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Meitner MA-1 - Page 4

post #46 of 56
Thread Starter 

Thanks for that Gregorio, will find some time to have a read...
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio View Post



All the various AES tests prove that adult humans cannot hear above 20kHz but regardless, 96kHz sampling frequency allows recording of frequencies up to 48kHz, more than double the highest frequency possible for a human to hear and actually higher than a dog can hear.

Have a read of this: White Paper

The paper gets a little technical but it's worth persevering. In Electronic Engineering the basic axiom is: the faster you go the lower the accuracy possible. Yes, communications equipment can run at GHz speeds but at a resolution of only a few bits. To produce smooth filters at 384kHz (for example) is not mundane. To produce a smooth filters without artefacts requires a considerable number of coefficients and the higher the sample rate, the more coefficients needed but less amount of time is available. In the case of 384kHz, four times the number of calculations are required in a quarter of the time compared to 96kHz. and 96kHz is already slightly faster than optimal for 24bit accuracy. The only solution is to cut corners and make the computations less complex so they can execute more quickly and this compromises the efficiency of the filters and ultimately therefore compromises sound quality. As corroborated by the link to the Benchmark statement in the link I supplied previously.

The marketing hype is getting to truly ridiculous proportions and not just with sample rates. 16bit already provides about 1000 times more dynamic range than just about any commercially released recording in history, so what's the point of 24bit? And 32bit is outrageous, if it were possible to actually resolve 32bits of dynamic range it would kill you instantly!

G


 

post #47 of 56

MA-1 review now up on Computer Audiophile.

 

I won't give away anything within the review, but it's a favorable one.

post #48 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elysian View Post

MA-1 review now up on Computer Audiophile.

 

I won't give away anything within the review, but it's a favorable one.



The review is indeed pretty useless. Indeed, any potential buyer will end up with the same doubts after reading the review. I'm pretty bored these columns of words are called review. All is a review now. Of course, the reviewer will keep receiving Meitner gear after the review and the traffic to his site will be good.  All good for the business, all useless for us. I'm more and more fed up of all this industry.

 

 

 

 

post #49 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortes View Post

The review is indeed pretty useless. Indeed, any potential buyer will end up with the same doubts after reading the review. I'm pretty bored these columns of words are called review. All is a review now. Of course, the reviewer will keep receiving Meitner gear after the review and the traffic to his site will be good.  All good for the business, all useless for us. I'm more and more fed up of all this industry.


Actually I think Chris is one of the most honest reviewers out there. Mike over at Headfonia also does a really nice job. Srajan Ebaen he is not. He breaks several "golden rules" of the professional audiophile reviewer. 1. He's critical of a product when he does not like it (see his Esoteric review). Magazines like TAS will tell you that they never have a bad review in their pages because they simply choose not to review any underperforming products. Uh-huh. Rule 2. - never directly compare a product to its actual competition. Instead, talk about how much better it is than products that cost half as much, or even better, how close it gets to products that cost twice as much. Avoid talking about strengths/weaknesses against direct rivals at all cost. Chris breaks that one all the time, including in his "useless" MA-1 review.

 

Obviously measurements would be nice, but most reviewers simply don't have that capability. Audio Precision SYS2722s don't exactly come cheap. And of course if you're just looking for confirmation of existing beliefs that "all DACs reduce jitter to zero, and sound identical, and anyone who spends more than $500 is der audiophoolz" then his site won't be of help to you.

 


Edited by DaveBSC - 10/5/11 at 11:11am
post #50 of 56


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveBSC View Post

Actually I think Chris is one of the most honest reviewers out there. Mike over at Headfonia also does a really nice job. Srajan Ebaen he is not. He breaks several "golden rules" of the professional audiophile reviewer. 1. He's critical of a product when he does not like it (see his Esoteric review). Magazines like TAS will tell you that they never have a bad review in their pages because they simply choose not to review any underperforming products. Uh-huh. Rule 2. - never directly compare a product to its actual competition. Instead, talk about how much better it is than products that cost half as much, or even better, how close it gets to products that cost twice as much. Avoid talking about strengths/weaknesses against direct rivals at all cost. Chris breaks that one all the time, including in his "useless" MA-1 review.

 

Obviously measurements would be nice, but most reviewers simply don't have that capability. Audio Precision SYS2722s don't exactly come cheap. And of course if you're just looking for confirmation of existing beliefs that "all DACs reduce jitter to zero, and sound identical, and anyone who spends more than $500 is der audiophoolz" then his site won't be of help to you.

