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If you still love Etymotic ER4, this is the thread for you... - Page 114

post #1696 of 4666
Might as well ask gnarlsagan too lol.

Loudness is not the sole determinant of perceived bass quantity. You want to see the performance over time to get a sense of how long and at what levels it lingers, for lack of a better word, at those frequencies.
post #1697 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

 

Not really - it is only ~2 db louder at 100 Hz.

 

I don't mean they are louds louder in the bass area.  They are both relatively flat.  I just mean, I feel the need to eq the ety's a bit for sub bass.  I eq the hd600 DOWN in the mid bass.  Not much.  As you say, only a few db.  It helps open up the rest of the frequencies just a bit.  Personally, I find that even a few db of change can a noticeable difference.  So in that regard the hd600 are more "noticeably" bassy overall if you will.  But they are both much more level and flat bass than all the multitudes of phones out there. :-P

post #1698 of 4666
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vwinter View Post

Might as well ask gnarlsagan too lol.

Loudness is not the sole determinant of perceived bass quantity. You want to see the performance over time to get a sense of how long and at what levels it lingers, for lack of a better word, at those frequencies.

 

While longer decay may certainly create the perception of more bass, I think that decay mostly affects bass quality though. Perception of quantity is mostly affected by volume level IMO. Also, many people don't get a good seal with many IEMs, hence the bass issues. With flat IEMs like Etys, a poor seal is especially detrimental as it turns the sound from neutral and just right to clearly bass deficient.

post #1699 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by luisdent View Post

Since we're on an appreciation thread here, I just thought I'd post another song I think sounds awesome with the er4s.

 

Using the bass EQ I posted earlier this sounds great:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCK_yrvKaz4

 

It is a prime example of why I love the treble of the er4s so much.  The depth of the reverb is so nice during the part that starts at 3:20.  It gets nice and deep around 3:45.  Even the pfe112, which has a nice open sound can't compare with the depth.  The peaks in the treble sort of mask the depth of the overall treble a bit.  I haven't heard an earphone that makes me feel all dreamy listening to stuff like that.

 

Make sure to set it to 1080p.  That eq setting should give you a nice balanced thumping bass too. :-)  Even at 1080 though, it isn't the purest quality.  My itunes copy is better.  Can't wait for the CD. :P

 

That song sounds glorious. I'll have to get the album when it comes out. Well recorded edm sounds so good on the ER4S, like Daft Punk's album Alive 2007. The bass is huge, so big I'm sure it would sound bloated and terrible on anything else.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

Why?

 

BTW, I have the HD650 here and, to my ears, the Etys are definitely more linear in the lows with less roll off in the sub bass vs higher bass. HD650 has a significantly stronger mid bass, but is actually around the Ety level of volume in the sub bass, if not less. The bass quality and extension of the Etys definitely surpasses the Senns and is more comparable to that of HE-500 to my ears.

 

 

Yep, sub bass performance is probably the major weakness of the Senn HD600 series. That doesn't mean that they have poor bass though, because with a lot of music, there isn't much going on below 50-60 Hz anyway.

 

I heard the HE-500 at a meet but I don't remember it very well. How comparable is its FR to the ER4S? 

post #1700 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

While longer decay may certainly create the perception of more bass, I think that decay mostly affects bass quality though. Perception of quantity is mostly affected by volume level IMO. Also, many people don't get a good seal with many IEMs, hence the bass issues. With flat IEMs like Etys, a poor seal is especially detrimental as it turns the sound from neutral and just right to clearly bass deficient.

Well, what's the point of using the word performance when it's unrelated to quality. But thats not my real point.

Hypothetically, since we're just using performance to mean volume, imagine the ER4 starts at 6db above the HD600 at 20Hz and in 3 ms drops off to well below while the HD600 keeps on at nearly the same level for 5ms before smoothly dropping off. Which would probably sound "bassier?"
Edited by vwinter - 6/13/13 at 4:39pm
post #1701 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

 

While longer decay may certainly create the perception of more bass, I think that decay mostly affects bass quality though. Perception of quantity is mostly affected by volume level IMO. Also, many people don't get a good seal with many IEMs, hence the bass issues. With flat IEMs like Etys, a poor seal is especially detrimental as it turns the sound from neutral and just right to clearly bass deficient.

 

I think they've lost a lot of petential er4s fans due to this. :-/

 

For anyone interested.  Here are the EQ settings for the ipod touch Denon application.  I tried to read them as good as possible, but in order to see the values you have to click the dots, which moves them a bit.  But I think I have them almost perfect.  You should know when your EQ looks similar to mine...

