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post #12631 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post
 

I really hate to say it, but cables can make a difference if your system is revealing enough...and I'm not talking mid fi HE-500 stuff. At least something like a LCD-3 on a $10,000 rig (NAD+Luxman) I've heard, there is a difference between the stock cable and my upgraded HPL silver and Norse copper. 

 

Although HE-500 on a Emotiva might not yield that. I certainly didn't feel much. Although the stock HE-500 cable was a pain in the ass to deal with physically.

IMO, at the most a headphone cable will form a low pass filter and supress high frequencies. If the capcitance in the cable forms a frequency corner in the RF, no human being is going to hear it, uber hifi or low fi, wont' make a difference. The amount of capacitance required at headphone impedances to intrude into the audio spectrum is rather large for such cables. You would have to find and purchase a really bad cable for this to happen.


Edited by StanD - 2/28/14 at 10:15am
post #12632 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post

I really hate to say it, but cables can make a difference if your system is revealing enough...and I'm not talking mid fi HE-500 stuff. At least something like a LCD-3 on a $10,000 rig (NAD+Luxman) I've heard, there is a difference between the stock cable and my upgraded HPL silver and Norse copper. 

Although HE-500 on a Emotiva might not yield that. I certainly didn't feel much. Although the stock HE-500 cable was a pain in the ass to deal with physically.
Thanks Thats what i also wanted to point out...and those tests people do to test if a cable can sound different or not..NEVER ever found a test done on really good stuff..most of them are done on midfi stuff or only measured on technical equipment...funny is that on higher end forums everyone..YES everyone...believes in cable improvements....the stories about cables not adding anything is put into the world by people who are only technical based or are biassed for mid-fi stuff... Or people owning higher end stuff are all deaf and have mass placebo sickness..and whyh do audio specilists only use high end cabling for their stuff and not just 1dollar cables? Oh well..this is a debate no one agrees on..so lets stop here... wink.gif
post #12633 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimanrookie View Post


Thanks Thats what i also wanted to point out...and those tests people do to test if a cable can sound different or not..NEVER ever found a test done on really good stuff..most of them are done on midfi stuff or only measured on technical equipment...funny is that on higher end forums everyone..YES everyone...believes in cable improvements....the stories about cables not adding anything is put into the world by people who are only technical based or are biassed for mid-fi stuff... Or people owning higher end stuff are all deaf and have mass placebo sickness..and whyh do audio specilists only use high end cabling for their stuff and not just 1dollar cables? Oh well..this is a debate no one agrees on..so lets stop here... wink.gif

The principles of passive networks is the first thing one learns in Electrical Engineering, very basic stuff. That's what happens with cables and headphones. You could use lamp cord and get the same results, OK, we're done for now. :D

You still waiting for that damned amp? And when's that mini-cooper getting delivered for your wife?

post #12634 of 16246

I'm going to make a HFM cable from some Mogami W2799 (and one for my Q701s, once I dertermine to correct pinouts for AKG; seems it's not standard).  If I don't butcher it too badly, and can't hear any difference, I may be selling my plusSounds cable.

post #12635 of 16246

Think of what capacitor's reactance is the same as the headphone's impedance, just to ball park it. In the case of an HE-500 the impedance curve is flat, it's resistive at 38 Ohms. You would need a 208 nF capacitance to have a 38 Ohm reactance at 20 kHz. That be a very long cable of the cheapest possible stuff.

post #12636 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post
 

I really hate to say it, but cables can make a difference if your system is revealing enough...and I'm not talking mid fi HE-500 stuff. At least something like a LCD-3 on a $10,000 rig (NAD+Luxman) I've heard, there is a difference between the stock cable and my upgraded HPL silver and Norse copper. 

 

Although HE-500 on a Emotiva might not yield that. I certainly didn't feel much. Although the stock HE-500 cable was a pain in the ass to deal with physically.

Most things can make a difference if your system is revealing enough and you have an acute-enough ear. At that point what matters is the magnitude of difference, and that goes back to my point that changing cables are a couple of magnitudes down in terms of sonic impact, relative to other things like changing amps (namely SS <-> tubes, as well as low power <-> high power) or earpads.

 

Even with the most revealing system, people with less analytical/acute hearing may still be unable to detect difference between cables, and end up falling into the placebo/nocebo trap.


Edited by jerg - 2/28/14 at 10:39am
post #12637 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThurstonX View Post
 

I'm going to make a HFM cable from some Mogami W2799 (and one for my Q701s, once I dertermine to correct pinouts for AKG; seems it's not standard).  If I don't butcher it too badly, and can't hear any difference, I may be selling my plusSounds cable.

