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Schiit Lyr - The tube rolling thread - Page 292  

post #4366 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSkool View Post


Thank you very much! Your experiences are always helpful to us.

A pair of mid-60's Mullard "large shield, halo getter" CV-2493's arrived yesterday. The mids are indeed very nice and sound exactly like a newer early-70's "dimple-getter" version I have. However, the older Mullards have slightly better bass, to my delight. They also run a little cooler than the Amperex Orange Globe 6DJ8's that I'm used to. Very nice, indeed.

In general, if possible , the oldest D getters sound the best with tube warmth but without overly distorting the sound.
Newer valves with O getters and silver shields seem to sound sonically leaner.
post #4367 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Soth View Post


Mullards have even more warmth in the mids than Amperex valves.
If your system is too bright sounding, they could be just the ticket to audio nirvana.
Here's a rough scale of the various ECC88/E88CC/7308/PCC88 family of tubes I have rolled.
Most lean sounding are Chinese ( Yucky over brightness) valves.
German valves are lean but not too overly bright. Telefunkens are lean but they do something wonderful to the midrange. Their weakness is the lack of bass especially Siemens CCA.
Lorenz valves are linear but have great bass.
Amperex/Philips have more warmth, just right for most people hence their popularity.
Mullards have even more warmth. They are like the Russian valves with plenty of warmth.
The difference between Mullards and Russians is that there is greater distortion or sonic veil for the Russian valves.
Even amongst Mullards, there is a difference between Blackburn and Mitcham factories. Most people claim that Blackburn Mullards sound better.
Within each type, e.g. Mullards.
ECC88/PCC88 have the widest soundstage and most impactful bass.
6922 are a stepup in terms of sonic transparency and seem to lift a veil off the sound.
7308s seem to have the quietest backgrounds and are most suited for preamp use.
These are my general observations.

 

Great input, thanks. 

 

Matched sets of Mullard 6922s can go for $250. so it seems like the Amperex Orange Globes are a great 'compromise'. To me, they don't even seem like a compromise at all give how much less they cost yet how much better than the stock Lyr tubes they sound. ;)

post #4368 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Soth View Post

In general, if possible , the oldest D getters sound the best with tube warmth but without overly distorting the sound.
Newer valves with O getters and silver shields seem to sound sonically leaner.

IYO: Over stock, what is the best "bang for the buck" valve?
post #4369 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnothim View Post


IYO: Over stock, what is the best "bang for the buck" valve?

 

In general, PCC88s are really good value.

Normal retail price for Siemens PCC88 is US$50 per piece.

On Ebay, you can usually get them for much less.

 

More details over here :-

http://www.upscaleaudio.com/pages/6922-Tube-Types.html

 

The PCC88s made by Siemens are really good value.

They are linear sounding with good extension at the bottom (i.e has bass) and at the top (i.e. has treble).

 

Older Version and best sounding (i.e. with the good old tube warmth) sample here :-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Siemens-PCC88-PCC-88-Audio-Tube-Made-in-Munich-Grey-Shield-NOS-/320982659803?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item4abc0eb2db

 

Newer version (less tube warmth) sample here:-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4x-TELEFUNKEN-SIEMENS-PCC88-7DJ8-ECC88-SUB-SILVER-SHIELDS-NOSIB-/290823567553?pt=Vintage_Electronics_R2&hash=item43b66f78c1

 

Siemens PCC88s are also packaged like the "famous" Telefunken E288CCs.

These are all made by Siemens if they don't have the <> at the bottom.

Another sample of a Telefunken (actually Siemens PCC88) over here

http://www.upscaleaudio.com/products/Telefunken-PCC88-%7B47%7D-7DJ8.html

 

From all the rave reviews posted on Upscale, you can see how well received they are.

Altho' some of those reviewers had no inkling that they were actually talking about Siemens PCC88!! ;)

 

For the Telefunken PCC88s made by the actual Telefunken with <> at the bottom, sample over here :-

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Telefunken-PCC88-7DJ8-matched-quad-x4-THE-BEST-/200853977064?pt=UK_Sound_Vision_Valves_Vacuum_Tubes&hash=item2ec3d477e8

 

The midrange is really sweet. Only problem I have (with these) is the lack of bass.

But if you just listen to Jazz vocals, the Telefunken <> PCC88s are really good value.

 

BTW, the best PCC88 of all is the Lorenz Stuttgart variety.

The sonic veil is almost non-existent, unless you compare with the 6922 variety.

post #4370 of 8735

Yeah, I thought I'd chime in about the cv2492/cv2493 mullards.  They really are a different breed compared to the likes of amperex and siemen tubes.  They are just so smooth and mid/low heavy....don't get me wrong, they are detailed at the same time but does not have the transparency of the amperex tubes that you guys are discussing (I haven't tried that 6922, soon though soon)......cv2493/cv2492 is a really solid choice IMO to get that "tube amp" ish sound most people crave.

post #4371 of 8735
This thread is great. Folks with experience taking the time to provide detailed information as well as opinions without making us noob's feel like we're a buch of dimwits.