 

 

 

16k -3.6db

220 -3.6db

150 -2.7db

105 -1.3db

65 -.4db

20hz 0db

 

Again, you would want to keep the EQ under the reference line like this to avoid clipping.  You can add a little more bass if it suites you, but the region should be pretty good.  Remember this is using the grey foam tips inserted deeply.  It adds the necessary bass without interfering with any other frequencies.

post #1702 of 4666
Thread Starter 

For those of you who are into acoustic music, try out the following track on your Etys guys. I think that with music like this, the Etys are nearly unbeatable. Both my ER4 and HF5 make my RE0, RE-400 and HD650 sound like muddy mess with this track in direct AB comparison. With Etys, everything is so darn crystal clear, clean, detailed and precise with all emotions reproduced perfectly, bringing tears to my eyes. This is the music, where they can showcase the beautiful side of their accuracy, not the ugly side as with a lot of poorly recorded pop music and poorly done, lifeless electronic sounds:

 


Edited by Pianist - 6/13/13 at 6:24pm
post #1703 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

For those of you who are into acoustic music, try out the following track on your Etys guys. I think that with music like this, the Etys are nearly unbeatable. Both my ER4 and HF5 make my RE0, RE-400 and HD650 sound like muddy mess with this track in direct AB comparison. With Etys, everything is so darn crystal clear, clean, detailed and precise with all emotions reproduced perfectly, bringing tears to my eyes. This is the music, where they can showcase the beautiful side of their accuracy, not the ugly side as with a lot of poorly recorded pop music and poorly done, lifeless electronic sounds:

 

 

Excellent.  This is the sort of thing I love the etys for too.  Listen to the slaps on the guitar and how they sound like they're in the room.  It's awesome.  Good song too.

post #1704 of 4666
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnarlsagan View Post

I heard the HE-500 at a meet but I don't remember it very well. How comparable is its FR to the ER4S? 

 

Oh, HE-500 sounds very different from the ER4. The former are a lot less dry and a lot less aggressive and while ER4 has a boost in the presence region, HE-500 has a bit of a dip there. As a result, guitars and saxophones, for example, sound quite a bit more upfront and lively on the ER4, which usually sounds more natural, but sometimes unnaturally aggressive IMO. Bass performance is similar - both are extremely articulate and resolving in the low end - although down in the sub bass, HE-500 takes the lead with better extension and a more visceral feel due to the much larger drivers and over the ear design. I think HE-500 does have more potential and scales better with higher quality sources and amps. I believe that HE-500's huge, powerful planar driver is a naturally superior design to ER4's tiny, closed armature drivers with limited bandwidth. In direct AB comparison with HE-500, I can't help but get the feeling that while ER4 sounds great, it also really tries hard to reproduce the lows and highs properly, compressing the dynamics a bit and producing unnecessary aggression, whereas HE-500 easily reproduces the full range without breaking a sweat - smoothly, calmly and with full dynamics.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by luisdent View Post

 

Excellent.  This is the sort of thing I love the etys for too.  Listen to the slaps on the guitar and how they sound like they're in the room.  It's awesome.  Good song too.

 

beerchug.gif I really liked that last track you posted too, although that kind of bass is really meant to be heard through high end speakers with subs that are flat down to 20 Hz IMO.


Edited by Pianist - 6/13/13 at 7:47pm
post #1705 of 4666
I agree, the HE-500s are a warm and addicting listen. Completely different than Etys and IEM vs over ear advantages, but I have to disagree on one point, the Etys scale ridiculously well when plugged in to higher end home systems.
post #1706 of 4666

Here's a few songs that I love using a reference material that sound great in the er4s, especially with proper bass adjustment..

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH72Rq1dIVA (the whole album!!!) But particularly freedom at midnight.  Especially around 3:04 oh my gosh!  Eargasm...  Although youtube really brings it down a notch :-/

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IsiU4QnJjw

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzyT18t0AyQ (favorite song of all time)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQeqmNbA2Hs

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpvT2Ho4JU8

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nW9Cu6GYqxo

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnJHqjJ9g3s (horrible on youtube though :-/ )

post #1707 of 4666
Anyone ever try Sony MDR EX800ST, how it compare to ER4P?
I own ER4P, Fitear F111 and planning to purchase EX800ST or alternate to CD900ST.
post #1708 of 4666

I'm having second thoughts about getting the ER4 with the custom fit option. Thoughts?

 

http://rinchoi.blogspot.gr/2013/05/etymotic-research-customfit-ear-sleeves.html

 

-sheldon

post #1709 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheldonkreger View Post

I'm having second thoughts about getting the ER4 with the custom fit option. Thoughts?

 

http://rinchoi.blogspot.gr/2013/05/etymotic-research-customfit-ear-sleeves.html

 

-sheldon

 

 

I had tried custom ear mold with ER4 and while more comfortable than stock triple flange tips, I like the sound with the triple flange more and didn't use it.  It is an inexpensive ear mold done by a local audiologist who also make earplugs for musicians and travelers (for use on plane) so I'm not sure how the ACS ones would fare.  I think the sound with the ear mold is akin to if I didn't have a good seal with an iem - lack of bass extension and sibilance for treble.  YMMV

post #1710 of 4666
I've had luck with Shure Olive tips. Otherwise, I would have gone custom. Nothing else worked.

I agree with the previous post. I would only go ACS if I couldn't get a consistent seal.
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