It's a very low capitance and if it's as flexible as they say, you should be a happy camper. If you can learn to solder well, you can start your own custom cable business.

post #12638 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post

The principles of passive networks is the first thing one learns in Electrical Engineering, very basic stuff. That's what happens with cables and headphones. You could use lamp cord and get the same results, OK, we're done for now. biggrin.gif
You still waiting for that damned amp? And when's that mini-cooper getting delivered for your wife?
Amp is sent off today from the states. By usps..so hope to have it within 2weeks..mini cooper?..not this year..probably next year..if she is nice enough to me... wink.gif
as this year is big expenses on our new home (it will be finished in september) and i gave her carte blanche for the interior of the house...within our budget ofourse..so no credit card purchases! biggrin.gif so she is happy like a small kid... biggrin.gif
Edited by hifimanrookie - 2/28/14 at 10:59am
post #12639 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifimanrookie View Post


Amp is sent off today from the states. By usps..so hope to have it within 2weeks..mini cooper?..not this year..probably next year..if she is nice enough to me... wink.gif
as this year is big expenses on our new home (it will be finished in september) and i gave her carte blanche for the interior of the house...within our budget ofourse..so no credit card purchases! biggrin.gif so she is happy like a small kid... biggrin.gif

Wow, you must be really excited that the amp is actually on the way. I hope you left some money in the budget for a new Thurston Cable.

post #12640 of 16246

lol.  Here we are with the cable debate again.  :D

post #12641 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by koiloco View Post
 

lol.  Here we are with the cable debate again.  :D

So when are you placing an order for your Thurston Deluxe HE-500 cable? I wonder if he's going to throw in some custom monkey pads with the first 100 orders?

Edit: What I love about the guys that frequent this thread is that we can disagree without any bloody fighting.

post #12642 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post
 

Most things can make a difference if your system is revealing enough and you have an acute-enough ear. At that point what matters is the magnitude of difference, and that goes back to my point that changing cables are a couple of magnitudes down in terms of sonic impact, relative to other things like changing amps (namely SS <-> tubes, as well as low power <-> high power) or earpads.

 

Even with the most revealing system, people with less analytical/acute hearing may still be unable to detect difference between cables, and end up falling into the placebo/nocebo trap.

Exactly. Cables do make a difference, although not as much as changing power source (amps/dacs) or room treatment (ear pads). On top of that, some people may or may not be able to pick up on the subtle stuff.

 

That's why, it's best to check it out yourself and see if it's something that suits your preference and budget.

 

I'm just sharing my experiences. I'm not an electrical engineer so can't comment on the cables themselves, however I have worked in hearing labs so I try my best to not fall for typical bias to plague audio forums.

 

Cables, psychology, sound science always ends up pissing a few people off, so let's just leave it at that.

post #12643 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post

Wow, you must be really excited that the amp is actually on the way. I hope you left some money in the budget for a new Thurston Cable.
popcorn.gif
post #12644 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoom25 View Post
 

Exactly. Cables do make a difference, although not as much as changing power source (amps/dacs) or room treatment (ear pads). On top of that, some people may or may not be able to pick up on the subtle stuff.

 

That's why, it's best to check it out yourself and see if it's something that suits your preference and budget.

 

I'm just sharing my experiences. I'm not an electrical engineer so can't comment on the cables themselves, however I have worked in hearing labs so I try my best to not fall for typical bias to plague audio forums.

 

Cables, psychology, sound science always ends up pissing a few people off, so let's just leave it at that.

This may be the only thread I've seen where people discuss controversial issues without acting out or dissing each other.

post #12645 of 16246
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post

This may be the only thread I've seen where people discuss controversial issues without acting out or dissing each other.
Thats because we are not some bunch of ignorant unsocial alpha type of guys (and one lady.DSG)...most of us actually posses some kind of human intelligence and compassion and healthy normal thoughts..yeah we dont agree sometimes (read as: most of the times)...Some debates based on their technical experiences/background, some on their personal auditory experiences..buti agree..before bloodshed occurs we all know where to stop...and others based on the rigs they have...we are all different..but have one passion..listening to music..and that binds us..i have seen some nasty ringfights on threads in the time i am active in posting on several forums..and some even went as low as almost being punishable by law!!! Am glad we here..although some are one one extreme end of the audio corner and the other on the other extreme end with his believes..somehow we manage to go as far as possible towards the middle and not go any further...as we respect each other..no matter how crazy u think the other is..well..i think most of u guys are nuts and i am one of the most normal one....but thats personal..hehehehe biggrin.gif
Edited by hifimanrookie - 2/28/14 at 11:27am
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