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Anything in current production that can match the Xin SuperMicro (size/quality/price)? - Page 2

post #16 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aflac View Post

It may not have to be a copy of the design but I'm frankly shocked that in the five or six years since Xin came out with the SuperMicro, no one's been able to come even close to the density of performance/size the micro has (besides maybe Ray Samuels, but he still has a ways to go in the size). I will make a note that I've never heard the SuperMicro but all the reviews I've read about it are raving, and I don't recall reading many negative reviews about it. Maybe amp designers are wary of making an amp that small, since small is usually equated with cheap?

 

As for the copying argument, there are plenty of chinese amp makers that have no shame copying other designs - the Matrix M-stage/Lovely Cube, Grant Fidelity, HLLY, etc etc. Sure, these are desktop-sized amps, but there's plenty of portable amp makers.

 

Given the size of the SuperMicro I'm a little bit surprised that you can even fit $100 worth of parts in there, much less $190. I wonder what the parts of the SM actually cost. IMO if someone decides to "copy" the design there's probably a lot of money in it for them.


I very sure the components of SMIV is not worth $100. But in audio, we are paying for their R&D and sound wink_face.gif

 

The copying part, I'm sure most of us will go with the more reputable/original maker. There is reason why those shameless makers did not make the mark. Even Little Dot, a chinese base company is being copy. eek.gif

 

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post #17 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aflac View Post

It may not have to be a copy of the design but I'm frankly shocked that in the five or six years since Xin came out with the SuperMicro, no one's been able to come even close to the density of performance/size the micro has (besides maybe Ray Samuels, but he still has a ways to go in the size). I will make a note that I've never heard the SuperMicro but all the reviews I've read about it are raving, and I don't recall reading many negative reviews about it. Maybe amp designers are wary of making an amp that small, since small is usually equated with cheap?

 

As for the copying argument, there are plenty of chinese amp makers that have no shame copying other designs - the Matrix M-stage/Lovely Cube, Grant Fidelity, HLLY, etc etc. Sure, these are desktop-sized amps, but there's plenty of portable amp makers.

 

Given the size of the SuperMicro I'm a little bit surprised that you can even fit $100 worth of parts in there, much less $190. I wonder what the parts of the SM actually cost. IMO if someone decides to "copy" the design there's probably a lot of money in it for them.


Exactly.  This is why I'm actually somewhat skeptical about how 'amazing' the product is.  Perhaps as a package but others have said the current lineup of amps is comparable or even better.  Not sure who is in the right there.  I'm just wary that there is an element of nostalgia involved in hyping the sound of the SM.  Not sure, just wondering.  It makes no sense that something so 'special' hasn't been copied in some way.

 

As for lawsuits that's just common corporate business practice and Apple gets sued all the time.  Pretty normal stuff and usually has nothing to do w/ ethics or copyright.  Usually a business tactic to drain your competitors resources.  Why pay and keep a legal staff if they aren't suing anybody?  Surely not to debate ethics.

 

post #18 of 28


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by theory_87 View Post

 

The copying part, I'm sure most of us will go with the more reputable/original maker.


In this case there isn't one.  The point is there isn't even a choice between vendors.  Again, why?  Market forces are just more powerful than ethics or brand loyalty IME.  

 

post #19 of 28
Thread Starter 

If Xin came back and produced SuperMicro amps again (or any of his other amps) I would gladly pick one up as long as I would receive it in a somewhat-timely manner. As it stands I can't even get my hands on one if I wanted one. This is the point where a cloner can come in and take up the hole in the market - a high performance, but very tiny amplifier. The design is there. While amps like the iBasso T3 might be almost as small, I don't believe they're anywhere near the SM in sound quality, and I'm going to stick by this comment until someone comes in here and says otherwise.

post #20 of 28

The Super Micro has a couple of parts that even surprised Xin. The performance looked good on paper but seemed to exceed that in actual use. The design is so very simple but was everything needed, almost to perfection in a tiny and simple package. 

post #21 of 28


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aflac View Post

While amps like the iBasso T3 might be almost as small, I don't believe they're anywhere near the SM in sound quality, and I'm going to stick by this comment until someone comes in here and says otherwise.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFlight View Post

My iBasso T3 is very comparable to my Xin Supermicro and is of a comparable size if volume is considered rather than shape.    Plus you can get a T3 and you can't get a Micro!

 

So which one of you needs your ears upgraded?
 

post #22 of 28
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LingLing1337 View Post


 

 

 

 

So which one of you needs your ears upgraded?
 


Whoops. Think my eyes need to be upgraded first... rolleyes.gif

 

post #23 of 28

Because the price is so low on the T3 and it has been out now for what, 1.5 years or so, I don't think it gets the respect it should. Frankly with phones of decent sensitivity, it is a very open and musical headphone amp. The SuperMicro has transparency that is excellent but so does the T3. 

post #24 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post


 


In this case there isn't one.  The point is there isn't even a choice between vendors.  Again, why?  Market forces are just more powerful than ethics or brand loyalty IME.  

 


there is

 

http://www.littledot.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1021

 

HLLY is one of them

 

post #25 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by theory_87 View Post


there is

 

http://www.littledot.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1021

 

HLLY is one of them

 


You lost me.  I don't get what that forum thread had to do with the Xin.  Somebody mentioned getting scammed by HLLY whoever that is.  I don't see anything like a Xin supermicro on their site.  Confused....

post #26 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post




You lost me.  I don't get what that forum thread had to do with the Xin.  Somebody mentioned getting scammed by HLLY whoever that is.  I don't see anything like a Xin supermicro on their site.  Confused....


 

Sorry. I indeed lost you. my bad. I'm inferring that such imitation/rip off does exist. But not for Xin amp afaik. All in the nutshell, I'm trying to bring across my earlier point.

"Every amp maker have their own design philosophy. They wants to be recognize and and be unique in their own way. Also, it unethical to copy others work."

 

Back to your initial question.

 

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post


 


In this case there isn't one.  The point is there isn't even a choice between vendors.  Again, why?  Market forces are just more powerful than ethics or brand loyalty IME.  

 

 

It could be due to a brand value and profit margin. As a manufacturer, if people perceive your brand as high value, there is no point devaluing that perception. And since the sales is unaffected by the high price point, why decrease the price and earn less profit?

 

post #27 of 28

All this talk made me go and dig out my Xin Micro I (transparent blue) as I was happily listening to my iPod Classic (7G)+Solo+Pico Slim+JH13s (stock cable; Twag V2 in the shop).  It's been ages since I listened to the Micro (with its never depleting Enloop AAA!).  Bad mistake, this little bugger is amazing!  My current amp rotation is either the Slim or RWA Shadow.

 

My first very impressionistic reaction is that the Micro maybe not as open on the top, but there is a warmth about this amp that I like.  The instrument separation is amazing (listening to Tchaikovsky 4) but placement not quite as precise as the Slim (of course the Solo plays a pretty big role here).  Bass about the same.

 

Simply put, I am going to put the Micro back into rotation.   I think it's testament to the amp building skills of Xin.  I really wonder what amps he would build today would be like.  He was, in the time, one of the best.

post #28 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamato8 View Post

Because the price is so low on the T3 and it has been out now for what, 1.5 years or so, I don't think it gets the respect it should. Frankly with phones of decent sensitivity, it is a very open and musical headphone amp. The SuperMicro has transparency that is excellent but so does the T3. 



mrarroyo recommended this amp to me about a year ago and I couldn't behappier with it  Glorious sound and the geometry mates perfectly with an older Nano  Great little amp

 

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