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post #19936 of 24909

I'm having a bit of trouble deciding on which set of headphones to go for. I've been using the HD555 for around 4 years now and they have served me well. I'm looking at either the X1's, Q701s, or K701's if they are worth the extra money. All I have right now is an on board soundcard PC and wonder, for cs:go (positional footsteps) and music (all over the place with a bit of bass), if I should grab a soundcard or if a desktop amp would be my go to thing?

post #19937 of 24909

Hi, I just installed the driver software for Xonar U3, My understanding is that when the input is 2.0 or 5.1 , we can use Dolby pro logic IIx combined with Dolby Headphone, to create virtual 7.1. But I noticed in the driver software that Pro Logic IIx becomes available only when the input is set to 2.0 channels . when I set the input to 5.1(6) Pro Logic IIx disappears. why ?

 

 

 

Another question: If we set the input channels to 7.1(8), turn on Dolby Headphone and 7.1 Virtual Speaker Shifter and then the games we play could output 2.0/5.1/7.1 , is it guaranteed that we get virtual 7.1 at all times ? no matter what the game outputs ? When the input is 7.1(8) Does the driver software detect how many channels are being outputted by the game(could be 2.0/5.1/7.1)( does the driver treat the signal as 7.1(8) or what is actually being outputted by the game[could be 2.0/5.1/7.1]) and does it automatically use pro logic IIx, if the game output is 2.0/5.1 ? or does it treat it as 7.1 input and pro logic IIx is bypassed ?


Edited by Sam21 - 1/11/14 at 12:18pm
post #19938 of 24909

Hello everyone, I'll be buying my first audiophile grade headphones and I need advice.

I narrowed my options down to the X1 and the MA900. They are at a similar price range where I'm getting them from since I have to import them. I'll be getting either a Soundblaster Z or a Xonar DG(X) with them. I'll mostly be using it for gaming (%50), movies and music (%25 and %25 each). I listen to a very wide range of music and while I enjoy a good amount of bass, I wouldn't consider myself a basshead. I like to have good directional audio as I play FPS games quite often however I'm also into single player RPG games so immersion is a big factor as well.

Additional notes: MA900's build quality is a bit of a put off for me but if they are as comfortable as everybody claims they are then that's a fair compromise. X1's look really sexy however the non-replaceable ear pads  concern me as I don't know how long they're going to last.

So which headphone would be the best for me?


Edited by denois - 1/11/14 at 2:43pm
post #19939 of 24909

So I just got the Beyerdynamic 990 Pro's and Im wanting to use them for some late night blu-ray movie viewing (some gaming too) mainly with the PS3 and was wondering what would be the best route in providing them with virtual surround for blu-rays?! Was debating between the 2013 Mixamp Pro or the Creative Sound Blaster Recon3D USB, any input appreciated especially with some running a similar setup.

post #19940 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam21 View Post

Hi, I just installed the driver software for Xonar U3, My understanding is that when the input is 2.0 or 5.1 , we can use Dolby pro logic IIx combined with Dolby Headphone, to create virtual 7.1. But I noticed in the driver software that Pro Logic IIx becomes available only when the input is set to 2.0 channels . when I set the input to 5.1(6) Pro Logic IIx disappears. why ?



Another question: If we set the input channels to 7.1(8), turn on Dolby Headphone and 7.1 Virtual Speaker Shifter and then the games we play could output 2.0/5.1/7.1 , is it guaranteed that we get virtual 7.1 at all times ? no matter what the game outputs ? When the input is 7.1(8) Does the driver software detect how many channels are being outputted by the game(could be 2.0/5.1/7.1)( does the driver treat the signal as 7.1(8) or what is actually being outputted by the game[could be 2.0/5.1/7.1]) and does it automatically use pro logic IIx, if the game output is 2.0/5.1 ? or does it treat it as 7.1 input and pro logic IIx is bypassed ?

Does the number of channels matter when you select DH?
I was under the impression it didn't (on PC, in the U3 software)
post #19941 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by conquerator2 View Post


Does the number of channels matter when you select DH?
I was under the impression it didn't (on PC, in the U3 software)

Not all games output 7.1, DH can turn 7.1 and 5.1 into virtual 7.1 and 5.1 respectively , My guess is that if you want to get virtual 7.1 regardless of what the game outputs, then you have to have the option to turn Pro Logic IIx on, which turns 5.1 into 7.1 and then feeds it into DH.'

