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The Apex High Fi Audio Arete is now available! - Page 2

post #16 of 84

I own the Apex Peak, and I've said it a few times, but I don't think that these amps lack the go juice to power the HE-6.  To be honest the only headphone that "absolutely" needs a lot of power is the HE-6, by the time you make an output that works for the HE-6 it might be next to unusable for many other headphones.

post #17 of 84

Very true, and I'd be very interested in the Apex Peak or Arete myself if I hadn't recently purchased a Schiit Lyr, with which I am very happy at this time.

Pete Millett and Todd have created some really terrific products and are great additions to the headphone community.

I just suspect we might be seeing more headphones like the HE-6 in the future and having a well-rounded amp that will power them would be a consideration.

post #18 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by 45longcolt View Post

General question - aside from the HE-6 and 500, just which headphones are so hard to drive as to demand Godzilla-sized amps? Certainly not the Audeze LCD-2s from my experience. Not that I regret buying a Lyr (quite the opposite,) but I wouldn't shy away from the Arete unless I owned the HifiMan phones.

 

Specific question for Todd - (and other manufacturers) - why no Balance knob? A lot of recordings, not to mention individuals' ears, can really benefit; especially in a detail-critical environment like headphone listening.

 

And isn't arete French for "Stop?" A mixed message, or is my French just rusty? 


The HE 500 isn't hard to drive at all. The 6, 5, 5LE, and 4 are the hard ones.

LCD 2 and HE 500 are about the same as far as needed power goes.
post #19 of 84

no - arete is Greek for virtue, afaik. but I doubt the French accent serves to confirm this - it may be one of those pretentious marketing flourishes that put an end-e on housing developments like "Pointe"... ;-(
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 45longcolt View Post

And isn't arete French for "Stop?" A mixed message, or is my French just rusty? 



 

post #20 of 84

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 45longcolt View Post

...And isn't arete French for "Stop?" A mixed message, or is my French just rusty? 


Given Todd's mountain-related nomenclature for his Apex products, arête refers to a sharp mountain ridge.

post #21 of 84

also, the french word for stop has two R's.

 

so, it would be conjugated as "Arrête".

 

post #22 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by jude View Post


Given Todd's mountain-related nomenclature for his Apex products, arête refers to a sharp mountain ridge.



That was brilliant Jude!  

post #23 of 84

How might this pair with an ATH or how about the sony mdr-r10?

post #24 of 84

Looking good !

post #25 of 84

As to the perpetual "how much power is enough" question... not sure if Todd posted it, but I put up some info and a spreadsheet that might help answer the question (or not):

 

http://www.apexhifi.com/specs.html

 

Pete

post #26 of 84

Pete,

 

I think folks aren't questioning if the amp can't get loud enough, I think they believe that the HE-6 without gobs of power can't sound right in terms of dynamics, which I won't argue either way but I think that the Peak and the Arete which seem to be designed similarly have enough to satisfy this, as they don't sound congested to me at all.

 

Sonny

post #27 of 84

I see on the Apex website a new ("coming soon") product called "The Butte" ... http://www.apexhifi.com/Butte.htm

 

post #28 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wedge View Post

Pete,

 

I think folks aren't questioning if the amp can't get loud enough, I think they believe that the HE-6 without gobs of power can't sound right in terms of dynamics, which I won't argue either way but I think that the Peak and the Arete which seem to be designed similarly have enough to satisfy this, as they don't sound congested to me at all.

 

Sonny


 

Yup, the dynamic aspect is where things get more difficult.  The overall loudness and dynamic requirements are related though, and you can get some idea based on these calculations.

 

The question is how much headroom over the average listening level do you need?  The answer varies from person to person, and with the type of music.  I have heard people quote anything from 10dB to 40dB as the minimum amount of headroom needed.  By "headroom", here I'm referring to the number of dB above the average listening level before you hit the maximum possible output (normally, this is clipping level of the amp).

 

Personally, I want a listening level of ~90dB and >20dB headroom... so I need a maximum level of 110dB (not that I would ever listen to sustained sound at that level).  Other people may need/want more or less.  Also keep in mind that the headphones themselves will have some maximum output level, above which they will compress or distort, regardless of the amp.  And the output impedance of the amp will come into play as well, unless it is quite low (say, <10% of the headphone impedance).

 

In any case, IMHO, it seems that the HE-6 would be OK with a Peak or Arete, for most people... but probably not everybody. 

 

Pete

 

post #29 of 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmillett View Post

Yup, the dynamic aspect is where things get more difficult.  The overall loudness and dynamic requirements are related though, and you can get some idea based on these calculations.

 

The question is how much headroom over the average listening level do you need?  The answer varies from person to person, and with the type of music.  I have heard people quote anything from 10dB to 40dB as the minimum amount of headroom needed.  By "headroom", here I'm referring to the number of dB above the average listening level before you hit the maximum possible output (normally, this is clipping level of the amp).

 

Personally, I want a listening level of ~90dB and >20dB headroom... so I need a maximum level of 110dB (not that I would ever listen to sustained sound at that level).  Other people may need/want more or less.  Also keep in mind that the headphones themselves will have some maximum output level, above which they will compress or distort, regardless of the amp.  And the output impedance of the amp will come into play as well, unless it is quite low (say, <10% of the headphone impedance).

 

In any case, IMHO, it seems that the HE-6 would be OK with a Peak or Arete, for most people... but probably not everybody. 

 

Pete

 


The other issue, is that Todd published the numbers for these two amps at 32 ohms, and folks are assuming the power is less at 50 ohms, where it actually is not.  For the Peak it worked out to be around 1.25W and for the Arete, my guess was around 1.1W or something I forget now.

 

post #30 of 84

I own the Peak/Volcano and will be posting my impressions of the Arete in another week or so. I am using one that was graciously on loan (from TTVJ) and am enjoying it with my Grado's (the best amp I have heard so far with the PS1000). Really tames and articulates the bottom of that phone. 

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