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HiFiman HE-500 (HE as in High End) Proving to be an enjoyable experience in listening. . - Page 643

post #9631 of 18022
Any suggestions on what would be the best way to compare Single Ended Vs Balanced?

I have the HE-500 stock cable converted to balanced and can use the same cable as SE/Balanced from Audio GD NFB 28.

The balanced connection sound perceptibly better compared to SE, but I believe loudness plays a part (Balanced means double the power). I am not quite sure by how much I need to increase volume when using as SE so the SPL matches. Any suggestions. Example, the HE-500 is sufficiently louder at at say volume level of 105 on NFB 28 (100 is mute) where as SE it need to be around 112, but these are subjective. Any better suggestions to match the SPL? Thanks.
post #9632 of 18022
Everyone here... Eric Clapton - Unplugged.


Now.
post #9633 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTV View Post

Any suggestions on what would be the best way to compare Single Ended Vs Balanced?

I have the HE-500 stock cable converted to balanced and can use the same cable as SE/Balanced from Audio GD NFB 28.

The balanced connection sound perceptibly better compared to SE, but I believe loudness plays a part (Balanced means double the power). I am not quite sure by how much I need to increase volume when using as SE so the SPL matches. Any suggestions. Example, the HE-500 is sufficiently louder at at say volume level of 105 on NFB 28 (100 is mute) where as SE it need to be around 112, but these are subjective. Any better suggestions to match the SPL? Thanks.

 

You can't.

 

Double ended has less distortion since each amp will have to work less hard. You're working with SNR so it's less noise the less voltage you put through.

 

Why would you need to ask us how to level your volume? Only you really know what your ideal listening volume is and people don't always listen to the same volume all the time. It varies with genre for me.

post #9634 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonido View Post

Got my Quickie kit today! Finished up the board, about to start soldering, then found out the soldering kit I ordered was broken. The entire inside of the soldering station was ripped apart from the chassis so it was shaking loose. Gonna borrow my friend's tomorrow. Hopefully will be done tomorrow and will give impressions on how it sound with Emotiva and HE-500.
Excited to hear impressions! Can't wait!!!
post #9635 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_Himself View Post
 

 

You can't.

 

Double ended has less distortion since each amp will have to work less hard. You're working with SNR so it's less noise the less voltage you put through.

 

Why would you need to ask us how to level your volume? Only you really know what your ideal listening volume is and people don't always listen to the same volume all the time. It varies with genre for me.

 

Thanks Chris. I did not make it clear enough.

 

I was not asking about the ideal listening volume preferable to me.

 

I was basically asking how to compensate for the doubling of wattage available when driving balanced, so both SE and Balanced are being listened at the same objective SPL, as opposed to subjective volume levels.

 

Almost all the studies mention that louder always sound better when comparing A/B. Having the same Source>DAC>AMP>Cable>Headphone combo that can act as balanced or SE is a bonus for the SE Vs Balanced comparison. The only difference in such a situation would be the doubling of the power which should show the balanced setup in a better light compared to SE usage. My logic was that If we can compensate the power in volume levels in an objective way, then whatever perceived differences can be attributed to SE or Balanced set up. Only wondering how to objectively match the volume levels. May be a SPL meter? I do not have one nor do I know how to use it correctly with headphones. So I was wondering what need to be the volume compensation on the NFB 28 to get equal SPL.


Edited by VTV - 12/3/13 at 1:19am
post #9636 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin Morrow View Post

Everyone here... Eric Clapton - Unplugged.


Now.

Love that album on my HE-500s!! Particularly like to hear all detail in the background noise on the first track 'Signe' as they're all tuning up. One of my all time fave albums and I wouldn't even consider myself a blues fan!
post #9637 of 18022
Better go for AiC unplugged while I am at it.
post #9638 of 18022
VTV, this was just posted in the AD thread, you might find it to be useful information:
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrspeakers View Post

FWIW: recording studios like balanced gear because it intrinsically reduces pickup of hum and electrical noise/RFI through the long runs of wire that are used in the studios.  This is usually not terribly relevant to headphone DACs and amps (or it shouldn't be with a proper amp) with short cable runs and less electrically noisy environments.  That said, there is a more subtle secondary effect of truly balanced equipment: it tends to cancel at least some distortion artifacts if the circuit is fully symmetric.  That's theoretical though, and I don't know if it's ever been measured.  

For the Alphas, I personally have three single ended and three balanced amps, and each has it's own merits.  I feel that balanced vs single-ended is secondary to the quality of the amp circuit, power supply, and build quality.  You can find great amps with either topology, so focus on the sound you want, not balanced vs SE.   
post #9639 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethan7000 View Post

VTV, this was just posted in the AD thread, you might find it to be useful information:

 

Thanks, Ethan for the quoted text. I had read that while trying to read about the need for a balanced cable. In the end since I could convert my stock cables to balanced cheaply, I went balanced.

 

Anyway my rationale was different to the point raised by the quoted part. I was not trying to pick a new gear based on balanced vs. SE. Since my gear allows for listening both Balanced/SE, I thought I should know at least for the sake of learning. As I mentioned, balanced sound perceptibly better to me. However once the volume is adjusted while in SE listening, some of the differences seem less pronounced. I thought I will do a blind A/B with the help of my wife (because the sound of coupling and decoupling the male/female XLR connectors are a dead giveaway. though I can only guess wife's reaction though) to see how they compare. I thought I need to find a way to match the SPL somehow before comparing. 

 

Anyway, I found a crude way. There was this android app on my phone that measure SPL. I was thinking if I could keep both the headphone and phone unmoved and then just changed the volume levels (assuming there is no fluctuating ambient noise), perhaps I could arrive at roughly matched SPL and then use it as the reference point. Let's see :)


Edited by VTV - 12/3/13 at 10:50am
post #9640 of 18022
Oops double post. Deleted.
post #9641 of 18022
About halfway done soldering the Quickie. Gonna take a break but should take another 2 hours.
post #9642 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonido View Post

About halfway done soldering the Quickie. Gonna take a break but should take another 2 hours.


Dang, hurry up and finish, I want to hear impressions :3

post #9643 of 18022

Ok I'm stumped. Hopefully someone here with technical knowledge could help out. I finished building the Quickie and went straight to plugging it in without the various resistance checks cuz I'm impatient. :veryevil: Did the same thing when I finished the Crack, and it worked. Reckless I know.

 

Anyways the Quickie is ran off four 9v and two D cell batteries, not AC. When I put it all the batteries and powered it on, I found the tubes not to glow or get warm. I thought I had screwed up somewhere, but i went ahead and connected it up with my Emotiva. To my surprise it worked! Not only did it work, but there was no degradation in sound quality, and the volume knob on the Quickie worked as well. I found that the tubes were microphonic when I touched them. When I've used the WA7 as a preamp, turning off the WA7 would cause the sound to degrade in quality and crackle while lowering in volume as the tubes cooled down, but there are no such problems here. So I'm wondering if it's working or not. Perhaps the batteries aren't powerful enough to cause the tubes to glow or get hot? After all, a set of batteries are suppose to last over 100 hours.

post #9644 of 18022

^ sorry, I can't help you with this one.  Did you check the Quickie forum if there's one?

post #9645 of 18022
Quote:
Originally Posted by koiloco View Post
 

^ sorry, I can't help you with this one.  Did you check the Quickie forum if there's one?


Yup already posted a similar thread. Also wanted to add that the tubes may be glowing very dimly but they wrap this paper like material around it so it covers it up. I did turn off all the lights, and there's no glow at all. Also couldn't find a picture of the Quickie with an obvious glow.

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