It's refreshing compared to some other threads.

Kudos.
post #4372 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by sensui123 View Post

Yeah, I thought I'd chime in about the cv2492/cv2493 mullards.  They really are a different breed compared to the likes of amperex and siemen tubes.  They are just so smooth and mid/low heavy....don't get me wrong, they are detailed at the same time but does not have the transparency of the amperex tubes that you guys are discussing (I haven't tried that 6922, soon though soon)......cv2493/cv2492 is a really solid choice IMO to get that "tube amp" ish sound most people crave.


Good insight! The '67 CV2493's that I listened to this morning were indeed smooooth. I was actually surprised at hearing a bit more bass than I expected. Aren't these Mullard military CV2492s/93s supposed to be 10,000 hour tubes? Maybe not, but it seems I read that somewhere.

 

Just rolled in a set of '70 Amperex 6DJ8 A-frames (white lettering, red RCA stamped on them) and these guys are more "in your face". Still nice tubes, sound is similar to the 6DJ8 Amperex Orange Globes.

 

I love this thread also. Nobody preaching, just lots of great info. popcorn.gif

post #4373 of 8735

Late this afternoon, I stayed with the Amperex 6DJ8 A-frames but switched from the HE-500 to the HD650. The presentation went from "in your face" to "oh my God". Mids are perfect, bass is tight, Treble very nice, and the soundstage widened.

 

I gotta agree with Olor1N and Lamnothim and MattTCG and the rest of you guys....the Amperex 6DJ8 orange globes have very, very nice synergy with the HD650's. As always, YMMV. wink_face.gif

 

Also, I just have to thank my wife for the best week of vacation I have had in a great while. She graciously allowed me to spend the entire week just listening to my headphones and playing with all these funny-looking glass tubes. Gotta love that! biggrin.gif
 

post #4374 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSkool View Post

Late this afternoon, I stayed with the Amperex 6DJ8 A-frames but switched from the HE-500 to the HD650. The presentation went from "in your face" to "oh my God". Mids are perfect, bass is tight, Treble very nice, and the soundstage widened.

I gotta agree with Olor1N and Lamnothim and MattTCG and the rest of you guys....the Amperex 6DJ8 orange globes have very, very nice synergy with the HD650's. As always, YMMV. wink_face.gif

Also, I just have to thank my wife for the best week of vacation I have had in a great while. She graciously allowed me to spend the entire week just listening to my headphones and playing with all these funny-looking glass tubes. Gotta love that! biggrin.gif

 

I am so glad you posted about the HE500.
I was going back and forth before deciding on the HD650's.  I was drawn to the planer concept.  Then I looked at the Head-Fi ranking and picked what I thought was a safe choice. 

 I'm glad I chose the Senn's.  Besides sonics an attribute with almost equal weigh to me is comfort.  I figured I would want to listen for many hours.  The HiFi Man and Aldeze look a bit heavy and bulky.  

To my question,  I'm already zeroing in on Phase II   Probably the HD800.  they are said to be amazingly comfortable.  How will they matchup sonically  with a Lyr and Amprex 6922 USA?  
post #4375 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by sensui123 View Post

Yeah, I thought I'd chime in about the cv2492/cv2493 mullards.  They really are a different breed compared to the likes of amperex and siemen tubes.  They are just so smooth and mid/low heavy....don't get me wrong, they are detailed at the same time but does not have the transparency of the amperex tubes that you guys are discussing (I haven't tried that 6922, soon though soon)......cv2493/cv2492 is a really solid choice IMO to get that "tube amp" ish sound most people crave.

Those Mullard valves are also a favorite of the famous Skylab over here.
They have a well deserved rep in these parts.
post #4376 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSkool View Post


I love this thread also. Nobody preaching, just lots of great info. popcorn.gif

+1
This is the greatest thread ever on ECC88 and related valves.

Lots of useful info!

And pleasant company too smily_headphones1.gif
post #4377 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnothim View Post


To my question,  I'm already zeroing in on Phase II   Probably the HD800.  they are said to be amazingly comfortable.  How will they matchup sonically  with a Lyr and Amprex 6922 USA?  

Unfortunately, I have never heard the HD800's.

 

But if you trust Olor1N (and you should), hang onto those Bugle Boys you bought. He says the HD800/BB pairing is special.

post #4378 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Soth View Post


+1
This is the greatest thread ever on ECC88 and related valves.
Lots of useful info!
And pleasant company too smily_headphones1.gif


My feelings as well. Cheers! beerchug.gif

post #4379 of 8735
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldSkool View Post

Unfortunately, I have never heard the HD800's.

But if you trust Olor1N (and you should), hang onto those Bugle Boys you bought. He says the HD800/BB pairing is special.

Yeah. I remember.
Even though they take up a lot of room, I'll probably keep em .
post #4380 of 8735

Anybody using these?

 

 

700

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