Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Dedicated Source Components › Logitech's Squeezebox Touch - opinions sought on quality
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Logitech's Squeezebox Touch - opinions sought on quality - Page 8

post #106 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle00Jesse View Post

I have two pretty basic questions for you sbt owners out there.

1. After the initial server setup and scan of your computer for files, does the computer have to be ON and running for the sbt to play your files over the home wifi connection? My laptop is big and clunky and the battery is completely shot, this would be a deal breaker.

2. Can the sbt play files from 2 different computers, or is it locked to one? I could probably just put them on an external, but I stepped on the screen and can barely see a **** thing. It would be clutch if I can just do a quick scan with squeezebox server and have all files from both the broken laptop and my working but terrible laptop That would be ideal.

Thanks
1. Yes, the PC has to be on, unless you plug a USB drive directly to it. However that's not convenient since the sbt will have to run the squeezecentre and it is quite slow when scanning etc.
2. In the menu you choose what library you want to stream from, so that means you can hook it up to both, but one at the time only. Hook up the PC's via LAN to the router and then you may use wifi to the sbt. LAN all the way is supposed to be best however.

Gear mentioned in this thread:

post #107 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post


1. Yes, the PC has to be on, unless you plug a USB drive directly to it. However that's not convenient since the sbt will have to run the squeezecentre and it is quite slow when scanning etc.
2. In the menu you choose what library you want to stream from, so that means you can hook it up to both, but one at the time only. Hook up the PC's via LAN to the router and then you may use wifi to the sbt. LAN all the way is supposed to be best however.


I run my Touch self-contained when I take it to the office or when I go to meets.  Yes, it is slower and the interface is clunky, and it is always a pain to convince the Touch that it no longer has a server.  But once it's running it sounds fine.  I can run it for weeks in this configuration with no problems.  You do NOT need a PC on when running self-contained, but it is picky about the type of USB drive used (long thread about this on the slimserver forums).  With the right drive and once configured for self-contained mode, it works fine this way.

 

As far as sound quality goes, you're on your own.  Personally, when using a DAC I can't tell a difference with the Touch in self-contained mode vs. connected via ethernet to my home network running squeezecenter on a Windows Home Server.

 

YMMV

 


Edited by DeadEars - 7/21/11 at 6:02am
post #108 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post

I just ordered the clock circuit from Fidelity Audio:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Squeezebox-Touch-twin-output-Micro-low-jitter-clock-/270652188684

- and not the extra five capacitors and labour costing me £115 plus shipment of the SBT.

Since I am only going to use the SBT as digital player (coax out) to a DAC, there is no point in going for a Bolder Cables upgrade for me.

Reviews of PSU upgrades for the SBT that I have read, say that upgrading the PSU just barely improves the analog out, and is totally wasted for digital out.

The Audio-GD Digital Interface doesn't take 88.2kHz files, so that made the decision easy for me.

 

 

 

Hi LarsHP,

 

What is your personal assessment about the low-jitter-clock mod ?

Did the overall performance of the SBT - Audio GD combo with red book files playback improved significantly ?

 

Thanks in advance for your feedback.

 

Dino.
 

 

post #109 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle00Jesse View Post

Can you elaborate on slightly above average with no mods? Reason i ask is because I'm trying to make a decision on a transport for my new system. I still need to get an amp/dac which will be the next battle, but i really want to solidify the transport. I'm deciding between the SBT and an Onkyo SACD player C-s5VL. I have a good amount of CDs that aren't ripped, but also a lot of random FLAC files scattered around my computer. I'm really not well versed in computer audio or hooking up different sources to an amp etc, and doing all sorts of mods. I'm a 'by the book' kind of guy. Which do you think might be best for me? SACD player looks cool because it has a decent dac and i'd be interested in trying some SACDs. But at the same time, the best audio I've heard yet to date (sadly) is flac via usb to my fiio E7/E9 combo to my Sony SA5ks. I'm mulling over the purchase of a nfb-2 or 3 and a Schiit amp. Do you think the squeezebox might be my best route? or should i take the plunge and get the Onkyo which is about $70 more?

 

Thanks in advance  

 

Slightly above average, I mean literally. It has quite good sound, but lacking some refinement. After mods, its really up there with the best.  As far as SACD vs Touch, I would say that a very good SACD player like Marantz top of the line $6000 + model, is a very nice player. Lesser SACD players may not give you what you hope for. Really cheap SACD players may sound worse than a midrange CD player. The Touch partnered with a good DAC and power supply and soundcheck mods will be competitive with the $5000 + players. In other words, it competes well above its price range.

 

SACD has a good but limited range of titles, and then you must feed the player with expensive SACD discs. The touch will play high resolution (DVD-A) rips as well as legally downloaded 24/96 recordings. As well as CDs. If cost was no object for me, I'd still buy the touch based on sound quality alone, but when you take into account all the other stuff it can do like internet radio. It ends up being a no brainer.


 

 

post #110 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitor Teixeira View Post

Well, right now i'm convincing myself i won't need a SB Touch, since i use the Airport Express and i feel that i won't hear any diference at all, can anyone who've heard both side by side chime in?

(My setup is: iMac > AE > Lyngdorf TDAi > Xavian XN-250 Evo) controlled via iPad.

 

have not heard them side by side, but the express converts (upsamples) all files to 48khz output, so there is an unwanted conversion taking place. It does not play native 44.1khz as 44.1khz. It also down samples 96khz to 48khz.

