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HiFiman HE-500 (HE as in High End) Proving to be an enjoyable experience in listening. . - Page 813

post #12181 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonido View Post
 


I'm pretty sure StanD doesn't believe in the extra power from a speaker amp is needed, and that the Schiit amps has enough juice to drive the HE-500 to ear popping levels. I don't have the technical know-how to explain what's special about the Emotiva beyond power, so I can't make an argument there.

 

Btw StanD, what's your view on current driving amps like the Bakoon HPA-21?


Hmmm, well if that is true Ill expect that he'll never own a Schiit Lyr since there would be no belief for the additional power.

post #12182 of 18030

This is a beast: http://www.luxman.com/product.php?pid=2

post #12183 of 18030

Regarding cables for the HE-500, do you guys think good quality cables make a difference? I mean the HE-500's already come with silver coated cables.

 

Nowadays people get the cables before they even get the cans.

post #12184 of 18030

I got a aftermarket for mine because I couldnt stand the stock cable. To stiff and brittle for me, just a real pain to deal with. 

post #12185 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by headphonatic View Post

Regarding cables for the HE-500, do you guys think good quality cables make a difference? I mean the HE-500's already come with silver coated cables.

Nowadays people get the cables before they even get the cans.
Yes it does make a difference if u have the rig for it to show it..(to be honest..any other ANALOG cable will make a difference then) but if ur rig is not higher end (=detaily).dont bother in spending hundreds of usd on a new cable Then, stick with the cables who only are better in esthetics (looks) and microphobics.. And if u do have a balanced rig..GO for 8wire cables instead of the standard 4wire ones.. Ur ears will find out what i mean if u do.. wink.gif my 123 ofcourse wink.gif

And dont forget..a cable has a longer lifespan then ur regular headphone...my first aftermarket (double helix) cable started out on my he300 and transfered to my he400... My second cable (toxic cables) went from the he400 to the he500... My last balanced cable (again toxic) went from he500 to the code-x i have now..but if i didnt buy this last canble in a emotion (yep again) i still would have my 4wire BW cable..and if i would stick with hifiman i would use it many years with other phones as well...
So a cable u buy for a long time..so keep in mind if u wanna upgrade ur headphone later..every decent cable builder doesnt mind putting other connectors on them afterwards if u do upgrade...like my powercables also...i will probably use them for at least 5years.... So investment wise a cable is not a bad deal wink.gif
post #12186 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonido View Post
 


I'm pretty sure StanD doesn't believe in the extra power from a speaker amp is needed, and that the Schiit amps has enough juice to drive the HE-500 to ear popping levels. I don't have the technical know-how to explain what's special about the Emotiva beyond power, so I can't make an argument there.

 

Btw StanD, what's your view on current driving amps like the Bakoon HPA-21?

Although you can get enormous power from a speaker amp, that's at 8 or 4 Ohms. At let's say 38 Ohms for an HE-500 they probably produce far less power as the voltage swing they can produce generates far less power at 38 Ohms.

P = E2/R

The amp can only deliver so much voltage, limited by the power supply and to a degree by the design. You can see from the above formula as the impedance or resistance increases the power decreases (reciprocal). 10V at 8 Ohms results in 12.5 Watts but at 38 Ohms results in 2.6 Watts. I'l take a guess that the Emotiva mini delivers around 10W or less at the HE-500's 38 Ohms.

Do you need that much power for an HE-500, nope. That doesn't mean the amp doesn't sound good. Some folks will get a Lepai and say that it can deliver similar power, only as the power increases the Lepai delivers more distortion and the Emotiva does not.

I wouldn't think that the Emotiva is something very special, sorry guys (Emotiva fans), but it is a good amp at a great price but it is not alone. As in most aspects of audio there is much hype, expectation and emotions involved. I like amps that do not rely on feedback to achieve low distortion but instead utilize careful meticulous design, often combined with simplicity. That's why I like the Asgard 2, no feedback in high gain and very little in low gain. As more feedback is used the risk for transient distortion increases. You notice that nobody specs transient distortion.

So how many of you can hear the difference between .001% THD and .01% THD? How about none of you. So don't get too bent out of shape by the marketing department. Remember some people want increased harmonic distortion, only not too much and it should be even order to get that warmth from tube amps. Myself, I prefer none so I lean towards SS.

I haven't listened to the Bakoon but I like the idea of open loop and since transistors are naturally current amplifying devices it's an interesting amp.