 

I have had a corsair vengeance 1500, and the driver software on it was as i described above, On U3 only when you set the input to 2.0 does the pro logic IIx appear as an option.

 

 

I want someone who has proper knowledge of this to explain it to us...


Edited by Sam21 - 1/11/14 at 3:27pm
post #19942 of 24909

Pro Logic IIx sole purpose in life is to take a 2ch source and turn it into virtual surround.

 

Dolby Headphone on the other hand needs a minimum 5.1 Dolby Digital source to create surround.

 

If you have a 2ch source, the best you can have for surround is PL IIx.

 

Dolby Headphone > Pro Logic IIx

post #19943 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by rc10mike View Post
 

Pro Logic IIx sole purpose in life is to take a 2ch source and turn it into virtual surround.

 

Dolby Headphone on the other hand needs a minimum 5.1 Dolby Digital source to create surround.

 

If you have a 2ch source, the best you can have for surround is PL IIx.

 

Dolby Headphone > Pro Logic IIx

 

Actually, that's not quite correct.

 

Pro logic's sole purpose is to expand a 2 channel signal into a multi-channel signal.  Pro Logic by itself has nothing to do with virtual surround sound (since virtual surround is 2 channels).

 

It's only when you combine Pro Logic's expanded multi-channel signal WITH Dolby Heapdhone that you get virtual surround.  Dolby Headphone needs a multi-channel source, so Pro Logic expands a 2 channel source into multi-channel so Dolby Headphone has something to work with.


Edited by chicolom - 1/11/14 at 9:04pm
post #19944 of 24909
Thread Starter 
You're not supposed to even bother with the 7.1 virtual speaker shift crap.

If you have the U3:

Configure speakers to 7.1 in the sound device option (speaker icon on taskbar), in the u3 software, make sure you check dolby headphone and make sure its dh2. Thats all you need to do for DH. Setting to outout DH to another device however means messing with the digital output box.
post #19945 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicolom View Post
 

 

Don't worry about the frequency response specs.

 

The "aux input" on the DSS is not for mics, it's for analog input signals (like an mp3 player).  AFAIK the only way to use a mic with the DSS is through the USB input, but I don't know how that works exactly as your headset has to be a USB headset similar to the Turtle Beach ones.

 

The reason I specifically recommended the DSS version 1, is because the DSS 1 uses Dolby Headphone which is a proven surround sound DSP.  The DSS 2 dropped Dolby Headphone support and went with a less popular DSP called "Cirrus Logic" surround.  I haven't heard it, but from I reports I've read on it Dolby Headphone from the version1 is the better DSP.

 

 

It's a PC350, which is a closed PC360, which is like a Sennheiser HD5x5.  The closed sennheisers (like PC350) have a smaller muddier soundstage than they're open counterparts. 

 

I think by design most boom mics should pick up less up noise desktop mics.

http://www.head-fi.org/t/534479/mad-lust-envys-headphone-gaming-guide-updated-1-9-2014-shure-srh1840-added/19080#post_10075559


Thanks,

 

just for my layman knowledge, what would the difference in terms of surround, soundstage and pinpointing be between these 2 configs:

 

1.- Just the Senn HD 598 from a powered source (for example, I guess a PC would do)

 

2.- The Senn HD 598 + DSS1 from the PS4, assuming the DSS1 performs as an amplifier and as a DH 7.1 surround (did I well understand?)

 

I mean, would the Senn by itself have a decent "surround"? If so, what does the 7.1 DSS1 add? Does it turn 2 channels into 7 virtual ones (+subwoofer), then improving surround in what what terms? Or what is the "gain" I will have thanks to the DSS1?

 

And another doubt: do you think moving from a Senn RS 160 to a Senn HD 598(+DSS1) is quality worth it?

 

Thks

post #19946 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicolom View Post
 

 

Actually, that's not quite correct.

