Cable discussion continued (split from USB cable thread) - Page 8

Back on topic, on the subject of physics professors tearing up such excuses for academic papers, I have had the good fortune to be taught by a ridiculously intelligent one who actually took digital cables when teaching GCSE physics as an example of a complete scam perpetuated by people's lack of understanding of the digital medium, as part of a lesson comparing advantages of analogue and digital signals.

I think I'll take his opinion over Audioquest.

A dearly departed friend of mine who was pretty bright and knowledgeable was actually intrigued by my position (once hled, not now) that cables made a difference. Rather than argue that I in fact could not hear a difference, he was interested in why I heard a difference.

I wish people here would look at the 'why' more often and in more detail.

I wish the "why" was looked at more as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JadeEast 

I wish the "why" was looked at more as well.

Why?

se

Turtles all the way down!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Eddy 

Why?

 

se

 

 

Because.

You buy a $300 cable, don't hear any difference.  Hit up the forums and find page after page of people complementing the cable on its superior sound.  You start to wonder if you just didn't give the cable enough time (or, in context of one thing I read about a USB cable needing "time to come to rest after being moved" - really?), or if your ears are wrong, or if your gear just isn't good enough to be able to tell the difference between cables.  But, you spent $300 - how can it not work?  So you go back with the preconceived notion that you should hear a difference, and whether or not one actually exists, you'll convince yourself you do hear a difference.

Psychologically, it's pretty simple - expectations, and a subconscious bias against admitting that something expensive was a waste of money.
 

At least analog cables have common sense on their side - mechanical and electrical properties that can change the signal as it's passed through the cable.  Digital and power cables?  Group pressure, slick marketing, and high pricetags.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prog Rock Man 

A dearly departed friend of mine who was pretty bright and knowledgeable was actually intrigued by my position (once hled, not now) that cables made a difference. Rather than argue that I in fact could not hear a difference, he was interested in why I heard a difference.

 

I wish people here would look at the 'why' more often and in more detail.

I totally agree. I resisted the idea that cables made a difference because of the maker and consumer hype about them as it seemed mad. But, having found no link, and no one can not even the cables makers themselves, between physical cables differences and sound quality differences, it is all that is left.

Why some ask,  Well, one must look at the materials used and the construction of the different cables made and what each of their purposes are.  Some make a huge difference to me and others in the chain don't do squat....             But remember anybody who wants to use "Lamp cord" and the "give away" IC's are more then welcome to rock on with them.......

must admit, I've never heard a difference between my different usb cables. I've only forked out £40 for one hifi flat job, it looks nice... but seriously no difference. I can however hear a substantial difference with analogue interconnects and headphone cables, especialy between silver and copper or both. So whether it is a matter of digital as opoosed to analogue..? Digital is different, it is 0's and 1's how can you change or manipulate that to sound different? I think maybe only bad USB cables that don't do what they are supposed to, may have an effect on carrying all of the data, but apart from that...  

jeez, we've got another professor here. you sound like you're a professional psychologist that's personally dealt with these matters - otherwise I don't know where you get your ideas from, other that you've made them up yourself in your mind.

you know there's a big difference between what you think is real (especially without trying something), and what actually is.

here's a simpler notion based on reality:

You buy a $300 cable, don't hear any difference. >return the cable.

You buy a $300 cable, hear some difference. >keep the cable.

that's all there's to it, really.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DemonicLemming 

You buy a $300 cable, don't hear any difference.  Hit up the forums and find page after page of people complementing the cable on its superior sound.  You start to wonder if you just didn't give the cable enough time (or, in context of one thing I read about a USB cable needing "time to come to rest after being moved" - really?), or if your ears are wrong, or if your gear just isn't good enough to be able to tell the difference between cables.  But, you spent $300 - how can it not work?  So you go back with the preconceived notion that you should hear a difference, and whether or not one actually exists, you'll convince yourself you do hear a difference.

 

Psychologically, it's pretty simple - expectations, and a subconscious bias against admitting that something expensive was a waste of money.
 

At least analog cables have common sense on their side - mechanical and electrical properties that can change the signal as it's passed through the cable.  Digital and power cables?  Group pressure, slick marketing, and high pricetags.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lenni 

jeez, we've got another professor here. you sound like you're a professional psychologist that's personally dealt with these matters - otherwise I don't know where you get your ideas from, other that you've made them up yourself in your mind.

you know there's a big difference between what you think is real (especially without trying something), and what actually is.

 

here's a simpler notion based on reality:

You buy a $300 cable, don't hear any difference. >return the cable.

You buy a $300 cable, hear some difference. >keep the cable.

 

that's all there's to it, really.

 

 

   
I have a brace of Psychology degrees so I'll take this one, DemonicLemming is referrring in part to Cognitive Dissonance it is well-known in the psychology literature and explains how we deal with a mismatch between what we expect and what we get, most famously explored by Leon Festinger, basically we may go through hoops to justify (post-rationalize) what we consider poor decisions. Of course this does not happen to everyone, many just go from expectations to self-deception...