I think that

  • Odd Order Harmonic Distortion
  • Intermodulation Distortion (IM)
  • Transient Intermodulation Distortion (TIMD)

are things that bother our ears. There are many excellent amps at a wide range of prices that do an excellent job. IMO, we pose the biggest problems to our ears as bias, expectations, emotions, chatter and sometimes snobbery color what we think we hear. Yes if an amp has perceptible amounts of the 3 things that I bullet listed, that'll suck. Achieving a good flat FR is not hard to do. If I have to concentrate so much as to hear a minute difference and can't enjoy listening to music, I'm not going to lose my mind over it and will listen to the music instead. So I ask you, do you want to get into audio brinkmanship or do you want to enjoy listening to music? We can only perceive so much, beyond that IMO is left to those who enjoy chasing what cannot be truly heard. If that's someones hobby pursuit that's OK too, that's just not for me.

post #12187 of 18030
I like this StanD guy. Good guy talking schiit about the lepai. And good objective observations.
Though I will say that the emo has some addicting and very well synergized sound sig with the he500. Also, the extra power might not be needed, but the extra current is nice.
Edited by Nimzerz - 2/16/14 at 7:04pm
post #12188 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimzerz View Post

I like this StanD guy. Good guy talking schiit about the lepai. And good objective observations.
Though I will say that the emo has some addicting and very well synergized sound sig with the he500. Also, the extra power might not be needed, but the extra current is nice.

Keep in mind that the extra current will do nothing for your HE-500's. It's power (voltage and current), once you have enough for headroom and the distortion is low, the rest is emotional. What is important is that it works well and you are happy with it. Now if you're getting a pair of HE-6's the extra power is essential and your wallet will be empty.

post #12189 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Keep in mind that the extra current will do nothing for your HE-500's. It's power (voltage and current), once you have enough for headroom and the distortion is low, the rest is emotional. What is important is that it works well and you are happy with it. Now if you're getting a pair of HE-6's the extra power is essential and your wallet will be empty.


I've always wondered if the Emo is actually any good with the HE-6. And whether the HE-6 is worth having over the HE-500.

post #12190 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimzerz View Post
 


I've always wondered if the Emo is actually any good with the HE-6. And whether the HE-6 is worth having over the HE-500.

Getting an HE-6 might be a choice of what pleases you ears and what your wallet is willing to give up. You might not find enough of a difference to get worked up over. As in audio, try not to let the hype get to you, the HE-500 is no slouch.

post #12191 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Getting an HE-6 might be a choice of what pleases you ears and what your wallet is willing to give up. You might not find enough of a difference to get worked up over. As in audio, try not to let the hype get to you, the HE-500 is no slouch.


The only thing intriguing me is the better imaging and air (and maybe separation?). Though if this "air" is from increased treble then nty.

post #12192 of 18030

Yeah i'm curious in the HE-6 too

I've heard they are step up over the HE-500 when powered through speaker amps

Curious in the HD800 to, gotta get me some of dat high end dynamic sound

post #12193 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimzerz View Post
 


The only thing intriguing me is the better imaging and air (and maybe separation?). Though if this "air" is from increased treble then nty.

Increasing treble is not in my playbook. If you rob a bank you can look at an SR-009 and the accompanying electronics. I don't think you'll be getting Internet in the slammer so streaming music and Head-Fi will be a no go. :D

We're always looking for something new, aren't we. That's probably why my Bifrost will be here tomorrow, at least it better be this time. You hear me Amazon.

post #12194 of 18030
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Increasing treble is not in my playbook. If you rob a bank you can look at an SR-009 and the accompanying electronics. I don't think you'll be getting Internet in the slammer so streaming music and Head-Fi will be a no go. :D

We're always looking for something new, aren't we. That's probably why my Bifrost will be here tomorrow, at least it better be this time. You hear me Amazon.

Why get a new DAC when it introduces so little distortion compared to an amp? :p

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimzerz View Post


The only thing intriguing me is the better imaging and air (and maybe separation?). Though if this "air" is from increased treble then nty.

Increased treble is quite relaitve.. Don't be close minded, there are many things to it. But of course if the HE-500 is your ideal treble, then it won't get better.

 

Personally if I were to go flagship territory I'd either go hd800 or electrostatic.


Edited by davidsh - 2/16/14 at 7:42pm
post #12195 of 18030

For those wondering about the HE-500 and Asgard, IMO it's nothing special(mine was paired with bifrost). If you want an amplifier and that's the price you are willing to pay, it's fine compared to other options. It's strengths include detail and air, and its weaknesses are a certain kind of thin-ness throughout the range as well as a lack of weight/dynamics. I'd say it's pretty typical of a SS amp in that price range. Obviously the bifrost was a step up from what I had previously owned which was a fiio e7. I dont think those qualities play to the HE-500's strengths personally though. I also felt the bifrost was "too good" for the Asgard.  Not sure about the asgard 2 or the uberfrost, but I would imagine similar characteristics.  I imagine whatever phones they used to test the Asgard with gets easily congested, however I don't find that happens with the HE-500 so maybe that's the reason for the thin sound.  Obviously just my opinion. I owned the combo for about 6 months.

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