 

Pro logic's sole purpose is to expand a 2 channel signal into a multi-channel signal.  Pro Logic by itself has nothing to do with virtual surround sound (since virtual surround is 2 channels).

 

It's only when you combine Pro Logic's expanded multi-channel signal WITH Dolby Heapdhone that you get virtual surround.  Dolby Headphone needs a multi-channel source, so Pro Logic expands a 2 channel source into multi-channel so Dolby Headphone has something to work with.


It is actually correct. Pro Logic takes two channels and makes surround. Since true surround is made from discrete channels, Pro Logic is essentially making virtual surround, or should I say "simulated surround".


Edited by rc10mike - 1/11/14 at 10:03pm
post #19947 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecjcc View Post
 


Thanks,

 

just for my layman knowledge, what would the difference in terms of surround, soundstage and pinpointing be between these 2 configs:

 

1.- Just the Senn HD 598 from a powered source (for example, I guess a PC would do)

 

2.- The Senn HD 598 + DSS1 from the PS4, assuming the DSS1 performs as an amplifier and as a DH 7.1 surround (did I well understand?)

 

I mean, would the Senn by itself have a decent "surround"? If so, what does the 7.1 DSS1 add? Does it turn 2 channels into 7 virtual ones (+subwoofer), then improving surround in what what terms? Or what is the "gain" I will have thanks to the DSS1?

 

And another doubt: do you think moving from a Senn RS 160 to a Senn HD 598(+DSS1) is quality worth it?

 

Thks


With the DDS1, you will have have simulated 5.1 surround (not 7.1) sound with your 598s. Without the DSS1, you will only have stereo sound. You will not have 7.1 because an optical connection is only capable of 5.1.


Edited by rc10mike - 1/11/14 at 10:09pm
post #19948 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by rc10mike View Post
 


It is actually correct. Pro Logic takes two channels and makes surround. Since true surround is made from discrete channels, Pro Logic is essentially making virtual surround.

 

But Pro Logic DOES produce discrete channels.  So it is real multi-channel surround sound.  It might not be accurate positional-wise, but it is multi-channel (discrete) surround.  There's nothing virtual about that.

 

Actual virtual surround sound would be 2 channels + HTRFs (meaning it's simulating multi-channel surround from multiple speakers).


Edited by chicolom - 1/11/14 at 10:11pm
post #19949 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecjcc View Post
 


Thanks,

 

just for my layman knowledge, what would the difference in terms of surround, soundstage and pinpointing be between these 2 configs:

 

1.- Just the Senn HD 598 from a powered source (for example, I guess a PC would do)

 

2.- The Senn HD 598 + DSS1 from the PS4, assuming the DSS1 performs as an amplifier and as a DH 7.1 surround (did I well understand?)

 

I mean, would the Senn by itself have a decent "surround"? If so, what does the 7.1 DSS1 add? Does it turn 2 channels into 7 virtual ones (+subwoofer), then improving surround in what what terms? Or what is the "gain" I will have thanks to the DSS1?

 

And another doubt: do you think moving from a Senn RS 160 to a Senn HD 598(+DSS1) is quality worth it?

 

Thks

 

 

The HD598 doesn't have any "surround" by itself, it just has a good soundstage - which will let it take advantage of virtual surround sound.

 

It sounds like you're a little confused about what virtual surround sound is and how it works, so I'd recommend reading this:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/646786/evshrugs-if-i-knew-then-what-i-know-now-discussion-journal#post_9067400

 

I don't know much about the RS 160 unfortunately.


Edited by chicolom - 1/11/14 at 11:02pm
post #19950 of 24909
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicolom View Post
 

 

But Pro Logic DOES produce discrete channels.  So it is real multi-channel surround sound.  It might not be accurate positional-wise, but it is multi-channel (discrete) surround.  There's nothing virtual about that.

 

Actual virtual surround sound would be 2 channels + HTRFs (meaning it's simulating multi-channel surround from multiple speakers).


My point is Pro Logic processed surround made from a 2ch source will not be as good as a true 5.1 source being processed into Dolby Headphone. Think of it like trying to turn a 96kb MP3 into a 320kb MP3. You can do it, but the end result is still a 96kb MP3.

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