 



I agree with your comments on Mike at Headfonia, who is honest and makes a great job. As for this particular review at CA, tell me why Meitner's review is not useless.

I find useful to know whether a product performs better or worse than competence at a given point. I find pretty useless this comment:

 

 

"Comparing the Meitner Audio MA-1 to DACs such as the Weiss DAC202, Berkeley Audio Design Alpha DAC, and dCS Debussy reveals what will be a less than a satisfactory answer for readers seeking what Regis Philbin called THE final answer. The DAC202 and Alpha are in one camp while the MA-1 and Debussy are in another camp. Neither twosome is unequivocally the winner of any DAC shootout. Chances are good that listeners will like one camp better than the other. Compared to the MA-1 and Debussy the DAC202 and Alpha sound pretty laid back with a touch more transparency and a skosh less dynamics and vivid bass slam."

 

After reading this, well Meitner is good, DAC2002 is good, BADA is good, Debussy is good.. well I knew that before reading the review. Zero real new information.

post #51 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortes View Post

After reading this, well Meitner is good, DAC2002 is good, BADA is good, Debussy is good.. well I knew that before reading the review. Zero real new information.


I think that's being a bit simplistic. I think he was trying to say that the Weiss and Alpha DAC have a certain signature, (although describing the Weiss as "laid back", or any Sabre based DAC for that matter is a bit unusual) while the Meitner and DCS have a different signature. Ultimately its up to you to decide what sort of sound you are looking for. It would be nice though if he was a bit more forthcoming on his experience with the DAC8. So far he's just said that it "sounds like Audio Research". 

post #52 of 56
I wanted to update this thread for those that may be interested. I received a call from m local dealer three weeks ago, telling me that a new firmware was available and to please bring in my MA-1 for updating. He told me that the update was quite substantial.

Man, was he right! He is a man of understatement, but he did say that I should expect a warmer, more analog sound. In fact it was such an improvement, that he suggested that I shouldn't bother with a turntable, unless it was more than $10,000.00.

I wouldn't have agreed unless I had spent time with the updated version. WOW.

Best free upgrade that I have ever heard in 30 years of hifi.

Don
post #53 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkie37 View Post

I wanted to update this thread for those that may be interested. I received a call from m local dealer three weeks ago, telling me that a new firmware was available and to please bring in my MA-1 for updating. He told me that the update was quite substantial.

Man, was he right! He is a man of understatement, but he did say that I should expect a warmer, more analog sound. In fact it was such an improvement, that he suggested that I shouldn't bother with a turntable, unless it was more than $10,000.00.

I wouldn't have agreed unless I had spent time with the updated version. WOW.

Best free upgrade that I have ever heard in 30 years of hifi.

Don

 

Hi Don, I also have the meitner ma-1. Curious about the firmware update. I bought my unit in November 2012. If I recall correctly it was updated in the Spring of 2013. Did you upgrade the DAC from the 2013 firmware?

 

Yang 

post #54 of 56
I bought my MA-1 last August and it was from a new production run. I had waited about two months to get it.

I would expect that this is a brand new firmware as I had spoken to Shaheem last summer and he told me that a new firmware was on the way but would be ready early in the new year. It was supposed to include double DSD (128X).

So I guess..... Yes I upgraded from the 2013 firmware. I don't see any mention of it on the website. I would contact them to see if you can get the new firmware.

Hope you like it as much as I do : )

Don
post #55 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkie37 View Post

I bought my MA-1 last August and it was from a new production run. I had waited about two months to get it.

I would expect that this is a brand new firmware as I had spoken to Shaheem last summer and he told me that a new firmware was on the way but would be ready early in the new year. It was supposed to include double DSD (128X).

So I guess..... Yes I upgraded from the 2013 firmware. I don't see any mention of it on the website. I would contact them to see if you can get the new firmware.

Hope you like it as much as I do : )

Don

 

Thanks for the information, Don. Yes I should contact the local dealer and see if they have the firmware available. It would be wonderful to have the 128 dsd capability upgrade! It is like a new purchase ... for free!!!

 

Yang

post #56 of 56

FYI, anyone who owns this DAC or the EMM DAC2X - there are new firmware updates available.  Ping your dealer for more details as it's not up on the Meitner/EMM public site yet.

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