I have no doubt whatsoever that the touch is a way better transport for audio. Whether you will hear the difference in your system, depends upon whether you are sensitive to changes in the sound of your system, and whether your system is "good" enough to hear the difference.

 

Anyone planning to use the touch totally stock with the original power supply should not expect any massive improvement to sound, just buy it for its convienience and internet radio, and competent sound.

If you want "audiophile" sound, you must upgrade the power supply.


 

 

post #111 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post


Reviews of PSU upgrades for the SBT that I have read, say that upgrading the PSU just barely improves the analog out, and is totally wasted for digital out.

 

 

IMO Those reviews are very wrong. A better power supply will improve the digital output very much.
 

 

post #112 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by erin View Post



IMO Those reviews are very wrong. A better power supply will improve the digital output very much.
 

 

 

 

Hi Erin,

 

I hardly perceived big differences between my Welborne Labs PSU and the stock one in digital mode, whatever the DAC used.

What is your own PSU and did you experience other hardware mods ?

At the contrary, I got stunning results with the Soundcheck soft mods.

 

Kind regards,

 

Dino.
 

 


Edited by Dinosaure77 - 7/26/11 at 12:24am
post #113 of 314

.


Edited by Dynobot - 7/31/11 at 6:28am
post #114 of 314

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarsHP View Post

I just ordered the clock circuit from Fidelity Audio:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/Squeezebox-Touch-twin-output-Micro-low-jitter-clock-/270652188684

- and not the extra five capacitors and labour costing me £115 plus shipment of the SBT.

Since I am only going to use the SBT as digital player (coax out) to a DAC, there is no point in going for a Bolder Cables upgrade for me.

Reviews of PSU upgrades for the SBT that I have read, say that upgrading the PSU just barely improves the analog out, and is totally wasted for digital out.

The Audio-GD Digital Interface doesn't take 88.2kHz files, so that made the decision easy for me.

I'm interested in the clock circuit also but before ordering I'd like to find a step by step installation method.  I'd also like to know if there are any downsides to this mod and if it significantly improves the sound. In other words - I don't want to spend money, risk screwing up my Touch for a "the sound appears to have improved slightly" result.

post #115 of 314

I spent the day trying out my ALSA real-time kernel mods on the Touch. Normally I use it for a dual core Atom D510 but unfortunately the Touch uses a much smaller and weaker ARM processor. 

 

When you try to increase the priority of a audio thread or process it will decrease latency but at the same time it will increase cpu load, so its kind of a trade off. With a dual core Atom processor the cpu load is negligible so its worth it. 

 

The ARM processor is a different story, it can not handle a bunch of processes running at very high "99" priority. I isolated the "audio threads", the "real-time clock IRQ", and the "spdif IRQ".  The end result was that adjusting only the spdif to top priority 99 seemed to sound the best. Much clearer vocals, more open and clean sound stage, lows go deeper and clearer.

post #116 of 314

Update...

 

After I reduced my buffer down to 3600 as recommended by Soundcheck instead of using the default 20000 I am able to implement full real-time scheduling to the real-time clock, audio threads and the spdif with good results.

 

I'm going to be playing around with the values for awhile to see how low I can get the buffer before I get xruns.  On my Atom D510 machine I am able to reduce the buffer down to were the period size is near 0. I doubt if the ARM processor can handle that but we shall see..!!!

 

Once I get finished with all this I will send the Touch out to Audiocom for the Level 2 mod and ask if they can hard wire a 75ohm resistor and cable to the Touch. Like a 75 ohm BNC pig-tail.

post #117 of 314

Squeezebox Touch default process scheduling.

 

/root$ ps -eLo pid,cls,rtprio,pri,nice,cmd | grep -i "irq"
    4  FF     40  80   - [sirq-high/0]
    5  FF     40  80   - [sirq-timer/0]
    6  FF     40  80   - [sirq-net-tx/0]
    7  FF     40  80   - [sirq-net-rx/0]
    8  FF     40  80   - [sirq-block/0]
    9  FF     89 129   - [sirq-tasklet/0]
   10  FF     40  80   - [sirq-sched/0]
   11  FF     40  80   - [sirq-hrtimer/0]
   12  FF     40  80   - [sirq-rcu/0]
   49  FF     90 130   - [IRQ-34]
   99  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-14]
  116  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-10]
  125  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-42]
  126  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-41]
  236  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-22]
  258  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-57]
  264  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-33]
  305  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-37]
  334  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-122]
  346  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-17]
  351  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-123]
  356  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-7]
  358  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-102]
  359  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-8]
  367  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-47]
  385  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-11]
  395  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-12]
  407  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-25]
  416  FF     40  80   - [IRQ-45]
 1341  TS      -  19   0 grep -i irq


Edited by Dynobot - 8/2/11 at 7:09am
post #118 of 314

Results can be found here:

 

https://sites.google.com/site/computeraudioorg/squeezebox-touch-tweaks

 

Edit: Created a separate page for the Touch because I have a few more tweaks in mind.


Edited by Dynobot - 8/2/11 at 5:22pm
post #119 of 314

Now figure out one for the Transporter, and if it works well I'll give you a cookie.  Although in truth, I don't think it would make much difference in my case since the thing is so severely modded.

post #120 of 314

Dynobot, I tried your tweaks and agree they are nicely beneficial! The soundstage images better and the music flows more naturally beerchug.gif

 

Where can one learn more about the ALSA and OS commands you and Soundcheck are using to make these setting changes? 

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Dedicated Source Components

Gear mentioned in this thread:

Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Dedicated Source Components › Logitech's Squeezebox Touch - opinions sought on quality