sense, although they will still have an hole to cover between the Conceros and the new Invicta, around $/€/£2000...


I would love to see a Concerto HD or HP version with SD card and USB input!  I would be willing to pay a couple hundred extra for this one added feature.  Great to have the option to get rid of the computer as source!  You could also go semi portable with a 5V battery or alternative PSU.

 

Mark

post #433 of 726
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFWannabe View Post

An update that may be important for the existing INVICTA, depending on the evolution of the music market, would be for the USB input to support PCM up to 24 or 32/384 and DSD128.

 

I also think the new model line-up will make a lot of sense, although they will still have an hole to cover between the Conceros and the new Invicta, around $/€/£2000...

 

I could have sworn the recent update brought USB capabilities up to 24/384, though I can't say I've checked that personally. Also, I thought they had claimed DSD128 support was coming in the near future but now I can't find it anywhere so maybe I dreamed that part. I can confirm that DSD128 does not work at this moment, at least with the files I have played through the SD Card reader. 

 

But this is all easy stuff for them to update, and I'm sure it will all be set sooner than later. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rx7mark View Post


I would love to see a Concerto HD or HP version with SD card and USB input!  I would be willing to pay a couple hundred extra for this one added feature.  Great to have the option to get rid of the computer as source!  You could also go semi portable with a 5V battery or alternative PSU.

 

Mark

 

That would require a display as well as a control panel, which I'm not sure would comfortably fit on a device that small. I can see the appeal but it just doesn't seem feasible to me. 

post #434 of 726
Another idea for a new Resonessence product, which I think would appeal to users of the Concero and perhaps DACs from other manufacturers. This would be a separate SD card reader/player with either a USB and/or standard coax output. Many Invicta owners have discovered the convenience of having the SD card reader that obviates the need to connect to a computer or other media player. It would seem a logical extension of this approach to have a stand-alone SD player, perhaps around the size of the Concero, that would pretty much do the same thing that the Invicta does now. Since you're separating the SD reader/player and DAC functions, it shouldn't be too difficult to put a small display on the SD player itself. There seems to be a dearth of high-quality SD players and with very high capacity cards becoming available, I could see a real need for this type of product.
post #435 of 726
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by twsmith View Post

Another idea for a new Resonessence product, which I think would appeal to users of the Concero and perhaps DACs from other manufacturers. This would be a separate SD card reader/player with either a USB and/or standard coax output. Many Invicta owners have discovered the convenience of having the SD card reader that obviates the need to connect to a computer or other media player. It would seem a logical extension of this approach to have a stand-alone SD player, perhaps around the size of the Concero, that would pretty much do the same thing that the Invicta does now. Since you're separating the SD reader/player and DAC functions, it shouldn't be too difficult to put a small display on the SD player itself. There seems to be a dearth of high-quality SD players and with very high capacity cards becoming available, I could see a real need for this type of product.

 

 

This is an idea that Resonessence is definitely aware of. As far as I know they haven't really moved on it yet due to the Concero HD/HP and new Invicta range taking all their resources. But it is for sure on their radar. There is a lot of work that went into Invicta in terms of the subsystems for reading SD files - it's built from scratch specifically for audio purposes, rather than using Linux or some other pre-existing software. 

 

I guess all that's needed is for enough people to show interest and that might help get the ball rolling. 

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